Storm Eowyn Disruption - 24/1/25

[abr2024]

BESR North of Doncaster on the ECML, expected to be 50mph

 

[Bald Rick]

I'm sure Network Rail are monitoring it hourly

More frequently than that!

Let's face it,no-one is going to climb any sort of real hill in 60 plus gusts. It is not ergonomically possible.

I went up Cairngorm once - relatievly calm at the car park but 60mph at the top. Extremely rough, and never to be repeated. (For those that don’t know, Cairngorm is a rather easy hill to walk up, with no exposure to sharp drops etc).

 

[Pacef8]

So much for those great british rail sale bargains . You will not be able to exchange for a later date at the same price

 

[Wivenswold]

Still subtle differences between the weather models for the Sunday/Monday storm that could be consequential. One options brings us another battering from the Atlantic on Tuesday, another sees the jet stream sink further south reintroducing cold air and the possibility of snow.
I think the whole country will see some extreme weather over the coming 5 days.

These situations are incredibly difficult to forecast even 24 hours ahead. I mention this because I often read comments like "I'm in Preston and it's just a bit windy." or "Another Met Office fail, Amber warning for nothing" not realising that they got lucky and 20 miles up the road has trees down all over the place.

A testing few days ahead for our network and I have nothing but awe for the front line railway staff, the emergency planners, Transport Police and non-railway emergency workers, operations staff, train crews and those tasked to undertake repairs in foul conditions.

 

[generalnerd]

Still subtle differences between the weather models for the Sunday/Monday storm that could be consequential. One options brings us another battering from the Atlantic on Tuesday, another sees the jet stream sink further south reintroducing cold air and the possibility of snow.
I think the whole country will see some extreme weather over the coming 5 days.

These situations are incredibly difficult to forecast even 24 hours ahead. I mention this because I often read comments like "I'm in Preston and it's just a bit windy." or "Another Met Office fail, Amber warning for nothing" not realising that they got lucky and 20 miles up the road has trees down all over the place.

A testing few days ahead for our network and I have nothing but awe for the front line railway staff, the emergency planners, Transport Police and non-railway emergency workers, operations staff, train crews and those tasked to undertake repairs in foul conditions.

Definitely. In my local area we don’t suffer to poorly, but there’s always the odd resident saying that it wasn’t half as bad as they were told, even though somebody’s van was crushed.

 

[Class83]

I'm not sure if the railway has as clear a chart as this, but the Forth Bridges (road) have a table indicating what they do at what wind speed, see link below, the maximum gust forecast at Queensferry is 83mph, which would close the old Forth Bridge, but have the Queensferry Crossing (which has wind shielding) open to cars, unmodified transit vans and single decker buses with a speed limit of 40mph, if gusts exceed 90mph then it's cars only at 30mph. The rail bridge (Forth Bridge) was generally more resilient than the old Forth Road Bridge (trains usually ran even when the Road Bridge was closed), so might be able to operate with a speed limit, but between 1000-1700 would probably be described as interesting.

Forth Bridges Wind & Weather

Real-time wind and weather conditions for the Forth Bridges and information about high wind procedures for the Queensferry Crossing and the Forth Road Bridge.

www.theforthbridges.org

The biggest issue for the railway I see is the Clyde Coast routes being hammered by waves.

 

[Strathclyder]

On a related note, my mum and I just got a red weather warning message (with the uk.gov link at the bottom) about tomorrow's storm on our moblies in the last 10 or so minutes. Not that I wasn't aware of what's coming already, but that to me merely underscores how bad it's gonna get here in the next 48 hours. Wouldn't even consider trying to use public transport tomorrow even if the trains et al were running.

 

[Tetchytyke]

With regard to WMT I read elsewhere that the issue is the Runcorn Bridge specifically

That makes sense as, given the wind direction, it would basically be a 90mph crosswind.

 

[route101]

It would take a significant emergency services response to deal with a train hitting a tree. Those emergency services will be stretched to their limit already so thinning the service, running trains at reduced speeds and cancelling services through the Amber and Red warning areas mitigates that eventuality and will save lives.

It's bad luck when it affects individual plans but extreme weather events are on the rise, particularly in Autumn and Winter, so the possibility of inclement weather affecting a journey should be at the back of everyone's mind if they book advance tickets for train, coach, maritime or air journeys at this time of the year.

Yes, I rarely book short trips or one night trips far in advance now because of this reason. I wait until around 4 to 5 days before, then make a call.

 

[delt1c]

On a related note, my mum and I just got a red weather warning message (with the uk.gov link at the bottom) about tomorrow's storm on our moblies in the last 10 or so minutes. Not that I wasn't aware of what's coming already, but that to me merely underscores how bad it's gonna get here in the next 48 hours. Wouldn't even consider trying to use public transport tomorrow even if the trains et al were running.

