Stratford (Upon Avon) Parkway

[Jollycam]

It's been reported that Stratford Parkway is to open May 2013, 7 months earlier than planned, with work to start next month.

London Midland will also be increasing services with later evening trains planned and 2 trains per hour returning on Saturdays, and an additional hourly weekday train starting Dec 2013.

Story here

Stratford Parkway Station will open seven months early

STRATFORD-UPON-AVON Parkway Station, the controversial new train station in Bishopton, will open seven months early it was announced today (Monday).

The £8.8 million station will now open in May 2013 rather than December 2013, and work is due to begin at the end of September.

The new station - the second in Stratford-upon-Avon - will bring later and more frequent trains on the line between Stratford and Birmingham.

From May, London Midland will be running trains until 11.30pm, rather than 9.30pm, and will also add a second train to every hour on their Saturday services.

Warwickshire County Council’s transport planning department believe there is a great demand in the area for these later evening services.

However, midweek off-peak trains will still not be available from the station until December 2013, when an additional train every hour during the week will also be added.

The announcement about the new opening schedule was made after Buckingham Group Contracting was awarded the design and build contract.

Cllr Peter Butlin, the council’s Portfolio Holder for Highways and Transport, said: “This appointment of the contractor is giant step forward in the development of Stratford Parkway Station, and will mean that we can press ahead and look to open seven months ahead of schedule.

“We are pleased to be able to offer this service to Stratford and the surrounding areas, using the funding awarded to the county council from the Department for Transport last year.”

The council believe the new station will improve accessibility and encourage an increased use of trains for journeys that might otherwise be undertaken by car.

Forecasts suggest that by 2024, there will be 114,000 more rail trips per year coming in and out of Stratford then there currently are.

The new weekday, Saturday, and evening trains are expected to become commercially viable after three years of operation.

 

[mattyb1405]

Would this then have a negative impact on somewhere like Wilmecote - 6 mins only ? from there to Stratford Upon Avon?

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Not especially, Wilmcote is lightly used by locals and tourists on the Shakespeare trail, its numbers may fall but not enough to jeopardise the service the station gets.

The Parkway is designed to get people off the badly congested local roads, it's going to be right next door to an existing park and ride. Stratford upon Avon will still suffer with a relatively poor service though, it could really use a half hourly service to Birmingham all day every day.

 

[Tiny Tim]

In order to get funding for this project there must have been a sound business case, even so, it's surprising that it's happening so soon.

 

[jimm]

Not especially, Wilmcote is lightly used by locals and tourists on the Shakespeare trail, its numbers may fall but not enough to jeopardise the service the station gets.

The Parkway is designed to get people off the badly congested local roads, it's going to be right next door to an existing park and ride. Stratford upon Avon will still suffer with a relatively poor service though, it could really use a half hourly service to Birmingham all day every day.

You say this but LM tried extra Saturday trains - using stock not needed for Birmingham suburbans at the weekend - and then dropped them due to poor results. Irregular intervals in the timetable may not have helped but apart from Stratford itself and Henley-in-Arden there isn't a huge amount of traffic on offer and tourists are far more likely to come up from London than down from Birmingham.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

But it needs the extra trains in the week, not on a Saturday. If they could extend a Dorridge terminator to Stratford it would be great.

 

[jimm]

But it needs the extra trains in the week, not on a Saturday. If they could extend a Dorridge terminator to Stratford it would be great.

A major day out destination doesn't need extra trains on a Saturday? If they didn't work then, why would they work the rest of the week?

I use the line to get in and out of Birmingham off-peak on occasion and apart from trains that college students and schoolchildren use to get in and out of stratford, most of the existing hourly services have dozens of empty seats beyond the Birmingham suburban area. And why go via Dorridge on a route that is already busy and is likely to get even more so?

 

[sonic2009]

The place where the new station will go is right near the existing Park & Ride faicilty for Stratford-Upon-Avon

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=stratford+upon+avon+park+and+ride&hl=en&ll=52.206683,-1.730068&spn=0.001864,0.005284&hnear=Stratford-upon-Avon,+adj+Park+%26+Ride&t=h&z=18

 

[The Planner]

But it needs the extra trains in the week, not on a Saturday. If they could extend a Dorridge terminator to Stratford it would be great.

