TfGM Bee Network - fleet discussion

[Park47515]

Once the E300’s have been done we should start to see more deckers going for the paint and conversion.
There’s 2 E300’s from Oldham and Queens away at anyone time (1 each at Anston for conversion and retrim, 1 each at Birkenhead for paint).


Overall 15 years but there’s some boards/services that require the vehicles used to be under 7 years.
There’s also dispensation for example at Queens road, and presumably Hyde road from next week because TFGM have supplied some older vehicles.

I assume that the ones that require vehicles to be under 7 are the ones that are currently Electrics?

 

[mayneway]

I assume that the ones that require vehicles to be under 7 are the ones that are currently Electrics?

No! For example at Queens road the 135’s should all be under 7 years old but the 41’s can be anything under 15 years. Completely depends on the route.

 

[Fox192]

No! For example at Queens road the 135’s should all be under 7 years old but the 41’s can be anything under 15 years. Completely depends on the route.

I guess that’s why on the 33 i get mostly b9s

 

[mayneway]

I guess that’s why on the 33 i get mostly b9s

At the moment there’s dispensation for the age limits because of the B9’s so they can and do appear on anything, but once the last B9 is withdrawn it will then become a compliance issue.

 

[xitz2012@gmail]

No! For example at Queens road the 135’s should all be under 7 years old but the 41’s can be anything under 15 years. Completely depends on the route.

Do you know what the age limit is for 9x routes out of Queens Road?

 

[Park47515]

No! For example at Queens road the 135’s should all be under 7 years old but the 41’s can be anything under 15 years. Completely depends on the route.

Is there a rationale from TfGM on this? Or is it incredibly random?

 

[Class 466]

At the moment there’s dispensation for the age limits because of the B9’s so they can and do appear on anything, but once the last B9 is withdrawn it will then become a compliance issue.

Interesting though because come March *in theory* the 17 (and any 16 plates that may or may not appear ) will be too old for some routes (such as 135).

 

[mayneway]

Do you know what the age limit is for 9x routes out of Queens Road?

97/98 are under 7 years, 93’s and 95’s are any vehicle.

Is there a rationale from TfGM on this? Or is it incredibly random?

I honestly think it’s just contract compliance.
I know there was a big push my TFGM to improve pollution figures on Bury New road at one point which would explain the under 7 year vehicles on the 97/98 yet there’s no restriction on the 95’s.

Interesting though because come March *in theory* the 17 (and any 16 plates that may or may not appear ) will be too old for some routes (such as 135).

Exactly!
Once the last B9 is withdrawn the age limit restrictions kick in so it’s potentially more fines rolling In should they end up on the 135!

 

[xitz2012@gmail]

97/98 are under 7 years, 93’s and 95’s are any vehicle.


I honestly think it’s just contract compliance.
I know there was a big push my TFGM to improve pollution figures on Bury New road at one point which would explain the under 7 year vehicles on the 97/98 yet there’s no restriction on the 95’s.


Exactly!
Once the last B9 is withdrawn the age limit restrictions kick in so it’s potentially more fines rolling In should they end up on the 135!

Don’t all MMCs have the same emissions rating though, no matter the age? I’m sure they were built as Euro6 from the get-go.

 

[mayneway]

Don’t all MMCs have the same emissions rating though, no matter the age? I’m sure they were built as Euro6 from the get-go.

Yes! But the boards still state 7 years or under.

 

[Pinza68]

Saw a 74 reg with Trade Plates passing Taff Wells depot, Cardiff on New Year's Eve presumably on delivery to Manchester

 

[BlitzFan87]

Saw a 74 reg with Trade Plates passing Taff Wells depot, Cardiff on New Year's Eve presumably on delivery to Manchester

That is a good sign because the bee network tranche 3 begins this Sunday

 

[gka472l]

From a post elsewhere, 45 Streetdecks have been delivered to Sharston today.

HTH

 

[Leyland Bus]

Several routes are limited to a 7 year age limit, others 15. I don't know the exact reasons, or why but I'm sorry to inform you, Mayneway is correct. Why do you think 3401 left the GNW fleet? It was too old for those routes (it had turned 8) and would have had to be classified essentially as an E400.

It’s worth remembering that some of us on this forum work within the Bee Network in various capacities. We do our utmost to inform and pass on information for the benefit of those who don't and would otherwise not know.

 

[xitz2012@gmail]

Several routes are limited to a 7 year age limit, others 15. I don't know the exact reasons, or why but I'm sorry to inform you, Mayneway is correct. Why do you think 3401 left the GNW fleet? It was too old for those routes (it had turned 8) and would have had to be classified essentially as an E400.

It’s worth remembering that some of us on this forum work within the Bee Network in various capacities. We do our utmost to inform and pass on information for the benefit of those who don't and would otherwise not know.

3401 is still in service isn't it? Unless its a mistrack.

 

[py_megapixel]

From a post elsewhere, 45 Streetdecks have been delivered to Sharston today.

HTH

This sort of thing always makes me curious how they manage these enormous moves logistically. Presumably they can't all go in a huge convoy as I wouldn't have thought they employ anywhere near enough drivers to do that without disrupting the regular service. So presumably has to be one or two drivers spending a day moving a bus each, then travelling back in a taxi and repeating until all done? Or do the manufacturers provide some sort of service for transferring large volumes of their vehicles between sites?

 

[esmith2k5]

3401 is still in service isn't it? Unless its a mistrack.

