TRIVIA - Things you saw travelling on BR that you don't see today

[D Foster]

noticing the post about getting naval officers back to base I recall that most staff would watch out for any forces trying to get back to base before a 48 hour expired. This would mainly be on a Sunday afternoon/evening. As in the 1970s most signalmen and foremen had done National Service they would usually do all they could to help - especially if the service had gone up the spout. This could easily involve holding back Class 1 trains and letting a Class 2 into a platform first so that a connection could be made. The grapevine was used to forward necessary info to get people back to base - sometimes over very long distances. Also unofficial stops could be achieved for forces people to hop onto a train by signal checking a train in a platform. As I recall some of the guards (usually younger and not ex-forces) would yell and shout but they would catch an earful from the older staff - if they made any reports they would find themselves reported for anything and everything.

The grapevine reminds me of another lost feature - the omnibus telephones. Excellent - better than the internet and texting. In theory a user buzzed a code for where he wanted to speak to - in practice you buzzed and everyone picked up and listened. Much faster communication and everyone was "in the loop". Monday morning after the rush hour was bragging time.

 

[AY1975]

Towards the end of the BR era in the early to mid 1990s, BR introduced colour-coded waiting zones (Blue Zone, Purple Zone, Gold Zone, etc) at stations served by InterCity trains to help you wait in the correct part of the platform for whichever coach you wanted.

There were signs located at intervals along the platform, and posters inviting you to "zone in on your seat", telling you which coach would stop in which zone. Naturally, 1st class was normally in the Gold Zone, but of course trains sometimes turned up (and still do turn up) in reverse formation.

Today, Virgin East Coast and Hull Trains have their own system of waiting zones, but instead of coloured zones, they just have signs saying wait here for Coach A, wait here for Coach B, etc.

 

[Bletchleyite]

There are still a few of those knocking about.

VTWC have just implemented a more granular system using numbers marked on the platform itself, by the way.

 

[Foxcote]

Memories from 1950’s and 60’s.
Cheap tickets for Commercial Travellers, Workmen,(early morning returns) also included arrangements for shift workers, Anglers, who had to produce a fishing club card. (This was withdrawn 6/58). Forces Leave at 5/7ths the normal fare. When issuing a child ticket if no printed stock held, using a special clipper on the bottom of the ticket to clip out the shape of an upturned boat. These bits from the ticket had to be saved for the audit.

Mark 1 CK coach, the middle window of the second class compartment was hinged to allow a stretcher to be loaded direct into the compartment. Prisoners by train - had to have a reserved compartment. Corpses by passenger train-the sole use of a BG or similar which was charged by the mileage, unloading fish trains with wet ice and dry ice, unaccompanied animals by train, usually on a lead, but I recall a hectic time trying to hold on to a goat that had eaten his tether and did not want to go into a small holding area, then there was the greyhound that sprinted up the line when released by the guard. Happy days!

The guard’s favourite animal had to be calves in sacks, each usually about 70/80 lbs in weight. I had to load up to six on a four wheel truck and take over a bumpy boarded crossing to another platform, by the time the train arrived all calves had wet their sacks.
There were 8 types of labels to stick on parcels to show payment made, including third party charges such as shipping, Customs,Irish rail etc, free or to pay delivery and if sender of consignee should pay. Clerk at sending Station to work out cost from a number of books.

Rules. Single line working at a junction with more than one route but no crossover, Junction Pilotman appointed who had to wear TWO armbands and work to a crossover at another point, whilst the other Pilotman would work from the opposite end to the Junction stop signal. In every case of SLW the Pilotman had to personally visit all affected boxes and crossings. It was not permitted to use a telephone and dictate instructions. On prearranged jobs on the main lines, the Pilotman was often provided with a locomotive to assist working and deal with any failed trains. An old hand told me “never leave your engine behind”.

When communication was lost between boxes, failures/theft etc, if the TOS had been received,it was permitted to introduce Time Interval working. ( Reg 25 a iv ) First train under this arrangement to carry a ticket and advise all concerned en route. Gone also are the days of Wrong Line Orders, when as one simplified example;if a train failed in section, the fireman may have to walk to the box in advance with a ticket signed by the driver, to allow the signalman to send assistance in a wrong line movement to the failed train. The ticket stated that the driver would not move his train.

 

[Taunton]

The grapevine reminds me of another lost feature - the omnibus telephones. In theory a user buzzed a code for where he wanted to speak to - in practice you buzzed and everyone picked up and listened.

You could just do one ding on the block bell to your neighbour, an unofficial signal to them to come to the phone without everyone else knowing there was a conversation in progress.

Gerry Fiennes, as ever in his book "I Tried to Run a Railway", had the best story. Chief Inspector was well regarded, but known behind his back as "The Old Bugger". He went to visit one signalbox, then moved on to the next. Entering, he happened to hear one ding on the block bell. He beat the signalman to pick up the phone.
"Watch out Sid, the Old Bugger's coming".
"Old Bugger speaking" was his reply.

