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The Alston Branch

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RichmondCommu

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Hello everyone,

Long time watcher first poster. And more importantly, best friend and indeed best man on his wedding day of the much missed and dearly departed RichmondCommu aka Andrew.

Right, down to business. Do members think that if the Alston branch had survived in the mid 1980's it would now be considerd viable? Please bear in mind that I've only visited Alston once and was in the mid 1980s when Andrew and I walked the Pennine Way and had an overnight stop in Alston.

Just wondering thats all.

Kind regards,

Essex Ram.
 
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a_c_skinner

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Dunno, there are lots of closed and lifted routes that no one would close now. Lewes-Uckfield, Waverley route, the LSWR route to Exeter, Matlock to Great Rocks Dale, Skipton-Colne, Cheltenham to Stratford. But there isn't much to Alston so I doubt it would have lived.
 

mike57

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I would doubt it, the only reason it survived as long as it did was because there wasn't an all weather route during the winter, and Alston being about 1000ft asl gets more than its share of snow. Once the new road was built the railway was doomed.
 

Altfish

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How?

It doesn't pass through any areas of significant population and I can't think of any heavy industry in the area which today might take advantage of using railways.
It would have survived with promotion of its services, "Highest Market Town", "South Tyne Valley", etc.
It would be a public service, promoting Alston which is still isolated, I drove there to go on the narrow gauge railway, the roads are not good.
It isn't all about money despite what our government tells us.
 

Tetchytyke

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In simple terms, YES

Have you ever been to Alston? There's absolutely nothing there. The mystery about the Alston branch wasn't that the line closed, it was that it survived as late as 1976.

Alston can barely sustain a bus service- just two off-peak return trips a day to Haltwhistle, with positioning moves from Hexham also run in service- so a train wouldn't stand a hope.

ETA welcome to the forum OP. It's a good question. I think it'll do better as a preserved railway than it ever did commercially. It's a shame the A69 means that the narrow gauge lime can't reach Haltwhistle.
 
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randyrippley

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If the resources had been available to keep open a line in Cumbria there are plenty of others which would have been regarded as a higher priority.
 

yorksrob

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If the resources had been available to keep open a line in Cumbria there are plenty of others which would have been regarded as a higher priority.

They'd all gone by 1976, so its this one or nowt (although had it made it to 1976, Keswick would have been a better bet).

Given the terrain, I like to think it could have developed a tourist traffic had it survived.
 

transmanche

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I would doubt it, the only reason it survived as long as it did was because there wasn't an all weather route during the winter, and Alston being about 1000ft asl gets more than its share of snow. Once the new road was built the railway was doomed.
Although the all-weather road doesn't quite live up to its name, as Alston was cut-off completely for a few days last month. And even then it was only accessed by borrowing bobcats from Morecambe Bay and an RAF Chinook helicopter.
 

mitchf

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As mentioned above, we have 2 or 3 mini bus services a day to Haltwhistle and Carlisle, school buses to Brampton and Carlisle twice a day and the summer only Newcastle to Keswick service. Apart from the Keswick bus, these are very lightly used and I am surprised they are still running. I very rarely see more than 1 or 2 people on these buses except for the Saturday morning bus to Carlisle which is relatively well used with about 10 to 12 people on board. No chance of a train being viable, unfortunately.

When the A69 Haltwhistle bypass was built the South Tynedale Railway were in discussions with the Highways agency and space has been left for a new railway bridge. This is not seen as a major problem in getting back to Haltwhistle by the STR as they own most of the former trackbed from Slaggyford to Haltwhistle including land next to the existing platform at Haltwhistle. The long term aim is to reinstate the line to Haltwhistle but the first priority is to complete the link to Slaggyford, hopefully by early/middle of May this year.

Alston itself has been cut off for about 3 or 4 days this winter but it is the outlying areas that have been hit hardest with some remote farms being cut off for up to 2 weeks in total. There are rumours that when the chinook landed in Garigill near Alston, they were surprised to see an Asda delivery van unloading someones home shopping order.
 

furnessvale

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I would doubt it, the only reason it survived as long as it did was because there wasn't an all weather route during the winter, and Alston being about 1000ft asl gets more than its share of snow. Once the new road was built the railway was doomed.
A new road that cost many multiples of the annual rail subsidy to build. I forget how many, but it probably has still not covered the cost of rail subsidy.

