Toronto Van Attack

[hexagon789]

Looks like there's been another attack involving a van, this time in Toronto.

BBC article:

Ten people have been killed and 15 injured after a man drove a van into pedestrians in Toronto, police said.

The suspect has been named by police as Alek Minassian, 25.

A man was arrested several streets away following a tense standoff with officers on the street.

Bystander videos appeared to show the driver pointing an object at the officers, who could be heard shouting at him to get down. The man was then detained without any shots being fired.

Toronto deputy police chief Peter Yuen asked for witnesses to come forward and said there would be "a long investigation"....

These horrific attacks really seem to be on the rise sadly.

One wonders of the rise in these sort of attacks means that it will become necessary to blockade our city centres or perhaps only permit certain vehicles into them?

 

[najaB]

Toronto van attack: How is the suspect not dead?

The calm actions of a police officer who arrested the Toronto van suspect without firing a shot have prompted praise and, in some quarters, astonishment.

Video from the scene shows suspect Alek Minassian pointing an object at the officer and shouting: "Kill me!"

The officer tells the man to "get down" and when the suspect says he has a gun, the officer repeats: "I don't care. Get down."

Minassian is then seen lying down and the officer arrests him.

Many in North America are asking how the suspect did not end up dead in a hail of police gunfire. It contrasts with incidents in the US where police have shot and killed unarmed people.

I'm not surprised that people are surprised!

 

[pemma]

Canadians don't generally act and respond to incidents the same way as their noisy neighbours. I was in Canada when the main national news story was wildfires in another part of the country causing havoc including destroying people's homes and people who had lost their homes seemed incredibly calm and composed considering saying things like at least it was only replaceable possessions which were destroyed.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Canadians don't generally act and respond to incidents the same way as their noisy neighbours.

Erm generalising much? Canadians don’t appreciate attacks any less than residents of other countries.

 

[najaB]

Canadians don’t appreciate attacks any less than residents of other countries.

True. They don't, however, respond to the slightest incident with guns blazin' as is far too often the case down in the USA.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

True. They don't, however, respond to the slightest incident with guns blazin' as is far too often the case down in the USA.

I should hope not! Canada is a very civilised country.

 

[hexagon789]

Erm generalising much? Canadians don’t appreciate attacks any less than residents of other countries.

I'm quite sure they don't, I don't think anyone does/would.

True. They don't, however, respond to the slightest incident with guns

I think the officer concerned should be commended for dealing with the perpetrator in such a calm manner without resorting to opening fire.

Considering how horrific the attack was, last night when I posted there was very little info, but if course now 10 people have sadly been taken from us. I quite agree with Trudeau (and I don't often), that the event has saddened me as well.

These attacks seem to be the "new" way of causing mayhem and chaos and I think that vehicle access to many busy areas of towns and cities should perhaps be reviewed in light of all of these attacks.

 

[Jonny]

Apparently, the perpetrator made a post to social media, which apparently has been confirmed, which gives a clue as to his motivations:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43883052
Toronto van attack: Alek Minassian praised 'incel' killer

 

[trash80]

So now we have terror attacks by guys who can't get laid, the world is getting stupider by the minute.

 

[pemma]

Erm generalising much? Canadians don’t appreciate attacks any less than residents of other countries.

There's a huge difference between disapproving of something and thinking someone who did something terrible should be executed with a trial.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Apparently, the perpetrator made a post to social media, which apparently has been confirmed, which gives a clue as to his motivations:

And because he's not Muslim, the focus has now switched away from "terrorist" towards "loner with mental health problems".

But of course.

The pick-up artist (PUA) part of the internet is a very dark part of the internet indeed. Full of rage-filled narcissists living in their mom's basement. That anger goes inwards or it goes outwards, and the PUA lot all stoke each other up more and more. High school shootings are always carried out by these lot, but even then it's amazing more of them don't go on the rampage. Rage-filled narcissists are dangerous people.

These horrific attacks really seem to be on the rise sadly.

Copycat attacks are nothing new.

But yes, I think changes to city centre street furniture could and should be made. It doesn't need to be concrete bollards everywhere. Trees would have the same effect. It's about stopping vehicles- in control or (like the Glasgow bin lorry, out of control) from getting a clean run down a pavement.

 

[najaB]

It doesn't need to be concrete bollards everywhere. Trees would have the same effect.

As could public art.

 

[krus_aragon]

So now we have terror attacks by guys who can't get laid, the world is getting stupider by the minute.

And ones who blame other groups for their problems. Two interesting quotes from a CBC interview on the background and previous incidents:

On the surface, incel sounds harmless. It sounds like someone who is trying to make sense of why they cannot connect with other people.
But the incel community purposely leaves out who they call "females" or "femoids" — women who they say cannot be an incel because women always get sex regardless of how ugly they are.
And they leave out gay people because they think gay people have easier access to sex.
So there is a high degree of misogyny in the community.

... he says that "we will overthrow all the Chads and Stacys." Can you tell us what that's in reference to?
So Chads are cisgendered heterosexual men who are muscular, conventionally attractive, hot. They get whoever they want.
Stacy is someone who pretends to be virtuous and pure in front of an incel and won't touch an incel, but the minute a Stacy meets a Chad, then she will have sex.