 

[Welshman]

Gerry Fiennes, as ever in his book "I Tried to Run a Railway", had the best story. Chief Inspector was well regarded, but known behind his back as "The Old Bugger". He went to visit one signalbox, then moved on to the next. Entering, he happened to hear one ding on the block bell. He beat the signalman to pick up the phone.
"Watch out Sid, the Old Bugger's coming".
"Old Bugger speaking" was his reply.

Please pardon this hijack, but Fiennes tells a similar story against himself in his sequel "Fiennes on Rails"

As the new G.M. of the Western Region, he was so impressed by the driver's gaining 11 minutes on the schedule when going down to Cardiff hauled by a [then] new diesel loco, he got out at Newport to congratulate him.

When he had flashed his cab pass and settled-in, the driver said:-
"They tell me the new General Manager's on the train"
"He was, but he got out at Newport" he replied.
"He should have gone on to Cardiff" the driver replied. "I wonder where the silly b's got to"
"Here" he replied.
Followed by much laughter from the driver.

Perhaps we should start a "Gerry Fienne's anecdotes" thread.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Taunton & Welshman Excellent stuff!

Never managed to acquire copies of either of those books, thanks for posting

 

[Taunton]

Never managed to acquire copies of either of those books

Significant elements of ITTRAR are ion the web here

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id...IMTAB#v=onepage&q=OLD BUGGER SPEAKING&f=false

 

[D Foster]

You could just do one ding on the block bell to your neighbour, an unofficial signal to them to come to the phone without everyone else knowing there was a conversation in progress.

Gerry Fiennes, as ever in his book "I Tried to Run a Railway", had the best story. Chief Inspector was well regarded, but known behind his back as "The Old Bugger". He went to visit one signalbox, then moved on to the next. Entering, he happened to hear one ding on the block bell. He beat the signalman to pick up the phone.
"Watch out Sid, the Old Bugger's coming".
"Old Bugger speaking" was his reply.

A solitary beat on the bell would work where "call attention" was not required - but - elsewhere we would hold the key down on the beat. This came out as "ding - thunk" at the other end. It was heavily frowned upon by managers and S&T.

Variations on the tale occur everywhere. As does the myth of the change from level crossing gates to lifting barriers. Possibly every local news rag in the land ran the story that a little old lady was in the habit of securing her little dog's lead to the gates - with the result that the new barriers hauled it up into the air.

Another memory of things no-longer seen... Mess rooms almost always had at least one gas ring on which an ancient iron kettle boiled 24/7/365. It was compulsory to not run it low and also to not top up with too much cold water - affecting the next "come to the boil". I knew of a guard who thought it funny to repeatedly fully fill the kettle (about 2 gallon) with cold water just before several drivers and guards would be making quick turn-arounds. I don't think he suffered any broken ribs but he did gain a lot of bruises.
Of course neither large kettles nor summary justice could possibly be permitted these days. Back in the 70s bad/stupid staff could have their heads knocked together and even be knocked out cold if their "crime" warranted it. Anyone that would opt to squawk simply wouldn't last on the job.
Back then Form 1s usually only occurred if/when something would come to the notice of senior management, the Inspectorate or the public. Most discipline was dealt with off the record unless it had to show up. One of the favourite expressions was "No name. No pack drill". Most times you knew that a real manager or Inspector would already know what had gone on - because they knew the job - and had probably either seen or done the thing themselves at some earlier date. Then we got "Management Trainees" and paperwork for everything. From a dinosaur's viewpoint - you can't pay 100% attention to the job if you have to spend time looking over your shoulder.
If you did mess up in a silly way you prayed for the next person to mess up soon - so that you would finish being the one having the Mickey taken out of you. People often gained their nickname from a silly (non-injury) incident.

 

[pitdiver]

I was talking about this thread with my wife. She remembers taking a large traditional pram down to our local station and change platforms by way of the barrow crossing without any staff being present. However this was when there was 1 train per hour Mon-Sat and 1 train per 2 hrs on a Sunday.

 

[shap summit]

Ah forces discount, all you had to do was flash your ID card at the booking office to get it. Lost track of the times I used it to go for all night and day spotting trips up and down the western region as it was then. Summer weekends at Bristol T. M. Was my favorite, all the trains would change locos there, and the shed was opposite the platforms and there was always something going on.
Another thing not seen today I guess are forces leave trains. I remember getting them from Ipswich to London and back three times a year and then, after I was drafted, Abroath to London several times.

 

[matt_world2004]

Joint revenue ops with London Underground. Something that procedurally changed and I beleive there was a lot more sharing of facilities with london transport.

 

[Cowley]

Some of the posts over the last couple of days on this thread have been absolute gold. As Ash Bridge said thanks for posting them folks.

 

[broadgage]

A public telephone in the train? (158s)

Thanks,
Ross

Also on HSTs, very revolutionary

 

[Busaholic]

I think you've got the conversion factors slightly out - two and a half new pence equates to six old pence.

The old sixpence coin was kept on after decimalisation for a while, after a campaign led (from behind the scenes) by London Transport who didn't want to change all their 'flat fare' machines on the buses, specifically the Red Arrow routes, or to be seen to be surreptitiously putting fares up.

