TPE Nova 1 Class 802/2 Progress

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Whoa what’s with the fabric seats? It’s leather on the Mark 5s is it not? Why not here as well?

 

[td97]

Why is this the case?

One reason is so that the force of the pantograph on the OLE isn't too great. Sort of looks like this if a ' is the pantograph car in use:

125mph: '---- ----'
100mph: ----' ----' or '---- '----
75mph : ----' '----​

If the pantographs are close then a much higher force is experienced by the contact wire. Not sure if it has any power draw implications.

Shouldn't be much of an issue because they aren't expected to run in multiple anyway (perhaps only ECS, but could become common with Calder Valley diversions due to the supposed 39 week TPRU closures), and there are 2 pantographs per unit, so the limitations would only arise if the 'wrong' pantograph had a fault.

It's not unique to these trains or the ECML - it's also a prevalent issue on WCML/GN/GWML with 12 car trains and 3*pantographs in close proximity. In fact the GWML needed infrastructure work for Paddington -> Airport Jn. for such formations IIRC.

 

[paddyb6]

In reply to an earlier post - the services will be the following:
Class 802 "NOVA 1": Liverpool/Manchester Airport to Newcastle/Edinburgh via Leeds and York (ECML)
Class 397 "NOVA 2": Liverpool/Manchester Airport to Glasgow/Edinburgh via Preston and Carlisle (WCML)
Cl.68+Mk5s "NOVA 3": Liverpool to Scarborough and Manchester Airport to Middlesborough
Class 185s: Manchester Airport to Cleethorpes and Manchester to Leeds/Hull Stopping Services
Class 350s: To go to WM Trains following the introduction of the Class 397s.

 

[Harvey B]

In reply to an earlier post - the services will be the following:
Class 802 "NOVA 1": Liverpool/Manchester Airport to Newcastle/Edinburgh via Leeds and York (ECML)
Class 397 "NOVA 2": Liverpool/Manchester Airport to Glasgow/Edinburgh via Preston and Carlisle (WCML)
Cl.68+Mk5s "NOVA 3": Liverpool to Scarborough and Manchester Airport to Middlesborough
Class 185s: Manchester Airport to Cleethorpes and Manchester to Leeds/Hull Stopping Services
Class 350s: To go to WM Trains following the introduction of the Class 397s.

Will the Leeds to Huddersfield service still exist after the new stock is introduced?

 

[paddyb6]

Will the Leeds to Huddersfield service still exist after the new stock is introduced?

Unsure - but will be operated by 185s

 

[Harvey B]

Unsure - but will be operated by 185s

Thanks

 

[gimmea50anyday]

There will still be some NCL/MBR-MIA services still operated by 185s but they will mainly be used on HUL-MAN, south route and stopper trains. They wi also potentially be used on LIV-NOT (EMT) services, the destinations Leicester and Nottingham are included in the "Get Me Home" destination display list on the CIS system

 

[68011]

Indeed I've pointed this out before perhaps not on here but elsewhere there aren't enough sets of Mk5A's available to run on both routes, All the Scarborough services are Mk5A's which requires. 7 sets, The Middlesbrough route also requires 7 sets however only 5 x MK5A sets available for that route so at least 2 Middlesbrough diagrams will be worked by 185's.

 

[Japan0913]

by the way···.
1. In the northeast, Nova1's destinations are only Newcastle and Edinburgh?
2. Is Class 185 assigned to HUll?
3. Is Class 185 assigned to Sheffield (or Nottingham)?
4. Will TPE's local services be transferred to Northern Rail if the Northern Rail vehicle shortage is resolved?

1-3 yes, 4 no

In reply to an earlier post - the services will be the following:
Class 802 "NOVA 1": Liverpool/Manchester Airport to Newcastle/Edinburgh via Leeds and York (ECML)
Class 397 "NOVA 2": Liverpool/Manchester Airport to Glasgow/Edinburgh via Preston and Carlisle (WCML)
Cl.68+Mk5s "NOVA 3": Liverpool to Scarborough and Manchester Airport to Middlesborough
Class 185s: Manchester Airport to Cleethorpes and Manchester to Leeds/Hull Stopping Services
Class 350s: To go to WM Trains following the introduction of the Class 397s.

thanks you！

If Nottingham Service is added, will TPE run out of vehicles?

 

[LOL The Irony]

thanks you！

If Nottingham Service is added, will TPE run out of vehicles?

No, they'll keep more 185's. Some rumours are floating around of them keeping all 51.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm not seeing any sign of progress on this issue at all. I get the feeling it's one of those caveats that'll be in there for years with nothing actually done...

Given that you have to be an idiot to climb up there, I'm not sure I'm actually bothered about that. Has anyone actually been reported as being that stupid yet?

 

[LOL The Irony]

Whoa what’s with the fabric seats? It’s leather on the Mark 5s is it not? Why not here as well?

IIRC those seats will be replaced with the TPE ones come entry to service. Also, read what Ainsworth said .

