SWR Strike Action: Strikes every day in December except 1st, 12th, 25th & 26th

[ainsworth74]

I expect this actually to be less severe than some expect; if SWR do what Southern did, literally every manager or head office staff that can walk and read correctly will be trained as contingency.

I'm not sure how long that will be tenable though. The contingency staff have their own jobs to do and they're often going to be office staff probably used to doing a 9 to 5. Agreeing to do an operational role for a day or two ever few weeks is one thing but doing it for weeks on end? That's a very different proposition and I wonder quite how many of them will be willing to do that...

 

[Facing Back]

Yeah. I remember the days when people fought like lunatics for their working rights. These days we throw them away cheaply and criticise those who refuse to do so.

I'm sorry Gems, I think I've lost the plot on this one - I can't see what working rights are at risk

I haven't kept up to date on this but the last I remember:

The only published (and agreed by both sides) statement was that there would be a safety critical guard on each train and that what the guard does was to be negotiated

The company sent a letter stating that it's intended way of working was for drivers to open and close the doors

The RMT has stated that the only acceptable way of working has the guard closing the doors.

So currently an impasse on ways of working but I'm not seeing a threat to rights.

Are there other agreements - in the public domain - was something else agreed by either side then renaged on?

 

[Horizon22]

I'm not sure how long that will be tenable though. The contingency staff have their own jobs to do and they're often going to be office staff probably used to doing a 9 to 5. Agreeing to do an operational role for a day or two ever few weeks is one thing but doing it for weeks on end? That's a very different proposition and I wonder quite how many of them will be willing to do that...

There were a lot of them out when Southern had their strike days; I'll admit its a lot harder for a 10+ day stretch than the 2-3 that typified Southern at the end of that period and it depends how far along the training has been. The more trains that run, the less reputational hit the TOC has and the more the public won't be on the RMT's side I suppose.

 

[ainsworth74]

There were a lot of them out when Southern had their strike days; I'll admit its a lot harder for a 10+ day stretch than the 2-3 that typified Southern at the end of that period and it depends how far along the training has been.

Well I'm sure SWR already have plenty of contingency staff as this dispute has been rumbling along for a while now. But I'm not sure how many of them will sign up to do a job which isn't their actual job full time for a month. I'm not sure SWR can even allow them to do that seeing as they won't then be doing the jobs that they're actually supposed to be doing!

This is a very different kettle of fish to almost any other strike action we've seen where it's been the odd day or two ever week or two. Even Northern by the end were struggling to resource contingency staff at the level they had for earlier strike action and that was just one day a week every week that they required!

 

[Bletchleyite]

What's the logic about working on election day?

Because they wouldn't want to be seen to disrupt people getting home in time to vote?

 

[Robertj21a]

The timing is very poor due to the impending General Election. SWR, WMT along with the Postal Workers all threatening to strike and you can guarantee the right wing press will capitalise on it.

Some of us remember what the Winter of Discontent led to.

If the Tories get in with a majority in December they will be up for a fight with the RMT.........remember the miners........

At least it gives Boris, and the Tories in general, plenty of ammunition for the shenanigans before the General election. They must be having a good chuckle at their luck tonight.

 

[hooverboy]

I'm sorry Gems, I think I've lost the plot on this one - I can't see what working rights are at risk

I haven't kept up to date on this but the last I remember:

The only published (and agreed by both sides) statement was that there would be a safety critical guard on each train and that what the guard does was to be negotiated

The company sent a letter stating that it's intended way of working was for drivers to open and close the doors

The RMT has stated that the only acceptable way of working has the guard closing the doors.

So currently an impasse on ways of working but I'm not seeing a threat to rights.

Are there other agreements - in the public domain - was something else agreed by either side then renaged on?

there is no impasse here.