 

[D Foster]

I was talking about this thread with my wife. She remembers taking a large traditional pram down to our local station and change platforms by way of the barrow crossing without any staff being present. However this was when there was 1 train per hour Mon-Sat and 1 train per 2 hrs on a Sunday.

In the days of proper signals (aka semaphores) a lot of the public out in the wilder places broadly knew what the signals meant and were essentially safe using the board crossings unsupervised. Also, those were non-compensation times so people used their eyes and ears and didn't put themselves at risk. Then , under BR, with the media stirring trouble whenever they could we had the "nasty train hit a poor innocent car on a level crossing" era. Has anyone noticed how that has stopped with privatisation?
Post semaphore signals and station signalboxes we now have miniature-traffic-light foot crossings. The white light crossings that appeared for a time were mainly for authorised walkways for staff although I suspect a few may have been for public use as well.

 

[tsr]

There are all sorts of archaic level crossing ideas, both past and occasionally present. One or two in my area are audio only - just a bell, no lights!

 

[yorksrob]

Then , under BR, with the media stirring trouble whenever they could we had the "nasty train hit a poor innocent car on a level crossing" era. Has anyone noticed how that has stopped with privatisation?
Post semaphore signals and station signalboxes we now have miniature-traffic-light foot crossings.

No, because it hasn't.

 

[Olaf]

Once travelled from Liverpool to Leeds on a class 124 (I think). Freezing cold, and no heating. After we set-off there was a terrific draft. All the open windows were quickly closed by others but still there was the draft. Finally discovered a great hole in the floor in a corner of the carriage where the material (can not recall if it was wood or metal - I thought the former) appeared to have rotted away.

 

[yorksrob]

Thumpers (mainly 205's in my case) throwing out vast quantities of heat into the passenger accommodation in the middle of winter. Very cosy !

 

[cjp]

Guards compartments.

Sending luggage in advance.

Station Hotels.

A double decked train - Southern Region?

A penny slot machine with a big pointer that one could turn to emboss a metal name strip - on Lowestoft station as I recall back in the days when steam was going out and diesels coming in.

Sitting in the front of a diesel looking out along the line but the next year they, the drivers, just kept the blinds down all day and spoilt things:-x

 

[Howezy_21]

Guards compartments.

I know the 450s have one, and I assume that the 444s and 350s would have one as well but could be wrong. Though I'm not sure how much use they actually get.

 

[BestWestern]

Guards compartments.

Sending luggage in advance.

Station Hotels.

A double decked train - Southern Region?

A penny slot machine with a big pointer that one could turn to emboss a metal name strip - on Lowestoft station as I recall back in the days when steam was going out and diesels coming in.

Sitting in the front of a diesel looking out along the line but the next year they, the drivers, just kept the blinds down all day and spoilt things:-x

The ill-fated double decker was indeed a Southern Region oddity! It wasn't very good by all accounts, unless you had a foot fetish!

 

[Kite159]

I know the 450s have one, and I assume that the 444s and 350s would have one as well but could be wrong. Though I'm not sure how much use they actually get.

444s have one, opposite a buffet counter.

350/1s have the compartment but are not used, other subclasses don't.

 

[BestWestern]

444s have one, opposite a buffet counter.

Not for much longer though, I gather. Firstgroup are ripping them out, aren't they?

 

[Olaf]

Driver thinking he could walk away from a service part way through the journey as part of industrial action, only to have passengers join him in the cab to encourage him to complete the journey.

 

[OuterDistant]

London termini names without their "London" prefix.

The prefix is a helpful thing to have nowadays, IMHO - for overseas visitors, etc.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

cjp might have been thinking of the guards van areas that units like piggies used to have, ideal locations for storing a number of bikes

 

[broadgage]

Guards compartments.

Sending luggage in advance.

Station Hotels.

A double decked train - Southern Region?

A penny slot machine with a big pointer that one could turn to emboss a metal name strip - on Lowestoft station as I recall back in the days when steam was going out and diesels coming in.

Sitting in the front of a diesel looking out along the line but the next year they, the drivers, just kept the blinds down all day and spoilt things:-x

The double deck trains ran from Charing cross IIRC and possibly elsewhere, Southern "Bulleid DD" stock IIRC.
Not proper double deck trains in which one could walk along the upper deck, but split level compartments with a short set of stairs to the upper level.
I am showing my age by admitting to having travelled on these !
Remains of at least one unit still exist.

 

[Taunton]

The double deck trains ran from Charing cross IIRC and possibly elsewhere, Southern "Bulleid DD" stock IIRC.

Bizarrely it had such extended dwell times due to the additional passenger numbers using one door to two compartments that it had to be confined to lesser routes where it could not do much damage to the throughput. Into the 1960s it was used on just a peak hour service from Plumstead to Cannon Street, not the busiest of services. It normally spent the rest of its time in Plumstead sidings. After all the SUB units were replaced by EPB on the Eastern Section, it was the only set on the whole Section which still had the older straight air brake and different controls.