SWR new services

[pompeyfan]

I’ve noticed there’s a couple of new services for SWR as part of their franchise obligations, at the moment it’s just one a day but good to see they’re making headway

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W30394/2019/05/20/advanced

(Quite why it’s worthy of a Class 1 headcode is a mystery!)

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W32102/2019/06/27/advanced

 

[backontrack]

I’ve noticed there’s a couple of new services for SWR as part of their franchise obligations, at the moment it’s just one a day but good to see they’re making headway

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W30394/2019/05/20/advanced

It's certainly good to see.

 

[Kite159]

So an extension of a Portsmouth - Southampton stopper to form a Poole stopper

 

[pompeyfan]

So an extension of a Portsmouth - Southampton stopper to form a Poole stopper

Not quite, on the run to Southampton it’s semi fast, skipping Bursledon, Hamble, Sholing and Bitterne.

 

[swt_passenger]

Not quite, on the run to Southampton it’s semi fast, skipping Bursledon, Hamble, Sholing and Bitterne.

Yes, they aren’t balanced up and down, the up (eastbound) example is running in the times of the normal xx44 stopper from Southampton to Portsmouth, but the down (westbound) is running about half way between the existing normal all stations stoppers.
In the draft timetables it was the hourly stoppers both ways that were normally extended to or from Weymouth, although slightly retimed, but I suppose all bets are off now as it’s supposedly been completely rewritten and the original draft times should probably be ignored.

Could they end up with different calling patterns in either direction? I suppose another round of draft timetables would be too much to hope for...

 

[Kite159]

Extending the stoppers to Bournemouth makes sense as they can use the bay platform when it's just a single 450 (which the Portsmouth stoppers normally are)

 

[swt_passenger]

Extending the stoppers to Bournemouth makes sense as they can use the bay platform when it's just a single 450 (which the Portsmouth stoppers normally are)

Which reminds me that the above linked examples to and from Poole may not be indicative of the extended service’s new pattern which now only links Portsmouth with Bournemouth.

 

[30907]

The down train allows the 0735 WAT-WEY to run fast beyond Southampton, the up train is an existing working from Brockenhurst to Southampton.

 

[swt_passenger]

The down train allows the 0735 WAT-WEY to run fast beyond Southampton, the up train is an existing working from Brockenhurst to Southampton.

Looks like the inbound train from Portsmouth Harbour at 1738 into platform 2, (that would have previously formed the 1744 return), most probably strengthens the next up Poole - Waterloo train, arr 1751, dep 1755. (Unless there’s an ECS move yet to be added, of course.)

 

[Kite159]

The new Salisbury - Reading services are showing for Sundays, however I was under the impression those would be all stops between Salisbury & Basingstoke allowing the existing services to only call at Andover speeding up journey times by a couple minutes. Otherwise for the likes of Grateley or Overton there are no improvements with both stations keeping the current 2 hourly service which puts folk off travelling.

 

[GW43125]

There have been a few minor changes on the Windsor side, there are now two Windsor-Waterloo via Hounslow in the morning peak, in the evening peak the existing 17:05 Farnham is re-timed to 16:54, and runs via Hounslow (calling Hounslow only), allowing a new 17:05 Reading.

 

[swt_passenger]

Some more South Hants locals probably no longer run by 158 or 159 over the third rail at long last.
2B91 1638 Winchester to Totton extended to Bournemouth - RTT shows this as 100 mph EMU.
2T75 0030 Eastleigh to Portsmouth Harbour formed from 2W84 Weymouth to Eastleigh arr 0014 with a shunt via Allbrook, again RTT shows this as 100 mph EMU operated.

One extra through Waterloo to Fareham by joining existing:
2T45 1512 from Waterloo combines current 2T45 1629 from Basingstoke with 2L45 1512 from Waterloo but now terminates at Fareham. This train leaves Waterloo just after the 1509 1T45.
Three additional through trains:
1T59 1839 Waterloo to Fareham, extends the evening 2 tph period.
1T63 1939 Waterloo to Fareham, ditto
1T69 2109 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour, fills a long gap.

 

[pompeyfan]

Some more South Hants locals probably no longer run by 158 or 159 over the third rail at long last.
2B91 1638 Winchester to Totton extended to Bournemouth - RTT shows this as 100 mph EMU.
2T75 0030 Eastleigh to Portsmouth Harbour formed from 2W84 Weymouth to Eastleigh arr 0014 with a shunt via Allbrook, again RTT shows this as 100 mph EMU operated.