Im pretty sure that has/was/is looked at you know.

 

[MarkyT]

The place where the new station will go is right near the existing Park & Ride faicilty for Stratford-Upon-Avon

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=stratford+upon+avon+park+and+ride&hl=en&ll=52.206683,-1.730068&spn=0.001864,0.005284&hnear=Stratford-upon-Avon,+adj+Park+%26+Ride&t=h&z=18

Looking at the site, as long as a pedestrian entrance leads directly out onto Bishopston Lane the station is well sited for pedestrian access from the surrounding housing estates, and also could develop some role as a commuter destination with offices etc along Timothy's Bridge Road within a few minutes walk.

 

[Jollycam]

I agree that it would be great if a Dorridge terminator could be the extension to Stratford as you could then potentially get a 30min frequency at Birmingham and Stratford, otherwise extending a Whitlocks End train will always give you a 20min/40min lob-sided service. The main issue you'd imagine to a Dorridge extension is the single line bit from Hatton to Bearley Jn and mixing in the other Chiltern trains that use the track.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Chiltern only run a handful of trains a day though don't they, once every two hours or so? I think a path across the northbound track north of Hatton may be a bigger stumbling block, what with hourly XC, half-hourly Chiltern, Tyseley movements and freight all using it, plus one of them being right behind it southbound too. That said, it certainly doesn't sound like the hardest pathing challenge around.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

A major day out destination doesn't need extra trains on a Saturday? If they didn't work then, why would they work the rest of the week?

I use the line to get in and out of Birmingham off-peak on occasion and apart from trains that college students and schoolchildren use to get in and out of stratford, most of the existing hourly services have dozens of empty seats beyond the Birmingham suburban area. And why go via Dorridge on a route that is already busy and is likely to get even more so?

It's as much for the people who live in Stratford who need a better service as it is for daytrippers who want to visit the Bard. Stratford doesnt have a great service compared to other similar sized towns 20-25 miles from Birmingham. More people will use the station if the service is better.
Going via Dorridge would give Stratford a more evenly spaced service than just extending another Whitlocks End terminator. I dont think pathing between Dorridge and Hatton is too big an issue, and the single line between Hatton and Bearley Junction is lightly used.

 

[cle]

The line speed from Hatton to Stratford is agonising as well.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Its 60 all the way bar the curve at Hatton north jct (25) and a brief 50 over Bearley jct. Coming in from the south is quite a bit slower through Hatton station but trains in from Dorridge will completely avoid that.

 

[jimm]

It's as much for the people who live in Stratford who need a better service as it is for daytrippers who want to visit the Bard. Stratford doesnt have a great service compared to other similar sized towns 20-25 miles from Birmingham. More people will use the station if the service is better.
Going via Dorridge would give Stratford a more evenly spaced service than just extending another Whitlocks End terminator. I dont think pathing between Dorridge and Hatton is too big an issue, and the single line between Hatton and Bearley Junction is lightly used.

If it's for the people in Stratford, why would it need to go via Dorridge? Network Rail will not allow precious spare capacity on the main line to be eaten up by trains that could instead run on a lightly-used (and newly-resignalled) double track route, going to exactly the same place. There is also the possibility of the new GW franchisee taking up paths between Hatton and Stratford for London-Oxford-Stratford services - and that's rather more likely to happen than extra Stratford trains via Dorrdige.

 

[The Planner]

If there are paths for them via Dorridge then they can have them, we would not have grounds to deny them unless they didnt work. The only reserved capacity on the network is strategic freight paths, we cannot say "oh the new Great Western franchise might want that path in a couple of years", we would get taken to the cleaners.