 

[LittleAH]

thanks you！

If Nottingham Service is added, will TPE run out of vehicles?

I think someone on here posted TPE are keeping 30 our of the 51, so you'd imagine they'd keep all 51 if they do operate the Nottingham.

 

[themiller]

Why is this the case?

Basically, the front pantograph generates ‘ripples’ in the contact wire so the further away the second pantograph is the lower the tendency to bounce and thus cause arcing between pantograph carbon rubbing strip and the copper wire. Arcing causes pitting in both carbon and copper which is bad. Lowering the speed also reduces the tendency for bounce in the second pantograph.

 

[anamyd]

IIRC those seats will be replaced with the TPE ones come entry to service. Also, read what Ainsworth said .

aren't they already "TPE ones"...? they have the TPE star logo at the top...?

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Given that you have to be an idiot to climb up there, I'm not sure I'm actually bothered about that. Has anyone actually been reported as being that stupid yet?

Yes, tho not with these.

Someone larking about threw his mates shoe onto the roof of a voyager at Durham. He used the cable connections to attempt to climb up onto the roof of the voyager to retrieve it turning himself into a human pantograph in the process, think he survived but received life changing injuries.

Voyagers haven't been required to change their cables but this likely a contributing reason why they want the 802s doing.

 

[LOL The Irony]

aren't they already "TPE ones"...? they have the TPE star logo at the top...?

They will be upgraded to the TPE standard. The first 2 units didn't come in this standard.

 

[modernrail]

They will be upgraded to the TPE standard. The first 2 units didn't come in this standard.

Does this mean that somebody is footing the bill for designing, fitting and then throwing away perfectly good fabric (even if not for train seats) x 2 trains? That seems like an really stupid waste of both money and resources.

 

[CosherB]

Does this mean that somebody is footing the bill for designing, fitting and then throwing away perfectly good fabric (even if not for train seats) x 2 trains? That seems like an really stupid waste of both money and resources.

Either that or rubbish intel.

 

[ainsworth74]

We're starting to wander off-topic in multiple directions here. Discussion in relation to Liverpool - Norwich being split and the possible inclusion, therefore, of Liverpool - Nottingham in the Transpennine Franchise should be discussed in the existing thread about this topic which can be found here. The discussion around Mk5s and their introduction should be carried out in the existing thread about that topic which can be found here.

This thread should be used to discuss the introduction of TPEs Class 802/2s only not for any other reason. Please ensure that future posts remain on topic as further off-topic posts may be deleted without warning.

 

[anamyd]

Yes, tho not with these.

Someone larking about threw his mates shoe onto the roof of a voyager at Durham. He used the cable connections to attempt to climb up onto the roof of the voyager to retrieve it turning himself into a human pantograph in the process, think he survived but received life changing injuries.

Voyagers haven't been required to change their cables but this likely a contributing reason why they want the 802s doing.

You mean Pendolinos, right...? Voyagers are the diesel-powered ones

 

[Bletchleyite]

You mean Pendolinos, right...? Voyagers are the diesel-powered ones

If there's 25kV there, it doesn't matter if what you climb on top of is powered by diesel or electricity, you'll still get fried.

(And yes, he means a Voyager, Pendos don't go to Durham)

 

[anamyd]

If there's 25kV there, it doesn't matter if what you climb on top of is powered by diesel or electricity, you'll still get fried.

(And yes, he means a Voyager, Pendos don't go to Durham)

Double d'oh! it's very early in the morning for me so my thinking cap is still booting up, apologies

 

[transmanche]

Someone larking about threw his mates shoe onto the roof of a voyager at Durham. He used the cable connections to attempt to climb up onto the roof of the voyager to retrieve it turning himself into a human pantograph in the process, think he survived but received life changing injuries.

The victim actually died a week after the incident.

Although reports at the time of the incident suggested that the shoe might have been thrown onto the roof by 'thugs', at the inquest it was revealed that the victim "was seen imitating a 'penalty kick', which saw his trainer fly off his foot and on to the roof of a stationary train".

Source: Evening Chronicle

 

[tpjm]

They will be upgraded to the TPE standard. The first 2 units didn't come in this standard.

These are the final seats for first class. The units you refer to had the standard Hitachi interior.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Yeah that's the one, although my recollections at the time this was on the northbound platform so people were on the way to Newcastleto the game and for daytime drink sessions.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

TPE 802 just passed me south of Northallerton (10:35) heading south on the slows - 5Q90 - and there's one chasing me up the ECML northbound too, 5Q73 according to OpenTrainTimes

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Looks like 5Q73 just spun around at Darlington and about to form 5Q74. Must be one of LNERs units in that case.

 

[Fez14]

There has been plenty of night return runs between the Heaton depot (Newcastle) and Manchester the past week, such as last night. Anything to report? Hearing the CAF sets become increasingly delayed, is there a chance the 802's could enter service before them?

 

[tpjm]

Of all the programmes, the Cl802 is on the most 'on-schedule' so effort is being made to ensure it stays that way. That said, I doubt we'll see them before the Mk5a coaches.