A new "all weather" road that in the first winter of its use was blocked by snow!
 

transmanche

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As mentioned above, we have 2 or 3 mini bus services a day to Haltwhistle and Carlisle, school buses to Brampton and Carlisle twice a day and the summer only Newcastle to Keswick service. Apart from the Keswick bus, these are very lightly used and I am surprised they are still running. I very rarely see more than 1 or 2 people on these buses except for the Saturday morning bus to Carlisle which is relatively well used with about 10 to 12 people on board.
I wouldn't describe an Optare SR as a 'minibus'. The bus used on GoNorthEast's 681 between Alston & Haltwhistle is also used for the 185 between Haltwhistle & Gilsland and along with the positioning move on the X81 means the whole service can be provided by one bus and one driver.

AIUI, the 681 is actually a Northumberland CC contracted service between Slaggyford & Haltwhistle - but for convenience, it continues the five miles into Alston (which is in Cumbria). It's also fairly slow, taking almost 50 minutes, as it follows a rather roundabout route to serve Stonehouse and Halton Lea Gate - but that's not surprising if its primary purpose is to provide a bus service to Northumberland residents rather than a link to Alston.


Tynedale Links: 669 (NK16 BXL)
by simply|buses, on Flickr
 

DarloRich

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Hello everyone,

Long time watcher first poster. And more importantly, best friend and indeed best man on his wedding day of the much missed and dearly departed RichmondCommu aka Andrew.

Right, down to business. Do members think that if the Alston branch had survived in the mid 1980's it would now be considerd viable? Please bear in mind that I've only visited Alston once and was in the mid 1980s when Andrew and I walked the Pennine Way and had an overnight stop in Alston.

Just wondering thats all.

Kind regards,

Essex Ram.

Welcome on board - i would love to say that the line would have a business case today but i just cant see it. it is amazing it lasted as long as 1976.

Alston and the surrounding area is lovely ( and worth a visit) but your only market is tourists, walkers and cyclists. It is to far away to offer any commuting possibilities to Newcastle and the population is low. Unless you find a new rich vein of lead that needs transporting away i think the railway would struggle ;)
 

backontrack

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Alston can barely sustain a bus service- just two off-peak return trips a day to Haltwhistle, with positioning moves from Hexham also run in service- so a train wouldn't stand a hope.
There are also some few-and-far-between services from Nenthead - England's highest village - to Carlisle via Alston, Hallbankgate and Brampton.

Welcome to the forum @EssexRam. I'm guessing that the Alston Line might have a frequency of about three trains a day in each direction if it were still open. There would probably be intermediate stations at Slaggyford and Coanwood, and the service would be a shuttle to Haltwhistle, advertised as the Pennine Line or something.

It is very surprising that the line lasted as long as it did! Perhaps if it were open today there would be through services to Carlisle, perhaps serving Gilsland, Brampton, Heads Nook and Wetheral.
 
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HowardGWR

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Hello everyone,

Long time watcher first poster. And more importantly, best friend and indeed best man on his wedding day of the much missed and dearly departed RichmondCommu aka Andrew.
Sorry to hear of the loss of your best friend, whom I remember well on here. I assumed from his username that he was a working man. Was he taken early then, may I ask? I am sure many others would be interested, with apologies for OT question.

Edit: I once stayed the night in Alston at the pub there. My wife and I got lost. Ah, young love (50 years ago).
 

30907

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Sorry to hear of the loss of your best friend, whom I remember well on here.
Likewise, I hadn't picked up the sad news either. :(
There was a final post in his name, but it went in the General Discussion forum which I don't follow (and I daresay I'm not the only one).

Back on topic - I travelled the line in 1975, the only passengers alighted at an unofficial stopping point. Like Bridport, it didn't have a future, sorry.
 

backontrack

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Likewise, I hadn't picked up the sad news either. :(
There was a final post in his name, but it went in the General Discussion forum which I don't follow (and I daresay I'm not the only one).

Back on topic - I travelled the line in 1975, the only passengers alighted at an unofficial stopping point. Like Bridport, it didn't have a future, sorry.
This was his final post in the General Discussion section.
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/merry-christmas-and-a-happy-new-year.158384/#post-3255441

That was his penultimate post; his final post being about a railtour that involved a football match at Waterloo station.

The situation at Alston did remind me of the Bridport Branch actually.
 

RichmondCommu

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Sorry to hear of the loss of your best friend, whom I remember well on here. I assumed from his username that he was a working man. Was he taken early then, may I ask? I am sure many others would be interested, with apologies for OT question.