 

[jimm]

If there are paths for them via Dorridge then they can have them, we would not have grounds to deny them unless they didnt work. The only reserved capacity on the network is strategic freight paths, we cannot say "oh the new Great Western franchise might want that path in a couple of years", we would get taken to the cleaners.

a. There is no proposal to run Birmingham-Stratford via Dorridge.
b. There is official willingness to listen to proposals to run Oxford-Stratford in the GW ITT.
c. No matter what the 'rules' say, it defies logic to suggest that DfT and ORR would allow running via Dorridge when there is ample spare capacity on the direct route to Stratford via Henley-in-Arden. Anyone suggesting it would be politely invited to forget the idea. Or if XC, Chiltern or one of the freight companies wanted paths on the main line and there were lightly-loaded dmus, which could perfectly well use an alternative route, pottering up and down occupying those paths, they would just get their lobbying firms on the case with the DfT, MPs, councils etc. Oxford-Bristol service ring any bells? If there was some vast untapped market for travel between Solihull and Stratford (the only possible justification for running via Dorridge) I think someone at BR, Central or LM would have noticed by now and put on some trains to cash in.

 

[sprinterguy]

Wow, I hadn't realised that all the improvements that I hoped to see implemented on the Stratford line had actually been approved and would be implemented so soon: Stratford upon Avon Parkway, a half hourly frequency to Birmingham, and later evening trains. And even an increased weekday frequency from December 2013 This is good news, and looks to herald an up-turn in the fortunes and the attention afforded to the Stratford line, which has of course already recently benefitted from the fleet of brand new Class 172s that have been introduced across the Snow Hill lines.

It has always struck me as unusual that such a comparatively large and popular town so close to Birmingham should be served by such an infrequent service. I must admit however that I have rarely seen the trains full, but it is difficult to tell whether the relatively low passenger numbers are due to the low frequency, or whether it is already proven that there is low demand that only warrants a low frequency service. It will be interesting to find out, and in the majority of cases an increase in frequency results in a rise in passenger numbers.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If it's for the people in Stratford, why would it need to go via Dorridge? Network Rail will not allow precious spare capacity on the main line to be eaten up by trains that could instead run on a lightly-used (and newly-resignalled) double track route, going to exactly the same place. There is also the possibility of the new GW franchisee taking up paths between Hatton and Stratford for London-Oxford-Stratford services - and that's rather more likely to happen than extra Stratford trains via Dorrdige.

Centro have expressed a desire to see a "fast" Stratford to Birmingham service via Dorridge in the past, however admittedly I can't see how such a service would be any faster than the present 51 minute journey time from Moor Street to Stratford via Whitlocks End.

I can't see how running an additional Stratford service via Dorridge would eat into paths on the Chiltern line at all, except for Stratford bound trains having to cross-over the Birmingham bound line: The Stratford service would be an extension of an existing Dorridge local service, so the only "new" section of the Chiltern main line would be the section between Dorridge and Hatton, and presumably there would be nothing pathed over that section at that time as it would otherwise interfere with the local service from Dorridge northwards.

The benefit of running a Stratford service via Dorridge would be that while it would take a comparable amount of time to the existing Stratford service, there is only limited passenger demand at the intermediate stations between Stratford and Whitlocks End, to the extent that several stations are request stops, while running via Dorridge the train would benefit from better loadings as it would serve the existing, well-established markets from Dorridge, Solihull and Acocks Green into Birmingham.

 

[The Planner]

a. There is no proposal to run Birmingham-Stratford via Dorridge.

You'd be surprised...

c. No matter what the 'rules' say, it defies logic to suggest that DfT and ORR would allow running via Dorridge when there is ample spare capacity on the direct route to Stratford via Henley-in-Arden. Anyone suggesting it would be politely invited to forget the idea. Or if XC, Chiltern or one of the freight companies wanted paths on the main line and there were lightly-loaded dmus, which could perfectly well use an alternative route, pottering up and down occupying those paths, they would just get their lobbying firms on the case with the DfT, MPs, councils etc. Oxford-Bristol service ring any bells? If there was some vast untapped market for travel between Solihull and Stratford (the only possible justification for running via Dorridge) I think someone at BR, Central or LM would have noticed by now and put on some trains to cash in.

I don't see passenger operators doing this for un-used or lightly used freight paths that are sat on the network and there are mechanisms for them to do so if they want. If LM get it added to their track access contract, which they are intending to do, then they will be able to run them. Running some services from Dorridge will actually benefit Chilterns performance as it would removes a performance risk at Bentley Heath Crossing.

