Smart Ticket Option by 2018?

[LNW-GW Joint]

Just noticed this speech today by Chris Grayling: https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/we-put-the-travelling-public-first

I want commuters around the country to have access to smart season tickets – without the risk of an expensive season ticket getting torn, wet, lost or damaged.
I want a season ticket that is intelligent, and opens up better and targeted information to regular travellers – for example, letting them know if their preferred train is running late.
I want a simple system to buy a ticket on your mobile phone, that removes the need to queue up and that can be bought in the comfort of a passenger’s home, on the bus, or while they are having a coffee at the station
There’s some good development work happening around the industry.
A lot of it by innovators here tonight.
But it’s taking far too long.
I am keen to see more progress and results for passenger in the next 2 years.
By the end of 2018, my aim is for every passenger to have the choice of travelling without a paper ticket

He also wants automatic compensation for delays of 15 minutes or more, starting with GTR and the next franchises to be let (SW, WM, SE).
Oh, and simplify the fares system:

As a first step, he [the rail minister] is working with the industry and with Which? to develop an action plan to drive improvements in the near term

Does he stand any chance of achieving any of this?

 

[WatcherZero]

They are just adding a new band of compensation, was 50% for 30 minutes late, 100% single fare for 60+ and 100% return fare for 2hrs, now will also be 25% for 15-29m late.

Its also not NO paper tickets, its everyone to have an option of no ticket which pretty much every operator does already with e-tickets or apps.

 

[Hadders]

Oh, and simplify the fares system

Best prepare for an increase in fares then.

 

[Haywain]

Its also not NO paper tickets, its everyone to have an option of no ticket which pretty much every operator does already with e-tickets or apps.

I think that it is currently far from every operator, and even further from every passenger. Even those TOCs who offer smart ticketing are only able to offer to a relatively small subset of their season ticket holders, in most cases.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Don't forget that Arriva rolled out mobile ticketing to their entire bus network in one go, using a system verified by the Mk1 eyeball. It's not as big a challenge as might be thought.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Don't forget that Arriva rolled out mobile ticketing to their entire bus network in one go, using a system verified by the Mk1 eyeball. It's not as big a challenge as might be thought.

So the ticket I usually buy as a paper ticket to travel to London from Chester will pass muster electronically on AW, VT, LM, XC, CH and GW on the permitted routes will it?
And I have a Windows phone, none of this Apple/Android stuff please.

 

[PeterC]

By the end of 2018, my aim is for every passenger to have the choice of travelling without a paper ticket

My emphasis - not quite what the title of the thread implies.

 

[swt_passenger]

Has anyone yet produced a foolproof way of preventing re-use during an electronic Anytime or Off-peak Return's month long return portion validity?

An advance fare is easy in comparison.

So are we looking at ticket barriers 24/7 at every station in the land, or what?

 

[JonathanH]

Has anyone yet produced a foolproof way of preventing re-use during an electronic Anytime or Off-peak Return's month long return portion validity?

An advance fare is easy in comparison.

So are we looking at ticket barriers 24/7 at every station in the land, or what?

Ticket barriers 24/7 at those stations with them fitted is a likely development in the next few years. It is what Southern are meant to be doing by moving staff out from ticket offices and changing their hours. However, clearly, there are loads of stations where they are not going to be fitted any time soon.

 

[dk1]

New staff Greater Anglia passes will arrive within 4 weeks & will all be Smart cards thank goodness. Current ones are a pain.

 

[tsr]

New staff Greater Anglia passes will arrive within 4 weeks & will all be Smart cards thank goodness. Current ones are a pain.

At certain TOCs you get issued with both types, and the smartcard ones are usually infinitely better, whatever you may say about the public version. The only trouble is that on additional networks which you can use with it, but which don't have smartcards (in some cases other than Oyster/contactless), you get VERY strange looks when showing it during a ticket check, even though it's equally valid!

But if they insist on sending out the magnetic strip ones with a horrible big sticky glue dot on the back where they're attached to the letter, they're not going to persuade many people to try putting them through barriers, and by extension have them handy at all!

 

[iknowyeah]

Has anyone yet produced a foolproof way of preventing re-use during an electronic Anytime or Off-peak Return's month long return portion validity?

An advance fare is easy in comparison.

So are we looking at ticket barriers 24/7 at every station in the land, or what?

I thought once passengers activated the return portion of the ticket, than it is only valid until end of service that day

 

[b0b]

I thought once passengers activated the return portion of the ticket, than it is only valid until end of service that day

that can't be right, that means passengers have less rights by having an electronic ticket?

if they were fancy, they could let a member of staff "stamp" the return with their ID & station code so on subsequent inspection, the return "history" could be shown.

 

[HH]

This is not news. Just look at the SWF ITT, for example.

 

[gray1404]

I trust there will be an option to have any ticket on a smart card. I would hate the idea of having to ensure my mobile phone had battery on every journey I make.

 

[thenorthern]

What system does HM Government plan to use as Mobile Tickets are good but at the same time batteries run out and smart phones can run slowly so they aren't always convenient.