Edit: I once stayed the night in Alston at the pub there. My wife and I got lost. Ah, young love (50 years ago).

Andrew was 51 when he died on the 31st of December 2017. He'd been planning to retire at the 52.
 

RichmondCommu

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Many thanks for all your fantastic responses. If any of you have the money The Alston Branch by the Oakwood Press is well worth purchasing 2nd hand. Interestingly Lord Ridley opened the 'all weather road' on the 3rd May 1976 and yet at the same time campaigned tirelessly to try and stop BR from lifting the track. If he felt so strongly about the railway you would have perhaps thought that he would have not been willing to help celebrate the new road!
 

Mark62

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Have you ever been to Alston? There's absolutely nothing there. The mystery about the Alston branch wasn't that the line closed, it was that it survived as late as 1976.

Alston can barely sustain a bus service- just two off-peak return trips a day to Haltwhistle, with positioning moves from Hexham also run in service- so a train wouldn't stand a hope.

ETA welcome to the forum OP. It's a good question. I think it'll do better as a preserved railway than it ever did commercially. It's a shame the A69 means that the narrow gauge lime can't reach Haltwhistle.

We went to Alston last summer on the bus from Haltwhistle. There's only a few buses a day and they are under threat. I tried advising the passengers on the bus how to go about saving the service and how deregulation works in relation to socially necessary services and no -one was interested. In many ways if their bus service comes off its their own fault. Obviously when it's gone they will them protest when it's too late.
Anyway back to Alston. It's described as a bustling market town. To call Alston dead is an understatement. It's a dreadful place. Holiday cottages are advertised at a grand a week. Are they insane. Half the town is up for sale. The only shop in town doesn't allow dogs. We were the first customers for two hours. They don't deserve customers with such a short sighted policy.
We were there for 44 minutes and it was 44 minutes too long.
The surrounding scenery is stunning. Lambley viaduct is truly amazing. There's no work or life in the area. The town monument still has the buntings up from the silver jubilee 40 years ago.
There's no life in Alston because the people there don't make any effort to make the town more welcoming. It's not dying on its feet it's dead.
Alston has had the worse snow this winter for 35 years. Yes the train would have kept running but the people who live in Alston wouldn't be seen dead on a train as it would be bad for their image. The car is God in Alston.
Move west to Keswick and you see a town that's crying out for a train service. Sadly Cumbria country council is about as anti public transport as you can get. They make Northumberland CC look progressive and that is how bad Cumbria CC are.
Keswick will never get its trains back. There a clear need but no political will whatsoever.
Alston doesn't really need a train service. The locals can't even remove tatty 40 year old flags that make the town look dreadful. Those that would benefit from public transport in the small settlements between Alston and Haltwistle aren't remotely interested in even saving what few buses remain. They told me that the be cut off without the bus. Of course, they want someone else so save their buses.
With such mentalities is it any wonder that Alston and the surrounding settings are dead?
Trains aren't needed in Alston. Trains aren't wanted. Tourists aren't wanted.
It's a sad sad place that's created its own downfall.
 

transmanche

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I tried advising the passengers on the bus how to go about saving the service and how deregulation works in relation to socially necessary services and no -one was interested.
"Shock as man who lectures locals on bus is not welcomed with open arms."

The only shop in town doesn't allow dogs. [...] They don't deserve customers with such a short sighted policy.
Apart from the fact that there is clearly more than one shop in Alston, I don't know of any 'normal' shops that do allow dogs.
 

backontrack

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Move west to Keswick and you see a town that's crying out for a train service. Sadly Cumbria country council is about as anti public transport as you can get. They make Northumberland CC look progressive and that is how bad Cumbria CC are.
Agreed. It is uncertain whether the service will ever come back (apparently Virgin are against it) but that line should certainly never have closed. It'd be pretty much impossible to extend westwards from Keswick too, which is a shame because the return of the TransCumbrian railway could really help some of the west coast towns like Workington.
 

Tetchytyke

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Andrew was 51 when he died on the 31st of December 2017. He'd been planning to retire at the 52.

I'm really very sad to hear that, I had a lot of time for Andrew and respected his views, even if I didn't agree with them.

I'm glad to see you here, do keep posting. An interesting little topic, this one...
 

backontrack

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Meanwhile, does anyone else know about this railway? I googled to see if Nenthead every had a railway - it didn't, but apparently Allendale Town did...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexham_and_Allendale_Railway

Allendale_branch.png
 
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