Trivia: Stations with surviving run-around loops?

[Peter Sarf]

Having just gone off topic with 745s I just wondered how many stations are there left where it is possible for a locomotive to change ends of the train?

As in the loco would uncouple, then move to the other end of the train, couple up and haul the train back to where it came from.

It's probably worth explaining as so many younger ones will never have been aware of this once very common, indeed essential, part of railway operation .

 

[30907]

It happens regularly at Skipton (with freight, but in principle possible with passenger) and could happen at almost any through station with several platforms and associated pointwork.
I wonder whether you should restrict the thread to terminus stations?
In which case Fort William and Mallaig for starters (and regularly used until this weekend!). Pwllheli, Morecambe.

 

[TheEdge]

Great Yarmouth can still technically do it. Somehow the ground frame between platforms 2 and 3 survived the resignalling. If it'll ever be used however...

 

[John Webb]

The vast majority of preserved railways have such facilities of course. But I assume you are asking about the national network?

 

[DelW]

Whitby, for the same reason as at Fort William and Mallaig.

Blaenau Ffestiniog, which might be unique in having two run round loops, though of course only one standard gauge NR one.

 

[Richard Scott]

Know it's outside the UK but sure Paris Est still has run round facilities on a few platforms.

 

[Ianno87]

Manchester Piccadilly still has a ground frame between Platforms 5 and 6.

 

[43 302]

Last time I saw it happen was this month at Rhymney with 37 418. But this service has now ended.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I'm pretty sure there is still a run round fitted at one platform in Norwich, but I don't think it's been used for many years now and it's probably just waiting until the track itself is renewed before it gets removed?

 

[43 302]

Edinburgh Waverly still has it for the Caledonian Sleeper. Does anyone know about New street or temple meads?

 

[hexagon789]

Having just gone off topic with 745s I just wondered how many stations are there left where it is possible for a locomotive to change ends of the train.

As in uncouple, then move to the other end of the train, couple up and haul the train back to where it came from. Probably worth explaining as so many younger ones will never have been aware of this once very common, indeed essential, part of railway operation .

Many large stations never had run rounds anyway, the method of engine change being shunt release.

 

[43 302]

Many large stations never had run rounds anyway, the method of engine change being shunt release.

What is shunt release, is that what they do with the sleeper at Penzance? Also, what did they do at Euston. I've seen videos of LHCS pull into the platform with no DVT, how did the loco get to the front?

 

[hexagon789]

What is shunt release, is that what they do with the sleeper at Penzance? Also, what did they do at Euston. I've seen videos of LHCS pull into the platform with no DVT, how did the loco get to the front?

With shunt release, train arrives with loco at front (buffer end). This loco detaches and pulls forward slightly.

Another loco attaches at the other end, this loco then hauls the train away. The previous loco then follows the train out afterwards and runs off to sidings or the depot etc.

This was the practice at Glasgow Central, Glasgow Queen Street and I think at Euston as well, but I don't know Euston well enough to be sure

 

[Whistler40145]

What is shunt release, is that what they do with the sleeper at Penzance? Also, what did they do at Euston. I've seen videos of LHCS pull into the platform with no DVT, how did the loco get to the front?

At Euston another loco would drop onto the stock for the next departure and then once departed the main loco would leave light engine to the sidings and work the next service

 

[Pinus contorta]

At Euston another loco would drop onto the stock for the next departure and then once departed the main loco would leave light engine to the sidings and work the next service

This sounds like the same thing that happened at Manchester Piccadilly when I was a kid.

 

[Taunton]

At Euston another loco would drop onto the stock for the next departure and then once departed the main loco would leave light engine to the sidings and work the next service

When the DVTs came along they made a huge difference to the productivity of the locomotives, which now just worked back and forth with the same stock all day. The previous diagrams never worked out as simplistically as just take the next one, there were all sorts of inefficiencies in diagramming. I seem to recall one platform at Euston was used just as a loco storage. It very notably reduced the number of locos required, and gave some maintenance issues as daily mileages were now much higher than previously.

 

[matchmaker]

Oban has (or had).

 

[Mike99]

At Euston another loco would drop onto the stock for the next departure and then once departed the main loco would leave light engine to the sidings and work the next service

Am I right in thinking Paddington was the same?

 

[thejuggler]

Bradford Interchange - it also has in place a 'fouling point' sign. Not sure how often the facility is used.

 

[d9009alycidon]

Capability is still there at Stranraer, but most if not all loco hauled excurstions run top and tail to Ayr or Girvan. Ayr sees regular run-rounds as the Grangemouth to Prestwick tanks does that in the station.

 

[InOban]

Oban has (or had).

Still has. Was renewed last year along with the rest of the platform tracks.

 

[FGW_DID]

Am I right in thinking Paddington was the same?

Yes, I believe the Loco used to follow behind the empty stock at a safe distance up to the signal then await its own proceed aspect.

 

[ac6000cw]

Yes, I believe the Loco used to follow behind the empty stock at a safe distance up to the signal then await its own proceed aspect.

That was common practice at large terminal and through stations where trains terminated or reversed - I used to train spot a lot at B'ham New Street in the 70's and that is exactly what happened with most XC trains that reversed or changed traction (electric/diesel), followed by the light loco setting back into one of the stabling sidings at either end of the station or into one of stabling loops between certain platforms until its next working. The terminating IC trains from Euston generally did loco run-arounds though, as they had sufficient turnaround time which also allowed the considerable Royal Mail traffic they carried to be loaded and unloaded.

I think it was more the smaller terminal stations that made regular use of 'release roads' since the the 'train engine' would have to do everything in those sort of places e.g. run into the platform on arrival, then when empty maybe push the train back (out) enough to clear the crossover or loop points, detach from the train, run forward and then back through the points and along the release track and through more points to get back to the platform line at the other end of the train. Then reverse onto the train, get coupled up, do the brake test, and maybe finally push the whole train back to clear the platform starting signal.

You can see why avoiding all that runaround rigmarole was attractive...

 

[Ianno87]

With shunt release, train arrives with loco at front (buffer end). This loco detaches and pulls forward slightly.

Another loco attaches at the other end, this loco then hauls the train away. The previous loco then follows the train out afterwards and runs off to sidings or the depot etc.

This was the practice at Glasgow Central, Glasgow Queen Street and I think at Euston as well, but I don't know Euston well enough to be sure

This sounds like the same thing that happened at Manchester Piccadilly when I was a kid.

Manchester Piccadilly, and Liverpool Lime Street for loco-hauled Cross Country services up until the early 2000s.

 

[hexagon789]

Manchester Piccadilly, and Liverpool Lime Street for loco-hauled Cross Country services up until the early 2000s.

I think arguably, at major city termini where space was often at a premium, shunt release was probably more common than running round

 

[bishdunster]

Pretty certain none exist now, but some terminal stations had a traverser or sector plate at the terminal end, a few (Ventnor?) had a turntable!

 

[Class195]

Bradford Interchange still has two.

 

[Whistler40145]

Oban has a crossover with a working ground frame

 

[gazthomas]

Holyhead

Also still possible in Llandudno?

 

[Marton]

Whitby regained one with the restoration of P2