Playing to the stereotypes, perhaps two men in their early-to-mid-twenties who are so angry they're still virgins that they want to kill people probably won't get that much sympathy on a railway forum...

As we're on a railway forum, one thing that came to my mind was the thought of how people would be getting home. The intersection of Yonge and Finch, where the incident started, is the northern terminus of Toronto's main subway line (Yonge), and has large parking lots for commuters. The TTC suspended all public service between Finch and Sheppard stations (2 stops south) while the police closed that stretch Yonge Street for its investigation, with no provision of replacement transport. Changing subway lines at Sheppard for the "stubway" wouldn't get you very far either. I wonder how many people walked north from Sheppard to get their cars, and how many had the foresight to take the Spadina-University branch north to Finch West instead, and take a bus back toward Yonge Street.

(Incidentally, as there are no turnback facilities at Sheppard station, the subway trains had to run empty to Finch and back anyhow!)

 

[furnessvale]

But yes, I think changes to city centre street furniture could and should be made. It doesn't need to be concrete bollards everywhere. Trees would have the same effect. It's about stopping vehicles- in control or (like the Glasgow bin lorry, out of control) from getting a clean run down a pavement.

Useful against cyclists as well then.

 

[pemma]

And ones who blame other groups for their problems. Two interesting quotes from a CBC interview on the background and previous incidents:

Playing to the stereotypes, perhaps two men in their early-to-mid-twenties who are so angry they're still virgins that they want to kill people probably won't get that much sympathy on a railway forum...

I'm sure there was an incident in America where someone went on a shooting spree for similar reasons. It's also worth noting while this person wasn't on the police's radar he was identified as a person who had 'special needs' while he was a child.

 

[krus_aragon]

I'm sure there was an incident in America where someone went on a shooting spree for similar reasons. It's also worth noting while this person wasn't on the police's radar he was identified as a person who had 'special needs' while he was a child.

If the event you're thinking of happened in California in 2014, I think that person is the second man discussed in the article I linked to.

 

[hexagon789]

Copycat attacks are nothing new.

True, bit they do seem to be more Colmonell of late, though that may just be my perception of it.

But yes, I think changes to city centre street furniture could and should be made. It doesn't need to be concrete bollards everywhere. Trees would have the same effect. It's about stopping vehicles- in control or (like the Glasgow bin lorry, out of control) from getting a clean run down a pavement.

I appreciate that total closure of City Centres to private road vehicles is rather extreme, so changing the "street furniture" is probably a reasonable workaround.

 

[hexagon789]

I should hope not! Canada is a very civilised country.

Often more civilised than Britain, in some respects.

 

[pemma]

Trees would have the same effect. It's about stopping vehicles- in control or (like the Glasgow bin lorry, out of control) from getting a clean run down a pavement.

Problem with trees is they grow so they would need cutting back regularly otherwise roads would become out-of-bounds for larger lorries and double decker buses. Additionally when they've been there a while the roots quite often causing uneven and broken pavements.

 

[Jonny]

True, bit they do seem to be more Colmonell of late, though that may just be my perception of it.
I appreciate that total closure of City Centres to private road vehicles is rather extreme, so changing the "street furniture" is probably a reasonable workaround.

The way things are going with air quality, it is actually a possibility - at least for "normal" vehicles with high efficiency (likely at the cost of low speed) electric shuttle vehicles taking over for both passenger and freight.

 

[krus_aragon]

I appreciate that total closure of City Centres to private road vehicles is rather extreme, so changing the "street furniture" is probably a reasonable workaround.

And in this particular example, closure would be impractical: Yonge Street is Toronto's equivalent to London's Great North Road: superceded to some extent by motorways, but still a major thoroughfare for vehicles.

 

[amateur]

If the event you're thinking of happened in California in 2014, I think that person is the second man discussed in the article I linked to.

The young man referred to in the 2014 incident was diagnosed with asperger syndrome.

The recent incident in canada makes reference to the person having attended special needs school, and also being a loner!

 

[amateur]

I should hope not! Canada is a very civilised country.

You're not canadian by any chance

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

You're not canadian by any chance

Yes, living in the UK as of 2011 though

 

[hexagon789]

The way things are going with air quality, it is actually a possibility - at least for "normal" vehicles with high efficiency (likely at the cost of low speed) electric shuttle vehicles taking over for both passenger and freight.

Certainly the air quality in Glasgow City Centre could do with being cleaned up a bit.

And in this particular example, closure would be impractical: Yonge Street is Toronto's equivalent to London's Great North Road: superceded to some extent by motorways, but still a major thoroughfare for vehicles.

I can see a full ban would be impractical in many places, but perhaps only certain streets and alterations to layouts would hamper the efforts of those who seek to maim and kill in such a manner?

 

[krus_aragon]

Yes, living in the UK as of 2011 though

But too civilised to say so unless asked directly.

 

[hexagon789]

But too civilised to say so unless asked directly.

Very clever!

 

[Cowley]

But too civilised to say so unless asked directly.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The recent incident in canada makes reference to the person having attended special needs school, and also being a loner!

They never mention that when it's a Muslim person with low intellect who does something like this!

 

[najaB]

They never mention that when it's a Muslim person with low intellect who does something like this!

Nah, brown trumps mental issues.