Ticketing sites offering TFW "Clwb 60" advances without checking entitlement

[AdamWW]

Retailers won't usually surface higher-priced Advance tiers (some do, but not many) that are deemed to be identical to others. They are pointless and a waste of money.

However, technically it's often possible to buy more expensive tickets even when there is a cheaper Advance.

That's what I thought.

So the mechanism that TfW have used to introduce this ticket has also effectively removed advances for those under 60.

Unless they're under 16.

 

[Lewisham2221]

That's what I thought.

So the mechanism that TfW have used to introduce this ticket has also effectively removed advances for those under 60.

Unless they're under 16.

Using the Trainline app and looking for the 12.10 Crewe to Cardiff on Wednesday 25th June, I get:

CLWB 60 £22.29
Advance £39.59
Anytime £84.49

 

[AdamWW]

Using the Trainline app and looking for the 12.10 Crewe to Cardiff on Wednesday 25th June, I get:

CLWB 60 £22.29
Advance £39.59
Anytime £84.49

What are the restrictions for the advance they're showing?

For that train the TfW app also shows Clwb 60 and an advance, but I think the advance is only showing up because it's has GWR + TfW restrictions and is seen as different to the TfW only Clwb 60.

(It's also showing slightly different fares to those above for all of them, including the anytime).

If I change to child fares to prevent the Clwb 60 from showing up (and I find it curious there's actually logic to do that) then I'm offered two advance singles - one for TfW and one for TfW+GWR (which isn't a lot of use I think).

 

[Lewisham2221]

What are the restrictions for the advance they're showing?

For that train the TfW app also shows Clwb 60 and an advance, but I think the advance is only showing up because it's has GWR + TfW restrictions and is seen as different to the TfW only Clwb 60.

(It's also showing slightly different fares to those above for all of them, including the anytime).

If I change to child fares to prevent the Clwb 60 from showing up (and I find it curious there's actually logic to do that) then I'm offered two advance singles - one for TfW and one for TfW+GWR (which isn't a lot of use I think).

Both the CLWB 60 and Advance I just say "Booked TfW services only" as far as I can see. I think the prices I've quoted above are including Trainlines booking fee

 

[AdamWW]

Both the CLWB 60 and Advance I just say "Booked TfW services only" as far as I can see. I think the prices I've quoted above are including Trainlines booking fee

OK I've just tried the Trainline web site for Swansea to Cardiff where I don't think there's a TfW+GWR option to muddy the waters.

It clearly states without having to follow any links that the CLWB 60 ticket is for those 60 or over only, and is also offering a regular advance single.

So full marks to them there.

Where it falls down is their decision to make it hard to get it to show anything but the cheapest fare - it took me a while to find the link hiding right at the bottom of the search results.

But they have still done a much better job of this than TfW have themselves.

 

[yorkie]

I fail to see how this is any different to someone selecting a railcard? It’s common sense that you don’t just select a discount you’re not entitled to…

It is very different; if people are not selecting a discount, then there can be no accusation to that effect.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Saturday at 17:37 ==

What would the outcome be if someone used these tickets whilst ineligible? New ticket/Excess/PF/prosecution? Are these unregulated fares actually backed up be enforceable restrictions?

The ticket should be honoured, but a report submitted to the pricing team, to correct the fare (if they were not already aware of this being looked into).

However, I could not guarantee that all staff who have responsibility for checking tickets would act correctly, as unfortunately there are insufficient safeguards in place to ensure this.

Reminds me of how put out I was on the first weekend I was eligible for Northern’s over-55 northwest ranger and I wasn’t asked to prove my age once!

In my experience of travelling in groups, or travelling with people with certain Railcard discounts and within earshot of people travelling with others, the following outcomes are typical:

Disabled Railcard holders are almost never asked to show their Railcards; Senior Railcard holders are rarely asked to show theirs, which is in sharp contrast to younger people who are usually asked to show Railcards. Some staff members do ask for all Railcards to be shown, and some do not ask for any Railcards to be shown.

Your experience is therefore in line with my expectations!

 

[Benjwri]

It is very different; if people are not selecting a discount, then there can be no accusation to that effect.

Yeah as was pointed out to me, I was misunderstanding what was happening from the post, absolutely agree it is very very poor what happened.

 

[AdamWW]

It is very different; if people are not selecting a discount, then there can be no accusation to that effect.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Saturday at 17:37 ==


The ticket should be honoured, but a report submitted to the pricing team, to correct the fare (if they were not already aware of this being looked into).

However, I could not guarantee that all staff who have responsibility for checking tickets would act correctly, as unfortunately there are insufficient safeguards in place to ensure this.

From a comment earlier in this thread, ticket retailers were informed of this in advance, Playing around with the Trainline suggests that (at least for journeys without splits) they have handled this in a reasonable manner, both warning that the passenger must be 60 or over and also showing an alternative advance fare for those who don't qualify.

Sadly, TfW have not managed to do the same with their own ticket purchasing facilities.

Unfortunately this does not surprise me.

Nor does it surprise me that their communication on the matter to ticket retailers was apparently at extremely short notice and unclear. This is, after all, how they often communicate changes to their own passengers.