One extra through Waterloo to Fareham by joining existing:
2T45 1512 from Waterloo combines current 2T45 1629 from Basingstoke with 2L45 1512 from Waterloo but now terminates at Fareham. This train leaves Waterloo just after the 1509 1T45.
Three additional through trains:
1T59 1839 Waterloo to Fareham, extends the evening 2 tph period.
1T63 1939 Waterloo to Fareham, ditto
1T69 2109 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour, fills a long gap.

Good work finding all those extra services, when are they valid from? The evening 2T75 is a repeat of the Saturday timetable.

That only leaves 5E18 in the morning along with 2T14 and 2T71 as diesel operated, although I’d imagine 2T14 will be a permanent 450 now.

 

[swt_passenger]

Good work finding all those extra services, when are they valid from? The evening 2T75 is a repeat of the Saturday timetable.

That only leaves 5E18 in the morning along with 2T14 and 2T71 as diesel operated, although I’d imagine 2T14 will be a permanent 450 now.

They’re in RTT for week commencing 20th May. Obviously subject to change at this stage.
5E18 isn’t in the May timetable, the ECS runs from Salisbury (rather than Fratton) to Totton Yard.

Also realised that the 1T69 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour actually replaces 2T69 Basingstoke to Portsmouth Harbour - is that a DMU at the moment?

 

[bb21]

That 2E53 is just conveniently combining the current short-working 2B62 (1721 Brockenhurst - Southampton) with the existing 2E53, with a suitable rejig of units, as the current 2B62 goes into the goods loop after arriving back at Southampton. There is no additional service here.

2T69 is currently booked 3/159, coming off a set of empties from Barton Mill.

The morning extra to Poole was probably given Class 1 as it doesn't get overtaken en route. Down Class 2s are generally overtaken at Brockenhurst during the day. Early morning 2W's aren't, but then Weymouth trains don't get overtaken normally. There is no hard and fast rule. I suppose it could have been given a 1Bxx headcode, but then it was decided a good while ago they were going to be K's as NR weren't happy to allow down trains to continue using E's, as with the Netley road stoppers.

 

[nw1]

Some more South Hants locals probably no longer run by 158 or 159 over the third rail at long last.
2B91 1638 Winchester to Totton extended to Bournemouth - RTT shows this as 100 mph EMU.
2T75 0030 Eastleigh to Portsmouth Harbour formed from 2W84 Weymouth to Eastleigh arr 0014 with a shunt via Allbrook, again RTT shows this as 100 mph EMU operated.

One extra through Waterloo to Fareham by joining existing:
2T45 1512 from Waterloo combines current 2T45 1629 from Basingstoke with 2L45 1512 from Waterloo but now terminates at Fareham. This train leaves Waterloo just after the 1509 1T45.
Three additional through trains:
1T59 1839 Waterloo to Fareham, extends the evening 2 tph period.
1T63 1939 Waterloo to Fareham, ditto
1T69 2109 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour, fills a long gap.

This came up on the other 'new timetable' thread recently, but there are also new 1848 and 1948 services from Waterloo to Poole, which would presumably have originally been the 1839 and 1939 mentioned above. One of these (can't remember which) is limited stop between Southampton and Poole and is not overtaken, giving a rare third usable-for-the-whole-journey train an hour between Waterloo and Bournemouth/Poole.

Also there's a 1718 to Haslemere which allows the 1715 Portsmouth to run fast Guildford to Haslemere. Always wondered why there was no increase in the off peak frequency down the Portsmouth Direct between 1700 and 1800.

Although, having been on a not-particularly-heavily-loaded (indeed, in the front coach, almost empty) 2005 from Waterloo to Airport Parkway last night, I'm surprised there's the demand to run the 1939 and 1948 as separate trains; one might think it would be sufficient to run them as one 1939 (12-coach) and divide at Eastleigh (8 to Portsmouth, 4 to Poole).

 

[andyc20050]

The current 2Y61 1915 Waterloo to Southampton via Havant will also stop at Bedhampton and Swanwick.

 

[pompeyfan]

I’m surprised that Bedhampton gets a call instead of somewhere like Netley or Woolston.

 

[nw1]

I’m surprised that Bedhampton gets a call instead of somewhere like Netley or Woolston.