I spy a lot of lawsuits coming SWR/RMT's way from businesses to recover lost earnings from employees who cannot get to work.
in the case of the city boys the firms have very deep pockets indeed.

strike action of this duration is more than a mere inconvenience.I don't see them sitting idly by and letting it happen.
it'll, be several hundred million in compensation(enough to bankrupt both SWR and RMT),or a forced solution from SWR.

bad move

 

[Meerkat]

Lawsuit saying what?!

 

[winks]

Not sure on lawsuits. The whole organisation is run down and staff morale pretty dire I would say, after spending my time at a depot recently morale was low. My guess is the govt will strip First / MTR of the franchise pretty soon if the 27 days strike action go ahead. Can I just ask as I don’t know but is RMT paying everyone who goes out on strike their base pay for the month ? That’s seems like a staggering amount of money to shell out...?

 

[Horizon22]

Not sure on lawsuits. The whole organisation is run down and staff morale pretty dire I would say, after spending my time at a depot recently morale was low. My guess is the govt will strip First / MTR of the franchise pretty soon if the 27 days strike action go ahead. Can I just ask as I don’t know but is RMT paying everyone who goes out on strike their base pay for the month ? That’s seems like a staggering amount of money to shell out...?

Why? This is almost certainly backed up by the DfT.

 

[Wombat]

Sounds expensive. Is the size of the RMT's cash reserves a matter of public record?

 

[bobbyrail]

Trouble is that the action ends on 01/01/20 exactly when rail fares are normally increased, so how many season ticket holders will be even more peed off that despite having no rail service for the last month the price of their 11 in 12 month ticket is increasing.

 

[Meerkat]

As the union have gone nuclear what are the TOCs nuclear options?
Give the drivers a pay rise, hire new OBSs (as temp guards to later be OBSs) and sack guards who refuse to go back to work or accept OBS status?
Do any current SWR units have cameras? Bet they wish Bombardier weren’t so late.....
How long would it take to train new guards if it was done to minimum regulatory standards rather then current union agreed plans?

 

[father_jack]

Trouble is that the action ends on 01/01/20 exactly when rail fares are normally increased, so how many season ticket holders will be even more peed off that despite having no rail service for the last month the price of their 11 in 12 month ticket is increasing.

13 or even 27 "void days" and a juicy passenger charter discount would be nice but given that the company will send out every manager from the top down to the tea boy as contingency guard some kind of service will operate

 

[ainsworth74]

Give the drivers a pay rise

And I'm sure ASLEF won't immediately smell desperation and make demands which are, one might call, excessive for agreeing to such terms right now. Base salary of £100,000? Why not? After all nice Mr TOC must be pretty desperate if they're trying to ram this through like this.

hire new OBSs (as temp guards to later be OBSs) and sack guards who refuse to go back to work or accept OBS status?

If you sack striking workers (who have taken part in a properly organised ballot) you're breaking the law and the Employment Tribunal will eat you for breakfast. There might be more legs in getting them sign up to a new OBS contract but ASLEF are the elephant in the room. Until they agree that their members can operate DOO these new OBS's won't be doing very much at all.

Do any current SWR units have cameras?

I believe the 707s do but that's probably it. Plus you've still got to persuade ASLEF to actually let their drivers operate full DOO...

 

[Robertj21a]

Could SWR use buses on replacement services somewhere ?

 

[deltic]

Can staff afford to strike for so long before Christmas, one wonders whether we will see a gradual drift back to work?

 

[ainsworth74]

Can staff afford to strike for so long before Christmas, one wonders whether we will see a gradual drift back to work?

RMT are apparently providing one months base pay as strike pay.

 

[Twotwo]

RMT are apparently providing one months base pay as strike pay.

How much is that?

 

[yorkie]

How much is that?

In May 2018 it was reportedly "£38,248 per annum after qualifying plus associated regional allowances."

So a month's pay would be about £3,187 per Guard (plus regional allowances, not taking into account whether any pay rise may have occurred since then)

 

[ainsworth74]

How much is that?

