Season ticket refund - southern trains

Status
Not open for further replies.

SabrinaL

New Member
Joined
19 Jun 2012
Messages
3
Hi all

I hope you can help!

I have an annual Three Bridges to London Z1 - 6 season ticket which started on 30th April this year. The cost was £3776.

I'm pregnant and want to get a refund when I go on maternity leave on either the 6th Aug or 3rd Sept but am struggling to work out what I would get back.

Can anyone help?

Thanks

S
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

bb21

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Global Moderator
Joined
4 Feb 2010
Messages
23,879
You will have used 3 months 8 days of your season ticket if you hand it in for refund on 6th August. Had you purchased a season for 3 months 8 days instead when you purchased your annual season ticket, the cost would have been £1184.80. Therefore you're due back £2591.20, less an administration fee of £10.

Similarly if you hand it in for refund on 3rd September, you will have used 4 months 5 days of your season, which would have cost you £1510.40 if purchased originally instead. This gives you a refund of £2265.60, less an administration fee of £10.
 

hairyhandedfool

Established Member
Joined
14 Apr 2008
Messages
8,837
As bb21 says, the company you bought it from should offer you the difference in cost between the season ticket you bought and one that would cover the period already used, minus an admin fee (normally £10). You should hand the ticket in for refund as soon as you have finished using it as any delay could reduce the value you get back.
 

MikeWh

Established Member
Associate Staff
Senior Fares Advisor
Joined
15 Jun 2010
Messages
6,243
Location
Crayford
On a mobile so can't do any research, but you might get more if you exchange it for an annual from three bridges to crawley or gatwick.
 

Paul Kelly

Established Member
Joined
16 Apr 2010
Messages
3,683
Location
Reading
On a mobile so can't do any research, but you might get more if you exchange it for an annual from three bridges to crawley or gatwick.

Here's an attempt at a calculation.
Three Bridges to London Zones 1-6 annual season costs £3,776.
Three Bridges to Crawley annual season costs £516.

The difference between the two is 3776-516= £3,260

If you exchange a season for a cheaper one, you are due a refund of the difference, calculated pro-rata to the number of remaining days of validity. This is different from the simple refund calculation, which isn't done pro-rata and is based instead on the cost had you bought the shorter period season on the first place.

So, pro-rata calculations:

Start of validity 30 April 2012
Valid for 365 days (no 29 February within validity period)

If handed in on 6th August, 99 days will have been used.
So,
365-99 = 266 days refunded

266/365 * 3260 = £2,375.70 refunded (no admin fee)

If handed in on 3rd September, 127 days will have been used.
So,
365-127 = 238 days

238/365 * 3260 = £2,125.60 refunded (no admin fee)

So, if the advantage of retaining an Annual Gold Card (34% off all fares after 10am with no minimum fare, and all day weekends) is not attractive to you, in this case then it is better to go for the straight refund. In general, the nearer a season is to the end of its period of validity, the more likely it is to be better value to change over to a really cheap season than to get a straight refund. In this case we are no more than approx. a third of the way through the validity period, and the refund is working out better value.
 

MikeWh

Established Member
Associate Staff
Senior Fares Advisor
Joined
15 Jun 2010
Messages
6,243
Location
Crayford
Cheers Indigo2. I chose Crawley or Gatwick as places you might conceivably travel to which would then be free. I'd actually forgotten about the Gold card discount. If that is still a little worthwhile then you could instead exchange it for a ticket to Ryde - A Ryde Esplanade to Ryde St Johns Road annual season costs just £148 and would tip the balance just in favour of the swap.

New difference: £3776 - £148 = £3628
99 day exchange: 266/365 * 3628 = £2,644.00 refunded (no admin fee)
127 day exchange: 238/365 * 3628 = £2,365.70 refunded (no admin fee)

It doesn't matter that you'll probably never use the Island Line, it's still a Network area Gold card which will give you the discount on off-peak fares. In fact over 100 of these tickets are sold each year and they rarely if ever see them on the island.
 

barrykas

Established Member
Joined
19 Sep 2006
Messages
1,579
Nice try, but your calculations are wrong. ;)

Original ticket: Three Bridges - London Zones 1-6 Valid 30/04/12 to 29/04/13 costing £3776.00
Annual Ryde Esplanade - Ryde St Johns Road for same period: £148.00

Base rate for existing ticket: £3776 / 365 = £10.35
Base rate for new ticket: £148 / 365 = £0.41

Number of days from 06/08/12 - 29/04/13: 267
Number of days from 03/09/12 - 29/04/13: 239

For a change-over from 06/08/12:

Credit due on original ticket: £10.35 * 267 = £2763.45
Charge for new ticket: £0.41 * 267 = £109.47
Balance to be refunded: £2763.45 - £109.47 = £2653.96

For a change-over from 03/09/12:

Credit due on original ticket: £10.35 * 239 = £2473.65
Charge for new ticket: £0.41 * 239 = £97.99
Balance to be refunded: £2473.65 - £97.99 = £2375.66

Cheers,

Barry
 

Paul Kelly

Established Member
Joined
16 Apr 2010
Messages
3,683
Location
Reading
Surely that's the same thing except that you are including 6th August and/or 3rd September in the period after the changeover, so the total number of days to be refunded is one higher than I calculated. For consistency with bb21's refund calculations I was assuming that if the season was *handed in* on those days, then the refunded period would start from the following day.

With that in mind, then the discrepancy between the two methods of calculation is less than 7p - working out separate daily rates for the two seasons seems to me to be a bit of extra work and it makes the calculation less precise (although a few pence in favour of the customer, in this case) - but if that's the officially recommended method than I suppose it's what needs to be used.

IMHO it is more complicated than it needs to be though; only the difference between the two prices really needs to be calculated.

Update: Just thinking about it, the new season does need to show a price on it, so I suppose that's why it officially needs to be calculated the way barrykas is showing.
 
Last edited:

bb21

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Global Moderator
Joined
4 Feb 2010
Messages
23,879
I can only guess that the procedures were written before calculators were invented, hence all the rounding and errors accumulated. ;)
 

barrykas

Established Member
Joined
19 Sep 2006
Messages
1,579
It gets worse if the original ticket isn't an Annual! In that case, a month is defined as lasting 30 days, regardless of how many days long it actually is! Similarly, a year is always 365 days, even in a leap year.

And if you subsequently request a refund, the change-over has to be recalculated based on the new expiry date.

Cheers,

Barry
 

34D

Established Member
Joined
9 Feb 2011
Messages
6,032
Location
Yorkshire
Dear all

Thank you for your really helpful and informative replies!!

S

Few other points - did the season come from your employer (perhaps as a season ticket loan)? If so you may need to comply with their policy.

Will you ever travel to anywhere by train during the 8 months after you surrender? Perhaps London occasionally? If so, then one of the season tickets near you could be an option - if you get the three bridges-gatwick ticket then on trips to London you'll only need to buy Gatwick-London (on which you'll get a third off).

If you'll never go near a train, then Ryde or Newhaven (I forget which is cheapest) is better than a straight refund.

My little boy (now aged 2) loves looking at (and riding on) trains and buses - had him on the underground at two weeks old - but maybe don't try it on your own the first time!

Finally, First Capital Connect (and I think Southern) and also TfL will all give you some kind of "baby on board" badge to wear (to hopefully encourage others to give up their seat for you).

Also FCC (and maybe southern) do a "free first class upgrade for expectant mums" which let's you sit in First if standard is full.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top