... or even, at the new timetable maybe they could route the 1715 and 1815 that way rather than the 1915? Advantages are that these are at times convenient for commuters and from the new timetable they are both fast Guildford to Haslemere. Also as they are not on-the-hour or on-the-half-hour services they would not disrupt the half-hourly interval fast service to Portsmouth. These journeys could be used to provide places such as Swanwick and perhaps Netley (though in the case of Netley it's probably always faster to go into SOU and out again) with a useful commuter service.

 

[swt_passenger]

...Although, having been on a not-particularly-heavily-loaded (indeed, in the front coach, almost empty) 2005 from Waterloo to Airport Parkway last night, I'm surprised there's the demand to run the 1939 and 1948 as separate trains; one might think it would be sufficient to run them as one 1939 (12-coach) and divide at Eastleigh (8 to Portsmouth, 4 to Poole).

Doesnt the 1839 split at Eastleigh into Fareham and Poole portions in the current timetable, but won’t in May? That might suggest a decrease in splitting rather than an increase.

Maybe the new order really is trying to make use of all the spare 450s displaced off the Portsmouth route, they’ll have to deploy them somewhere to meet the franchise additional train commitments.

However, what is the max length train that can terminate in Fareham P2 as some of the above are booked? Presumably an 8 car is too long? So isn’t a 4 car departure from Waterloo a bit of a waste anyway?

 

[pompeyfan]

Doesnt the 1839 split at Eastleigh into Fareham and Poole portions in the current timetable, but won’t in May? That might suggest a decrease in splitting rather than an increase.

Maybe the new order really is trying to make use of all the spare 450s displaced off the Portsmouth route, they’ll have to deploy them somewhere to meet the franchise additional train commitments.

However, what is the max length train that can terminate in Fareham P2 as some of the above are booked? Presumably an 8 car is too long? So isn’t a 4 car departure from Waterloo a bit of a waste anyway?

Fareham bay is an 8, there’s nothing to say the train couldn’t terminate in 3 as a 12 car, but you’d need station staff to assist in emptying the train out and checking that the units are empty.

 

[swt_passenger]

Fareham bay is an 8, there’s nothing to say the train couldn’t terminate in 3 as a 12 car, but you’d need station staff to assist in emptying the train out and checking that the units are empty.

I guess the ability to terminate in P3 depends on where the train goes next?

 

[pompeyfan]

I guess the ability to terminate in P3 depends on where the train goes next?

I’m assuming it goes to Fratton as per current arrangements, it could always go to Northam or Bournemouth via Havant as another option but that would add on about half an hour probably.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

The new Salisbury - Reading services are showing for Sundays, however I was under the impression those would be all stops between Salisbury & Basingstoke allowing the existing services to only call at Andover speeding up journey times by a couple minutes. Otherwise for the likes of Grateley or Overton there are no improvements with both stations keeping the current 2 hourly service which puts folk off travelling.

Timetabling nationally has been subject to the spotlight a lot recently following the well publicised challenges the industry faced in May 2019; since then a lot of work has gone on in the industry to de-risk changes and ensure they are deliverable, and this has included the volume of timetable changes.

On SWR this has meant the big change in Dec 18 being delayed and now for May 2019 change being kept to a manageable level. In the case of the new Reading to Salisbury service this was always intended in its final form to stop at the smaller stations such as Overton and Grateley to give these stations an hourly service and allow the Exeter service to be ‘sped up’. Within the industry set parameters for May 2019 this wasn’t possible and the new service had to go in as an ‘overlay’ to the existing timetable as moving the stops between trains also has quite an impact to other services in the Salisbury area and brings quite a volume of consequential change which it was decided best not to proceed with at that stage for May 2019. It is planned in a following timetable change this will be addressed with the stops transferred and frequencies at the small stations improved.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Good work finding all those extra services, when are they valid from? The evening 2T75 is a repeat of the Saturday timetable.

That only leaves 5E18 in the morning along with 2T14 and 2T71 as diesel operated, although I’d imagine 2T14 will be a permanent 450 now.

From May 2019:

2T14 05.00 Portsmouth Harbour to Basingstoke in the morning becomes an 05.00 Portsmouth Harbour to Waterloo via Eastleigh through class 450 operated service (it is combined with the current 2L16 06.23 Basingstoke to Waterloo).