According to the job advert out at the moment for a guards role at Staines (see here) pay is:

£21,881 per annum rising to £32,658 per annum after qualifying plus associated regional allowances

So that would suggest £2,721.50 before any deductions (tax, NI, pensions, etc) but as strike pay (I believe) is tax free I'd assume that the RMT will be aiming to pay the net figure for the month (i.e. base pay after deductions) rather than the gross the figure!

 

[3141]

RMT are apparently providing one months base pay as strike pay.

I'd expect that both SWR and the RMT will be thinking about what might happen when the month is up. If the dispute still isn't settled a further round of strikes, whether short or long, would have big financial implications.

 

[ainsworth74]

I'd expect that both SWR and the RMT will be thinking about what might happen when the month is up. If the dispute still isn't settled a further round of strikes, whether short or long, would have big financial implications.

Well quite! If it's true that the RMT are forking out that much money I wonder how big their war chest actually is! Surely they can't afford to pay out for another months pay for all the SWR guards that are on strike? We'd be getting into colossal sums of money. The RMT are a big union but there must be a limit?

Or perhaps they've got a large war chest and they've decided that as the disputes are basically resolved everywhere else they can actually afford to spend large chunks of it in one place and drain that chest significantly?

Certainly I do find it very interesting that they've escalated like this and with this sort of financial impact on their own coffers.

 

[Darandio]

Certainly I do find it very interesting that they've escalated like this and with this sort of financial impact on their own coffers.

Maybe they are anticipating contributions from many 'brothers and sisters' around the country?

 

[Brissle Girl]

Interestingly, the guards role is conspicuously vague as to the duties around despatch.

Make sure that as far as is possible the trains run to time and any unavoidable delay is prevented, with particular attention to the safe and punctual dispatch of trains at stations.

Presumably any recent recruits will not be taking part whilst in their first few months, as I recall union advice is that they should work?

 

[Journeyman]

So the RMT intend to strike every day in December other than the one where the public can vote to put their Labour friends in government, what could be nakedly political about that? If this extends to the other disputes it will be clear.

I think this goes to show that this whole thing has got gruesomely political, and that the RMT's goal is to attempt to force a TOC to collapse. Pretty disgusting stuff, to be honest, and I'm seriously unimpressed, especially because the Tories will ramp up the anti-Union rhetoric, and wealthy voters in SWR territory will lap it up. I wouldn't be surprised if this secures the Tories a couple of extra seats.

 

[pompeyfan]

The figure I’ve been told is £100 a day, which isn’t eligible for tax and NI, this works out at £2000, so would leave a commercial guard about £350 short in the pocket for a month.

 

[Facing Back]

there is no impasse here.

I spy a lot of lawsuits coming SWR/RMT's way from businesses to recover lost earnings from employees who cannot get to work.
in the case of the city boys the firms have very deep pockets indeed.

strike action of this duration is more than a mere inconvenience.I don't see them sitting idly by and letting it happen.
it'll, be several hundred million in compensation(enough to bankrupt both SWR and RMT),or a forced solution from SWR.

bad move

A firm statement Hooverboy.

Why no impasse? We have 2 sides with clearly stated, highly entrenched and diametrically opposed positions. Both sides have resisted tremendous pressure to change or moderate their position.

It sounds like the very definition of impasse to me.

 

[swt_passenger]

Maybe they are anticipating contributions from many 'brothers and sisters' around the country?

Why is SWR and the former SWT so special to RMT, and what’s in it for their national membership?
AIUI every other London and SE inner suburban service is already operating DOO, and most have been for many years. The longer distance SWR services operated by Desiros and 158/159 are not in scope, this is supposedly a Class 701 issue only.

 

[Darandio]

Why is SWR and the former SWT so special to RMT, and what’s in it for their national membership?

I've no idea, but we already have one hero in the thread offering to stump up a few hundred.