Trolling

[Smudger105e]

I am not going to go into details, as these have been in the news over the last few days, where an individual apparently decided to take their own life rather than face up to the accusations of trolling.

First, it seems after a little research that the term trolling is not very well defined. If some makes a comment on someone elses post on here for example, some may consider it trolling, some may call it spam and some may call it flaming.

I also find it interesting why people feel that they should troll anyone. It seems to occur on such places as pages 'in memoriam' pages for deceased individuals, usually younger people, and other such places. But what does the troll (as I shall call them for brevity) get out of putting upsetting comments on these pages? I don't understand it at all.

Trolling also seems to take different forms, such as the incident I previously alluded to where the individual had made over 4000 tweets on a subject in under a year.

I am honestly having difficulty understanding the motivation for such behaviour. Can anyone explain it to me in simple terms?

Finally, I implore everyone to check what they are posting anywhere, particularly unmoderated sites such as twitter and facebook, and put themselves as if they are on the receiving end of the message. It could be serious!!

 

[Strathclyder]

From what I've seen, some of them do it just for the hell of it.

 

[Clip]

Trolling itself was always going on a forum and then saying something which would then flame the situation and then leave after causing chaos.

Nowadays its something different, it can be just abuse towards someone else but what has made me really wonder about this case in the news the last week is that not one tweet was actualy @ the McCans. She always used a # to speak about them. And why is it that no one can have that opinion of them without being shot down?Lots of forums out there where you cant speak about it. Why?

Why is this issue one that seemingly divides the nation yet anything negative gets shot down,locked down and gets told that you are inhuman for putting the opposite view across?

And worse than that why are we letting the media set the agenda on such an issue so much so that a reporter hunted this woman down , put her on television against her will and made her think that her life was now not worth living so she topped it.


She wasnt trolling, she was having an opinion,maybe not in the nicest way at times(if you see the tweets then comment if not then dont) but she is like everyone - entitled to their opinion.Thats not trolling. And dont let the media tell you otherwise.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Agree with every word Clip said.

 

[carriageline]

I completely agree with chip. Trolling, in my eyes is saying something (sometimes harsh or hurtful), deliberately trying to get a response and to get people to bite. The trolls I normally see on twitter and the like are normally anonymous or a fake profile (like posting on a video of a train "all trains are gay and anyone who likes trains it's probably a pedophile (unfortunately I have seen that!). She was fighting for something she believed in.

Stating your opinion isn't trolling, but you have to be careful how, and what you say. When I use social media etc, I ask the question "would I say/ask that to the person in public/to their face", if the answer is no I probably wouldn't say it.

Therefore, sometimes you can't say something harsh or rude, even if it is your opinion, just because the internet can hide you. Some people have racist opinions, but that doesn't mean they can go on twitter and air that, which again happens because the internet offers then anonymity that real life doesn't (of course, this is a very extreme example, but you get the Picture)

The biggest thing that needs to be looked at here is how sky news set out on a witch hunt of an innocent lady, which really sadly ended up in her death RIP


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[swj99]

The word 'troll', along with several other words, has become so used and abused that it is effectively worn out, and has lost most of the credibility and impact it once had. The word is frequently used as a label for, or a weapon against another person in an argument when disagreements arise.

Examples of other words which have been misused to the point they are worn out, and difficult to take seriously anymore, are -

Racist
Expert
Cool
Guaranteed

You can probably think of plenty more.

 

[starrymarkb]

The McCanns have pretty serious lawyers and contacts in the media. There is a lot fishy about that case so it's bound to be discussed. I used to work with someone who believed the parents killed her either accidentally or on purpose and concealed the body and with some of the evidence I can see where she was coming on that.

 

[455driver]

They have certainly failed to convincingly answer some direct questions thats for sure!

Would anyone on here put their children to bed and then leave them in an unlocked hotel room while they went out on the lash?
I certainly wouldnt!

 

[Johnny_w]

Clip sums it up perfectly for me.

However no one is truly 'anonymous' on the internets and should someone put enough effort your real identity could be found.

 

[GatwickDepress]

Clip's pretty much explained my opinion better than I ever could! Accusations of trolling is used far too often to stifle criticism and debate, as well as neatly sidestepping having to actually answer a given question.