 

[MarkyT]

The benefit of running a Stratford service via Dorridge would be that while it would take a comparable amount of time to the existing Stratford service, there is only limited passenger demand at the intermediate stations between Stratford and Whitlocks End, to the extent that several stations are request stops, while running via Dorridge the train would benefit from better loadings as it would serve the existing, well-established markets from Dorridge, Solihull and Acocks Green into Birmingham.

Routing via Solihull also surely offers potential for developing a market between Stratford and Solihull, to help fill some seats at the far end of the route.

 

[jimm]

Wow, I hadn't realised that all the improvements that I hoped to see implemented on the Stratford line had actually been approved and would be implemented so soon: Stratford upon Avon Parkway, a half hourly frequency to Birmingham, and later evening trains. And even an increased weekday frequency from December 2013 This is good news, and looks to herald an up-turn in the fortunes and the attention afforded to the Stratford line, which has of course already recently benefitted from the fleet of brand new Class 172s that have been introduced across the Snow Hill lines.

It has always struck me as unusual that such a comparatively large and popular town so close to Birmingham should be served by such an infrequent service. I must admit however that I have rarely seen the trains full, but it is difficult to tell whether the relatively low passenger numbers are due to the low frequency, or whether it is already proven that there is low demand that only warrants a low frequency service. It will be interesting to find out, and in the majority of cases an increase in frequency results in a rise in passenger numbers.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Centro have expressed a desire to see a "fast" Stratford to Birmingham service via Dorridge in the past, however admittedly I can't see how such a service would be any faster than the present 51 minute journey time from Moor Street to Stratford via Whitlocks End.

I can't see how running an additional Stratford service via Dorridge would eat into paths on the Chiltern line at all, except for Stratford bound trains having to cross-over the Birmingham bound line: The Stratford service would be an extension of an existing Dorridge local service, so the only "new" section of the Chiltern main line would be the section between Dorridge and Hatton, and presumably there would be nothing pathed over that section at that time as it would otherwise interfere with the local service from Dorridge northwards.

The benefit of running a Stratford service via Dorridge would be that while it would take a comparable amount of time to the existing Stratford service, there is only limited passenger demand at the intermediate stations between Stratford and Whitlocks End, to the extent that several stations are request stops, while running via Dorridge the train would benefit from better loadings as it would serve the existing, well-established markets from Dorridge, Solihull and Acocks Green into Birmingham.

The Stratford services serve the existing well-established and high-loading markets from Shirley, Yardley Wood and Hall Green, so what's the difference with the Dorridge line? And to go half-hourly to Stratford, you will be going to a train every 15 minutes out to Whitlocks End anyway.

Timing-wise LM already run a limited-stop morning peak train (calls Henley - which is actually a good intermediate traffic generator across the day - and Earlswood only before Whitlocks End) into Birmingham that is at Moor Street in 43 minutes. With two trains per hour, one of the pair will presumably be running to a similar calling pattern and timing, while the smaller stations still retain an hourly service.

So running extra trains doesn't use up paths? Try telling that to the people who have to weave Freightliner and DBS container trains between Birmingham and southampton in among LM, Chiltern, XC, FGW and SWT services, with all the different stopping patterns, top speeds and acceleration characteristics that entails. A clear run over those few miles of track in Warwickshire may make all the difference to fitting in a service or saying it can't be done. We come back to the point that the North Warwickshire Line is nice and quiet and can easily handle any extra Stratford services. End of story.

 

[sprinterguy]

So running extra trains doesn't use up paths?

In most cases, of course it does. However, in this instance, when we are simply considering the extension for a relatively short distance of an existing service, that does not enter into any areas generating additional train movements beyond those already running between Tyseley and Dorridge, I cannot see how it is likely to affect pathing all that much.

 

[150001]

I've used that Park and Ride site a few times before and it is excellent for getting to the centre. I'd love to see a Dorridge terminator be extended to Stratford; it would mean people don't have to go all the way into B'ham and then come back down again. It would require maybe an extra set but it could be possible.

 

[sprinterguy]

The Stratford services serve the existing well-established and high-loading markets from Shirley, Yardley Wood and Hall Green, so what's the difference with the Dorridge line? And to go half-hourly to Stratford, you will be going to a train every 15 minutes out to Whitlocks End anyway.