Yeah but if you see it works the 609/615 vast majority of the time, both being 15 year limit routes not 7, hence why the e400 live on these routes

 

[mayneway]

This sort of thing always makes me curious how they manage these enormous moves logistically. Presumably they can't all go in a huge convoy as I wouldn't have thought they employ anywhere near enough drivers to do that without disrupting the regular service. So presumably has to be one or two drivers spending a day moving a bus each, then travelling back in a taxi and repeating until all done? Or do the manufacturers provide some sort of service for transferring large volumes of their vehicles between sites?

It’s a huge operation. We have been dropping vehicles off at the airport today and there’s various groups moving buses to depots. From what I could see there were a mixture of drivers from various depots picking up buses, also looked like Tyrers were involved moving buses out.

Interestingly all the Metroline training vehicles have been ranked up at the airport - including a red Dennis Dart. Guessing these will move onto Hyde road over weekend.

 

[xitz2012@gmail]

Yeah but if you see it works the 609/615 vast majority of the time, both being 15 year limit routes not 7, hence why the e400 live on these routes

Ah that makes sense then.

 

[Leyland Bus]

3401 is still in service isn't it? Unless its a mistrack.

Sorry, that's me jumping the gun slightly. It's down for moving on (obviously hasn't gone yet) but as also mentioned, it only runs on certain routes now.

In similar vein, 3119 was too old for any route and was withdrawn.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Still an enormous amount of beachball and turquoise buses in Manchester city centre, though I’ve noticed my usual 38 Logistics North bus home from work is now increasingly yellow. I‘ve also stopped seeing the scruffy grey and blue buses on my local 67 Cadishead and 100 Trafford Centre services.

50 Salford Quays always seems to have a fully branded Stagecoach Bus.

 

[toms]

Still an enormous amount of beachball and turquoise buses in Manchester city centre, though I’ve noticed my usual 38 Logistics North bus home from work is now increasingly yellow. I‘ve also stopped seeing the scruffy grey and blue buses on my local 67 Cadishead and 100 Trafford Centre services.

50 Salford Quays always seems to have a fully branded Stagecoach Bus.

The grey and blue buses you mention on your local services were what were Stagecoaches B9TLs (originally bought by First Manchester, sold to Go North West along with Queens Road Depot then bought by TFGM and loaned to Stagecoach Manchester as interim vehicles) they were all withdrawn tonight marking the end of 16 years of being used on Queens Road routes. In the last few weeks they have been used a lot less on these routes and yellow newer MMCs have been allocated to those routes

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

The grey and blue buses you mention on your local services were what were Stagecoaches B9TLs (originally bought by First Manchester, sold to Go North West along with Queens Road Depot then bought by TFGM and loaned to Stagecoach Manchester as interim vehicles) they were all withdrawn tonight marking the end of 16 years of being used on Queens Road routes. In the last few weeks they have been used a lot less on these routes and yellow newer MMCs have been allocated to those routes

Good. I was sick of getting those scruffy things home from work while all the other routes had nice shiny yellow ones. Thanks for the information.

 

[py_megapixel]

Has something gone wrong with the EVs at Bolton? Might be my imagination but there seem to be quite a lot of diesel Streetdecks out on the 36 and 37 routes

 

[cactustwirly]

Good. I was sick of getting those scruffy things home from work while all the other routes had nice shiny yellow ones. Thanks for the information.

To be fair, the Volvos are very nice buses, I'd rather have one of those instead of the newer buses which are harsh and rattly

I guess they still have the old First interior which lets them down so I can understand why they wouldn't be the best.

I don't get the obsession with age, brand new busses are built to a cost, I think a well refurbished bus is just as good

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

To be fair, the Volvos are very nice buses, I'd rather have one of those instead of the newer buses which are harsh and rattly

I guess they still have the old First interior which lets them down so I can understand why they wouldn't be the best.

I don't get the obsession with age, brand new busses are built to a cost, I think a well refurbished bus is just as good

Some did whereas Go Ahead did retrim quite a few. However, whilst the B9s have been good servants, they are now showing their age and time moves on. Otherwise, we'd still have a world of Atlanteans and VRs (which I know some would like to return to).

 

[Tim33160]

Has something gone wrong with the EVs at Bolton? Might be my imagination but there seem to be quite a lot of diesel Streetdecks out on the 36 and 37 routes

Electric buses don't like cold, they have less battery power (giving shorter lengths of use) and are moved to other shorter round trips (eg 10)

 

[cactustwirly]

Some did whereas Go Ahead did retrim quite a few. However, whilst the B9s have been good servants, they are now showing their age and time moves on. Otherwise, we'd still have a world of Atlanteans and VRs (which I know some would like to return to).

I don't think 2009 is that old, my local route is 2010 buses, which have had a high spec refurb with high back seats and new floors.

 

[Leyland Bus]

Electric buses don't like cold, they have less battery power (giving shorter lengths of use) and are moved to other shorter round trips (eg 10)

Plus Bolton have been charging Metroline BZLs so the logistics have been a delicate balancing act...

Some did whereas Go Ahead did retrim quite a few. However, whilst the B9s have been good servants, they are now showing their age and time moves on. Otherwise, we'd still have a world of Atlanteans and VRs (which I know some would like to return to).

Yes please!!

 

[toms]

I don't think 2009 is that old, my local route is 2010 buses, which have had a high spec refurb with high back seats and new floors.

2007 & 2008 was when the B9s entered service, they’re really not in shape for use in Manchester anymore, they’re run down and you will notice a lot of them now sound like enormous vacuums