Everything cancelled here in Scotland

 

[Strathclyder]

The biggest issue for the railway I see is the Clyde Coast routes being hammered by waves.

Yep, it's these lines south of Paisley & Dalmuir that are gonna get the worst of this I think.

Everything cancelled here in Scotland

Yeah I saw. Most sensible thing to do given what's raging toward us.

 

[Morayshire]

Just checked Scotrails Journeycheck. It is showing 2,184 cancellations of which only 6 are for today.

 

[JGurney]

I'm supposed to be getting the 07:59 from Saltburn to Darlington tomorrow then the 09:00 on to Peterborough, with an hour before the 11:50 to Ipswich.
Northern are not yet saying their part won't run, so I think I'll see if I can get from Darlington onwards on some service. Too late now to go a day early, and there would be no point leaving it until Saturday in my case.

 

[ld0595]

Just got the emergency notification on my phone in the last 10/15 mins. STV news mentioned that some areas may have the second lowest air pressure on record. I would expect significant disruption on Saturday as well given the amber warning is in force until 9pm.

Stay safe out there!

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

Avanti have also given a do not travel for North Wales coast now.

 

[[email protected].]

I have tickets for Friday Newark to Kings Cross just for a day out, LNER are advising "Do not travel", so I assuming I can claim full refund on there tickets.

Whilst down in London I also have a Gatwick \Reading GWR advanced ticket and a Reading\Waterloo Southwestern "Evening out" ticket, would I be able to claim refund on these 2 tickets if both companies are not affected by weather disruption?

My evening return train has been cancelled.

 

[infobleep]

If it's really Network Rail shutting the lines then why, as yet, have Cross Country not said "do not travel" north of Newcastle?

Either way, my point still stands. If the wires come down or a tree blocks the line then yes, issue a "DO NOT TRAVEL" warning. But don't issue one two days in advance based upon what's only a prediction which may turn out to be a lot less disruptive than forecast?

There is now a red warning and it takes time to draw up plans.

Do you think the red warning is too early? Should it only be issued when the winds reach the required speed? I. E. as it happens.

 

[Wandering Pom]

I have tickets for Friday Newark to Kings Cross just for a day out, LNER are advising "Do not travel", so I assuming I can claim full refund on there tickets.

LNER are stating "do not travel north of York". From their website:

If your journey is within the southern part of our route and is wholly south of York [for example, between London King's Cross and Peterborough], please note that trains may still be disrupted and we strong recommend checking for updates before you travel. If you are travelling on this part of the route and you train is no longer running, our normal cancelled train policy applies.

More info on their travel alerts page: https://www.lner.co.uk/travel-information/travelling-now/travel-alerts/

 

[The Middle]

BESR North of Doncaster on the ECML, expected to be 50mph

This isn't correct. All LNE routes north of Sheffield and Doncaster subject to 50mph BSR EXCEPT ECML which will have BSRs put on based on reports from the wind alarms tomorrow

 

[Train Maniac]

Surprisingly enough, the Cambrian Coast line does not appear to be affected, even with winds reaching over 60mph for several hours straight overnight.

 

[perstreperous]

Just got the emergency notification on my phone in the last 10/15 mins. STV news mentioned that some areas may have the second lowest air pressure on record. I would expect significant disruption on Saturday as well given the amber warning is in force until 9pm.

Stay safe out there!

Indeed, we could have the lowest air pressure reading in Scotland since 1982 or possibly even 1884 (!) In fact, the track of this depression is remarkably similar to that of the 1884 and 1982 depressions.

Interesting paper on extreme lows in barometric pressure

 

[PyrahnaRanger]

isn't that what Travel insurance is for?

Yes, although I'd argue that my travel insurance shouldn't be paying for issues caused when I'm at work - on this occasion, I've managed to book a hotel, the extra meals I'll expense as normal, and I'll have an argument later about the extra clothing I'm going to have to buy as this is the one time I didn't fetch spares!

Network Rail have announced that the West Coast Main Line is closed from 03:00 until 22:00 on Friday 24 January and other North West routes are closed until 12:00.

Storm Éowyn: Do not travel advice across most of the North West

People planning rail journeys in the North West of England are being urged not to travel on Friday due to the impacts of Storm Éowyn.

www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk

Thanks - if you hadn't posted this, I'd have been at Euston tomorrow heading for the Cumbrian Coast.

And yet Avanti are still suggesting that if you choose to try and travel, you may be eligible for delay repay... They really need to update the website.

The context of my specific posts in this thread (which I admit is now probably lost in a couple of pages of history) is the case where you've been away from home from several days, your accommodation booking has ended, and you now need to get home. I fully agree with not starting your journey in the first place if you're already at home.