That’s a good point, although if the second hourly Stratford service is being introduced as a new service, rather than as a lop-sided extension of an existing Whitlocks End terminator, then it would be serving to spread demand thinner across more services from Shirley, Yardley Wood and Hall Green, although perhaps that could be useful at peak times, and a 15 minute frequency north from Whitlocks End would be a welcome thing to see.

I’m not against running the additional Stratford service via the North Warwickshire line at all, I’m very much in favour of it, but I would also argue that the alternative isn’t as unfeasible as you suggest.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Routing via Solihull also surely offers potential for developing a market between Stratford and Solihull, to help fill some seats at the far end of the route.

That’s true, which might also be useful for improving interchange for passengers from the south, given the occasional nature of the direct Chiltern service into Stratford upon Avon.

 

[The Planner]

So running extra trains doesn't use up paths? Try telling that to the people who have to weave Freightliner and DBS container trains between Birmingham and southampton in among LM, Chiltern, XC, FGW and SWT services, with all the different stopping patterns, top speeds and acceleration characteristics that entails. A clear run over those few miles of track in Warwickshire may make all the difference to fitting in a service or saying it can't be done. We come back to the point that the North Warwickshire Line is nice and quiet and can easily handle any extra Stratford services. End of story.

That will be us then. Southbound liners currently sit inbetween the fast Chilterns and local LMs so will be well out of the way. Northbound they follow all the passengers. The 775m freight loop project also helps out here with an extension to the Dorridge loop in the down as well as Hatton which is extensively used. It is actually the freight trains becoming longer and longer that is the issue and the infrastructure not keeping up that is the problem.

 

[150001]

Jimm, at the moment passengers from Solihull, Dorridge, etc. have to go into B;ham first, wait for a Stratford service and then have a long trip down through Shirley. This long journey puts people off from going to Stratford on the train. If there was a direct service then people on the Chiltern main line will go that way to Stratford which is going to create more revenue. Also Lapworth will benefit from a more regular train service. Really I think this proposal is excellent.

 

[jimm]

That will be us then. Southbound liners currently sit inbetween the fast Chilterns and local LMs so will be well out of the way. Northbound they follow all the passengers. The 775m freight loop project also helps out here with an extension to the Dorridge loop in the down as well as Hatton which is extensively used. It is actually the freight trains becoming longer and longer that is the issue and the infrastructure not keeping up that is the problem.

I note you use the word 'currently'. Given Freightliner's expansion plans at Southampton, happening well in advance of the electric spine/redoubling of Coventry-Leamington, where are all their trains, whatever their length, going to go? At Oxford the order in which passenger and freight trains pass through has changed over the years, so nothing to say what goes on between Birmingham and Leamington won't change either, is there?

And if LM really are going to run the extra services via Dorridge, not the North Warks line, it's a regrettable step and a waste of the resignalling and the extra capacity that was provided as a result in 2010.

 

[150001]

You can have both! One of the Dorridge services which terminates at Dorridge could simply be able to run onto Stratford. The extra services can still be provided on the North Warks with some of the Dorridge terminators running onwards to supplement that. This may require a few extra stock (extra 172s anyone!) and some clever diagramming but it could work.

 

[jimm]

You can have both! One of the Dorridge services which terminates at Dorridge could simply be able to run onto Stratford. The extra services can still be provided on the North Warks with some of the Dorridge terminators running onwards to supplement that. This may require a few extra stock (extra 172s anyone!) and some clever diagramming but it could work.

You would also need some clever passengers, to work out which train they need to catch to get home from Birmingham. Simple, reliable, repetitive timetables work best, that's why all the Birmingham suburban lines work that way. So if you must go via Dorridge, for goodness' sake keep it on a standard pattern and keep the North Warks on a standard pattern. I doubt you would need extra stock, just a timing allowance for uncoupling and coupling a pair of two-car 172s.

The odd intervals of the LM Saturday extras to Stratford probably contributed to their demise first time round, as the standard pattern of 25 or so past the hour from Stratford and half past the hour back from Moor Street is so familiar and longstanding that a lot of people just kept turning up for those trains anyway out of habit.