2T69 22.21 Basingstoke to Portsmouth Harbour is replaced by an additional class 450 operated 1T69 21.09 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour via Eastleigh and the existing super-slow 2T71 21.42 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour via Eastleigh terminates at Basingstoke being replaced by an additional class 450 operated 1T73 22.09 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour.

The finally ends the often queried usage on DMUs on Hampshire Local services (other than the ‘Romsey 6’ service).

 

[HamworthyGoods]

This came up on the other 'new timetable' thread recently, but there are also new 1848 and 1948 services from Waterloo to Poole, which would presumably have originally been the 1839 and 1939 mentioned above. One of these (can't remember which) is limited stop between Southampton and Poole and is not overtaken, giving a rare third usable-for-the-whole-journey train an hour between Waterloo and Bournemouth/Poole.

Also there's a 1718 to Haslemere which allows the 1715 Portsmouth to run fast Guildford to Haslemere. Always wondered why there was no increase in the off peak frequency down the Portsmouth Direct between 1700 and 1800.

Although, having been on a not-particularly-heavily-loaded (indeed, in the front coach, almost empty) 2005 from Waterloo to Airport Parkway last night, I'm surprised there's the demand to run the 1939 and 1948 as separate trains; one might think it would be sufficient to run them as one 1939 (12-coach) and divide at Eastleigh (8 to Portsmouth, 4 to Poole).

Also new is 1P90 06.40 Havant to Waterloo, semi-fast via Guildford.
http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/W30438/2019-05-22

Evening Bournemouth additional trains have been mentioned there is a morning additional too in the form of a 1B88 06.28 Southampton Airport to Waterloo
http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/W30377/2019-05-22

Also the current 07.38 Southampton Central to Waterloo has been sped-up and now starts back from Bournemouth
http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/W31708/2019-05-22

 

[swt_passenger]

From May 2019:

2T14 05.00 Portsmouth Harbour to Basingstoke in the morning becomes an 05.00 Portsmouth Harbour to Waterloo via Eastleigh through class 450 operated service (it is combined with the current 2L16 06.23 Basingstoke to Waterloo).

2T69 22.21 Basingstoke to Portsmouth Harbour is replaced by an additional class 450 operated 1T69 21.09 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour via Eastleigh and the existing super-slow 2T71 21.42 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour via Eastleigh terminates at Basingstoke being replaced by an additional class 450 operated 1T73 22.09 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour.

The finally ends the often queried usage on DMUs on Hampshire Local services (other than the ‘Romsey 6’ service).

I thought I’d already mentioned the 2T69 replacement by 1T69 above, but your explanation reads better...

Hopefully they might strengthen a couple more West of England line services - getting rid of those last few DMU operated short workings has been a long time coming...

 

[Kite159]

Timetabling nationally has been subject to the spotlight a lot recently following the well publicised challenges the industry faced in May 2019; since then a lot of work has gone on in the industry to de-risk changes and ensure they are deliverable, and this has included the volume of timetable changes.

On SWR this has meant the big change in Dec 18 being delayed and now for May 2019 change being kept to a manageable level. In the case of the new Reading to Salisbury service this was always intended in its final form to stop at the smaller stations such as Overton and Grateley to give these stations an hourly service and allow the Exeter service to be ‘sped up’. Within the industry set parameters for May 2019 this wasn’t possible and the new service had to go in as an ‘overlay’ to the existing timetable as moving the stops between trains also has quite an impact to other services in the Salisbury area and brings quite a volume of consequential change which it was decided best not to proceed with at that stage for May 2019. It is planned in a following timetable change this will be addressed with the stops transferred and frequencies at the small stations improved.

Ta, bit annoying as it looks like I shall have to continue driving to Andover on Sundays if I want to head out and don't want to be tied to the odd hour departures from Waterloo.

 

[pompeyfan]

It’s good from an operational point of view I suppose that diesel units aren’t being wasted, but a shame I won’t be able to dabble any more on them. The first rounder is currently the 0614 from Totton - Romsey after reversing in Totton Yard. I assume this unit will run empty from Salisbury but continue its current workings?

 

[embers25]

Also new is 1P90 06.40 Havant to Waterloo, semi-fast via Guildford.
http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/W30438/2019-05-22

This runs directly behind the 0615 from Pompey which rather interestingly (and I'm guessing may be of great happiness to Infobleep) has had a Surbiton stop added which will not be popular with longer distance commuters. That being said there is now a 0512 fast from Pompey so win some lose some!