Scotrail - Post Covid Consultation - Service Reductions

[Deltic1961]

Same with late services. Last train from Aberdeen to Inverurie 22:50 Friday and Saturday. They'd make a fortune with a later one, but the train service is totally inflexible so it's better to get the bus in (or drive and leave the car in town) and get a taxi back making the train service useless. Would love to use it more but .........

 

[Falcon1200]

And still no improvement to Cathcart services.. down to 1tph in the evenings and no direct service to the west of the circle other than a few peak services.

I agree. Scotrail are saying that peak commuting will not return to its former level so instead they are focussing more on leisure travel. Fair enough, but IMHO that would be best served by maintaining a regular pattern of service throughout the day, instead of chopping odd trains in the peak, leading for example to no Neilston-Glasgow service between 0824 and 0905 (as the 0841 has been axed), and going hourly in the evening. Simply run the half-hourly pattern all day, easier for everyone.

 

[numtot12345]

Same with late services. Last train from Aberdeen to Inverurie 22:50 Friday and Saturday. They'd make a fortune with a later one, but the train service is totally inflexible so it's better to get the bus in (or drive and leave the car in town) and get a taxi back making the train service useless. Would love to use it

Similarly in Glasgow, virtually nothing after midnight out of Central. Came back from Edinburgh on Saturday night, around 11.45ish into Queen Street. Quick walk over to Central however nothing on Neilston/Cathcart Circle. I was vaguely aware this would be the case, however just checked in case there was a train that could get me somewhat closer to Cathcart. Pre-Covid I'm pretty sure there would have been a service I could got.

This means to get home you either have a long wait in the Abattoir of Hope (the Gordon Street taxi rank...to it's credit, it does move relatively quickly given the numbers of folk...), or hope for the best on a First Bus turn up on Union Street (unfortunately having the Passenger Timing Screens doesn't make the buses any quicker or reliable..!)

My observation is that stopping the rail services at the time they do in the evening leaves hundreds aimlessly wondering about, inebriated, trying to find a way home. OK - yes, they should check timetables in advance of the night out. However as others have said, the Taxi Drivers will be rubbing their hands with this. First Bus not much better given low frequency of their services at that time I noticed, and not taking advantage of it.

I'm not asking for rail services to run through the night, just a final service between 0000-0100 to pick up the folks coming out the pub as otherwise it's a long, cold and unreliable or expensive wait to get back home.

 

[hexagon789]

Pre-Covid I'm pretty sure there would have been a service I could got

In 2019, the last service to Cathcart was 2315 (Cathcart Circle) Mon-Fri with the addition of an 0005 (Neilston) and an 0020 (Cathcart Circle) on Saturday mornings.

 

[Bald Rick]

I'm not asking for rail services to run through the night, just a final service between 0000-0100 to pick up the folks coming out the pub as otherwise it's a long, cold and unreliable or expensive wait to get back home.

surely the answer is to leave the pub in time for the last train…

 

[Peter0124]

I agree that Friday night services gotta come back, 0006 to Motherwell was a handy train :/

 

[ABB125]

surely the answer is to leave the pub in time for the last train…

Or the first one the following morning!

 

[eoff]

I was planning to get a couple of trains on Monday but the service was one per hour (Borders line) so I changed my plans and didn't go.

 

[daodao]

In 2019, the last service to Cathcart was 2315 (Cathcart Circle) Mon-Fri with the addition of an 0005 (Neilston) and an 0020 (Cathcart Circle) on Saturday mornings.

Most of the inner suburban services around Glasgow ran at least every 30 minutes pre-Covid. Reducing such relatively short distance services to hourly makes them unattractive when there are alternative bus services. This will not be viable in the longer-term. If a better frequency is not restored in due course, consideration will need to be given to closing such lines (or the local stations on them if they are main lines), as they will be a financial drain, or alternatively converting them to light rail (e.g. as done in Manchester with Metrolink). The same applies to similar services (not currently Metrolink) around Manchester.

 

[GordonT]

Most of the inner suburban services around Glasgow ran at least every 30 minutes pre-Covid. Reducing such relatively short distance services to hourly makes them unattractive when there are alternative bus services. This will not be viable in the longer-term. If a better frequency is not restored in due course, consideration will need to be given to closing such lines (or the local stations on them if they are main lines), as they will be a financial drain, or alternatively converting them to light rail (e.g. as done in Manchester with Metrolink). The same applies to similar services (not currently Metrolink) around Manchester.