The impression I get from the railway's messaging is "stay away", i.e. don't come to the station at all. If the station is actually open, staff will genuinely help me with trying to find alternative travel options, I can buy food there, and can stay there until the disruption is resolved, then the railway's messaging needs to be looked at. Because at the moment it isn't giving me the impression that I can do any of that.

Avanti's message suggests I could turn up and try to travel. Network Rail's suggests I could. In fact, even TPE are still showed a few trains running Preston-Glasgow tomorrow. If I hadn't seen the NWR message on here, I'd have been at the station trying to get home, not trying to get my hotel to let me stay another night and heading to M&S for some fresh socks...

Yes, that’s exactly what people should do. Or alternatively stay an extra night and travel on Saturday.

That's what I'm aiming to do.

Avanti are yet to mention that the line will be closed and are still 'advising' people not to travel, not that they CAN'T travel.

Big difference.

Absolutely. If I hadn't seen the NWR message, which I only saw as a member of this forum, I'd have been doing my very best to get home to my wife and kids tomorrow. Avanti really ara a talentless excuse for a TOC. I'm sorry if that offends anyone who works there, but some people need to take a good hard look in the mirror and ask if they are really the right person to be managing a TOC.

It's not in the TOC's gift to prevent people leaving their homes. The TOCs where no trains will be running have said so.

Again, sorry to sound like a broken record, but Avanti have only recently updated their advice during the time I've been reading this thread. That's not good messaging or timing.

If Avanti has issued do not travel warnings, I'd automatically assume that there are no trains running anyway and tailor my plans accordingly

Even if the message went on to state:

If you continue with your journey but are delayed by 15 minutes or more, you can claim Delay Repay compensation from the train company you travel with.?

If you live in a rural location with power supplied via a pole system you probably still do.

Yup. Also the reason we have a gas hob, matches and a stovetop kettle on top of the fridge!

What is interesting though is that I've had a poke on the Met Office website to see what's being going on (I've been at a conference all day without my phone or laptop), and the warning colours are a bit simplistic - if you follow through, there's a risk matrix of the likelihood of the event occurring Vs the amount of damage likely to occur if it does happen. On this occasion, the likelihood of it happening is at the lower end of the risk scale, while the damage if it does is very high, hence the amber warning. I didn't find out about this until today, so it's possibly that people haven't understood what is being said when they hear "amber warning" which leads to the belief that previous warnings have been delivered in such a way they've focused on the possible damage rather than the likelihood leading to a false impression that these yellow and amber warnings aren't as serious as they may seem.

 

[matchmaker]

Everything cancelled here in Scotland

About an hour or so ago I saw an Azuma heading south through Stirling. I suspect the down "Highland Chieftain" has been cancelled at Perth and was returning to Craigentinny.

 

[mm333]

It’s just cynical. West Yorkshire and the Calder Valley is right on the edge of the Amber warning and nowhere near the Red warning, but they’ve binned everything off. I really can’t help but think it’s just an excuse.

It’ll take a while for everything to pull through but they’re not running anything between Manchester Victoria and Bradford Interchange. They will run Chester-Manchester Victoria so that might be why they still show in some systems.

I’m sceptical about the reasons as the Calder Valley isn’t in the are expected to be the worst affected.

Grand Central are now diverting 5 services tomorrow away from the Caldervale line and Low Moor, Halifax, Brighouse or Mirfield, so will presumably be going via New Pudsey and either via Woodlesford or Wakefield Westgate to get to Wakefield Kirkgate.

 

[infobleep]

I personally believe customer information staff should be better resourced, but that isn't happening overnight.

Is it happening at all?

 

[Horizon22]

Is it happening at all?

Up for debate I suppose!

 

[800001]

About an hour or so ago I saw an Azuma heading south through Stirling. I suspect the down "Highland Chieftain" has been cancelled at Perth and was returning to Craigentinny.

Yes was preplanned to terminate at Perth since before 11am this morning.
Set ecs back to Craigentinny.

 

[800Travel]

This isn't correct. All LNE routes north of Sheffield and Doncaster subject to 50mph BSR EXCEPT ECML which will have BSRs put on based on reports from the wind alarms tomorrow

BESR - Blanket Emergency Speed Restriction?

BSR - Blanket Speed Restriction?

Are those right?

 

[Winthorpe]

Indeed, we could have the lowest air pressure reading in Scotland since 1982 or possibly even 1884 (!) In fact, the track of this depression is remarkably similar to that of the 1884 and 1982 depressions.

Interesting paper on extreme lows in barometric pressure

Thank you for posting the link to the paper. It is very interesting.

 

[43066]

Yes, although I'd argue that my travel insurance shouldn't be paying for issues caused when I'm at work

You’d hope work would be paying for it, with no questions asked, in that case!