I don't think we will see the end of Paper Tickets for a long time as although they aren't the most technically advanced ticketing system they are useful in that you can turn up at a station and buy a ticket without a smart card, printer, mobile phone or anything else for that matter.

 

[gray1404]

I hope though that you are not forced to pay a higher fare unless you use a mobile ticket. I would not mind if it was a cheaper fare for a smart card or contactless payment, but not if you are forced to have to use mticketing for a discount.

I think London Underground/Transport for London have got it right on this one currenltly.

 

[Andrew1395]

London has Oyster and CPay, and there is still the option to pay more and get a paper ticket. Print at home is as likely as smart cards IMHO, so paper will be here for along time yet

 

[johntea]

I use my smartphone for a lot of things these days, battery life is getting better (I have an iPhone 6 Plus), I mean if you have a Samsung your phone might explode whilst trying to show your ticket but still...

Used it for Apple Pay in general (including London Underground usage), Just Eat for food, Arriva bus mobile bus ticketing, Uber taxis etc

Whilst not everybody will be a fan, if you have a decent phone and read the instructions of the relevant apps before trying to use them I find you'll have very few problems!

 

[Chrisgr31]

Whilst many operators have smart cards the problem is they are not mutually acceptable and therefore you will need a multitude of cards on different operators.

Automatic compensation doesnt work either because whilst the barriers will know when I went through where and therefore if I am delayed it knows.

What it cant tell is with cancellations. If my train s cancelled I wont go through the barrier in the first place therefore it wont know I am late.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

There are certainly situations where smartcards are a significant improvement on card+mag stripe but the suggestion that they can somehow provide a universal solution to all the ticket-related customer service issues which currently exist is, AFAIAC, just the current political pipedream for transport. Same as tram-trains were the solution for just about every local train rolling stock problem a few years ago. And that's progressing so well...

Just a politician trying to demonstrate they have "vision" instead of trying to deal with more immediate problems, like will there really be enough compliant rolling stock for 1/1/20.:roll:

 

[class26]

So the ticket I usually buy as a paper ticket to travel to London from Chester will pass muster electronically on AW, VT, LM, XC, CH and GW on the permitted routes will it?
And I have a Windows phone, none of this Apple/Android stuff please.

well i am a Luddite who refuses to use mobile phones, mainly because in the depths of Lincolnshire where I live there is precisely zero signal so no point. Does this mean I can no longer travel by train after 2018 ?

 

[CockneySparrow]

I use my smartphone for a lot of things these days, battery life is getting better (I have an iPhone 6 Plus), I mean if you have a Samsung your phone might explode whilst trying to show your ticket but still...

Heard they will provide a mini pocket sized fire extinguisher lol

 

[najaB]

well i am a Luddite who refuses to use mobile phones, mainly because in the depths of Lincolnshire where I live there is precisely zero signal so no point. Does this mean I can no longer travel by train after 2018 ?

No. If you actually read the article it makes it clear that the intention is to make travel with a non-traditional ticket possible on all routes by 2018, rather than the elimination of paper tickets.

Much as it is still possible to travel in London using paper tickets.

 

[Tio Terry]

Interesting, but some travellers - in particular Business Travellers - need a paper based proof of purchase to be able to reclaim their expenses and the company needs paper based proof of purchase for their company's books.

 

[embers25]

Don't forget that Arriva rolled out mobile ticketing to their entire bus network in one go, using a system verified by the Mk1 eyeball. It's not as big a challenge as might be thought.

They did and talk about not thinking the app through! To use your ticket you HAD to have an internet connection at all times you as it didn't store tickets locally until a very recent upgrade. That is great except, for example, in deepest Surrey where many of their routes have no internet coverage at all on EE or Vodafone and so the ticket was completely useless and the drivers wouldn't let you show them as you got off in Guildford where it would work, you just had to pay again.

Also mobile tickets are great until you battery dies or your phone/app develops a fault then they are useless, again as I've found on Arriva when their app stopped working.

 

[Hellfire]

How is the concept of paperless tickets going to work on corporate accounts. My company insisted we purchase all our rail tickets through their business account with Trainline, so we don't pay ourselves and the company just gets one bill at the end of the month

Several of our buildings have Trainline ticket machines where we can print them out.

There is currently no option of a e ticket or downloading onto a phone on this system so any change is likely to be pretty expensive

 

[najaB]

How is the concept of paperless tickets going to work on corporate accounts.

There is currently no option of a e ticket or downloading onto a phone on this system so any change is likely to be pretty expensive

Again. The minister's proposal is that non-traditional ticketing be *available* on all routes, not mandatory and exclusive.

As to the question of working with corporate accounts, there's no reason that m or e tickets can't be issued to business customers alongside paper tickets.

 

[Class 66's]

If TOCs do implement it, some sort of way of accessing your ticket while online, or having free WiFi at all stations. Not all of us have huge mobile data plans, or even have devices capable of getting mobile data. I have a cheap phone, and then a tablet to cover the smart part.

 

[Bevan Price]

I trust there will be an option to have any ticket on a smart card. I would hate the idea of having to ensure my mobile phone had battery on every journey I make.

And not much use to those of us who choose not to have a smartphone (don't particularly need one, and can think of more interesting uses for my (not limitless) money...)