I wonder if we are starting to see the re-emergence of deliberately reducing services to an unattractive level to strengthen the case for wholesale withdrawals.

 

[alangla]

You do wonder whether someone should perhaps have been bold enough to shut the stations between QS HL and Anniesland. The whole route is such a basket case that IIRC, even in normal times, it would have been cheaper to pay for taxis rather than running trains. It’s now hourly and will no doubt still be the first to be cancelled during disruption.

The “service” on the western side of the Cathcart Circle is just unforgivable. Those lines should easily be able to support 2x3 cars per hour all day.

I notice that in the response to consultation, ScotRail are still sticking to this “seat miles empty” nonsense. If one insists on running, for example, off peak local services in Coatbridge, Airdrie and the East end of Glasgow by running 6 car sets from Edinburgh then obviously that figure is going to be high. Same with the number of 7 car units shuttling fresh air to & from Ayr late at night. If one was a conspiracy theorist, one might suspect that having trains formed of coupled sets at obviously quiet times would be a good way to make them seem under used.

I also note that the response mentions the very large number of submissions from the public, but the individual sections that I’ve read (mainly SPT-land, I’ve not read it all) appear to suggest that the number of replies they got was very small in relation to the number travelling. Which is it?

 

[Jordan1296]

Same with late services. Last train from Aberdeen to Inverurie 22:50 Friday and Saturday. They'd make a fortune with a later one, but the train service is totally inflexible so it's better to get the bus in (or drive and leave the car in town) and get a taxi back making the train service useless. Would love to use it more but .........

Even the 2250, certainly on a Friday & Saturday night, is busy. When you consider the last buses to Dyce, Kintore & Inverurie depart the city centre at 2320, I would imagine there would be demand for a train at, say, 2330.

 

[hexagon789]

The “service” on the western side of the Cathcart Circle is just unforgivable. Those lines should easily be able to support 2x3 cars per hour all day.

The Western side never would in my experience, as my local line for 14 years - I don't ever recall seeing enough passengers off-peak to fill even a single 314 and frequently you could fit everyone quite comfortably in a single coach. On Sundays, we're talking single figure passengers most of the year.

 

[alangla]

The Western side never would in my experience, as my local line for 14 years - I don't ever recall seeing enough passengers off-peak to fill even a single 314 and frequently you could fit everyone quite comfortably in a single coach. On Sundays, we're talking single figure passengers most of the year.

That’s still not bad for an off peak service. I’d suggest that anything less than that isn’t really a usable service, so you’re into the realms of whether to keep at least 2 an hour and try to stimulate demand or kill it, either off peak or entirely.

 

[Deltic1961]

Even the 2250, certainly on a Friday & Saturday night, is busy. When you consider the last buses to Dyce, Kintore & Inverurie depart the city centre at 2320, I would imagine there would be demand for a train at, say, 2330.

Been saying this for years. Re. the comments above from Gordon T, that's exactly what First Aberdeen did with the late night bus service. They repeatedly messed with the routes and timetable deliberately so it put people off using the service then blamed lack of use for it's demise. Classic Firstgroup that, and people haven't forgotten.

 

[Blindtraveler]

The first minister's stout defence of this death of a thousand cuts situation at fmqs in holyrood today leaves me drawing the conclusion that doctor beeching is is indeed still alive and well and now has ginger hair.

The question was asked more than once why if they are trying to encourage people to drive less and public transport more they are bringing about such swingeing cuts to the timetable.

 

[Deltic1961]

And once we have "women only" carraiges (as mooted by Jenny Gilruth earlier today) that'll make things far once. Will be mental on football days, well if football isn't banned by then.

Maybe wouldn't be an issue if BTP were more visible. I have seen them on one journey out of the thousands I've been on.

Trains should be safe for everyone, not just women.

Lunatics running the asylum.

 

[Scotrail12]

On a Glasgow-Edinburgh via Falkirk High at the moment and they always feel quite busy these days even though it's off-peak. Are they ever going back to 4tph?

 

[hexagon789]

On a Glasgow-Edinburgh via Falkirk High at the moment and they always feel quite busy these days even though it's off-peak. Are they ever going back to 4tph?

Not in the short term

 

[Blindtraveler]

I predict a frequency increase on this route by August, even if it's only temporary