 

[richw]

Would anyone on here put their children to bed and then leave them in an unlocked hotel room while they went out on the lash?
I certainly wouldnt!

I wouldn't neither.

I have opinions on this matter but dare not comment as they seem to launch legal action against anyone who does.
I always thought it to be a criminal offence to leave children under a certain age alone.

 

[Johnuk123]

I always thought it to be a criminal offence to leave children under a certain age alone.

There is no actual age specified but the law states that Parents can be prosecuted if they leave a child unsupervised ‘in a manner likely to cause unnecessary suffering or injury to health’.

There is no age limit just a general rule about coming to harm if unsupervised.

 

[Drsatan]

While I agree with Clip's sentiments, I also think that trolling of TOC twitter feeds is unhelpful and leads to the feed admin getting into knots.

However, by blocking the troll, the troll can then claim martyrdom status which is then accepted by other users who think the TOC wants to stifle criticism of their operations.

The best way to deal with a troll is to just ignore it, whether the matter being discussed is the McCann's case or overcrowding on peak-time departures.

 

[455driver]

I wouldn't neither.

I have opinions on this matter but dare not comment as they seem to launch legal action against anyone who does.
I always thought it to be a criminal offence to leave children under a certain age alone.

It depends on which 'class' you are in, us working class lot would be dragged in front of the Judge, for the other 'classes' I couldnt possibly comment!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Accusations of trolling is used far too often to stifle criticism and debate, as well as neatly sidestepping having to actually answer a given question.

In the three and a half years that I have been a member of this website, I can bring to mind (without naming any forum usernames) about five instances of outright " trolling for trolling sake" that led to the eventual departure of those unfortunate individuals from this website.

None of the instances involved "stifling criticism and debate" as in every case, the subject chosen by the said trolls were ones that could easily be countered effectively by those forum members with an incisive mind and also with not a little amount of sarcasm inbuilt into posting responses once the weak points of the troll suppositions had been effectively countered.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

Nowadays its something different, it can be just abuse towards someone else but what has made me really wonder about this case in the news the last week is that not one tweet was actualy @ the McCans. She always used a # to speak about them.

If you have a look at the messages she was clearly addressing them to the McCanns, whether she thought they would see them if she used the hash tag or not is not clear.

She wasnt trolling, she was having an opinion,maybe not in the nicest way at times(if you see the tweets then comment if not then dont) but she is like everyone - entitled to their opinion.Thats not trolling. And dont let the media tell you otherwise.

Have you seen the messages?

You will be hated by millions for the rest of your miserable, evil, conniving lives, have a nice day!

The use of the second person makes it look to me like she is trying to send messages to them directly and they are certainly not just expressing an opinion. Would fit with most interpretations of trolling.

Source - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...sed-Madeleine-McCanns-parents-found-dead.html

 

[Clip]

If you have a look at the messages she was clearly addressing them to the McCanns, whether she thought they would see them if she used the hash tag or not is not clear.



Have you seen the messages?

You will be hated by millions for the rest of your miserable, evil, conniving lives, have a nice day!

The use of the second person makes it look to me like she is trying to send messages to them directly and they are certainly not just expressing an opinion. Would fit with most interpretations of trolling.

Source - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...sed-Madeleine-McCanns-parents-found-dead.html

Yes I have seen them thanks, and those messages are no different to the thousands of messages that have been laid at the feet of child killers or even alleged child killers throughout the years. Including peados too. Remember that Shannon lass who went missing but was hidden under the bed? Hate filled vitriol from all corners so why can someone else not direct it at some others when they believe that they were solely responsible for their daughters dissapearance?

Are you saying that what she has said there is the lone voice of 1 person in this country then? Or the voice of many and just another one who has spoken up about it when it has all been quashed by the media and forums through their lawyers?To prove my point go and visit the MSE forum - all talk about them is null and void and can result in a ban - why is that then? You can talk about just about everything else which is the topic of the moment but them. Is that because its too sensitive - if so why is it? If its because they dont want to get in bother then from whom?

And why should discussion like that be quashed?

You may not know about twitter but generally the use of a '#' is talking about a topic or subject and is not the same as using aan @ which is a direct message to the recipient.


Anyway this wasnt really meant to get into the rights or wrongs of the McCans case it was merely to highlight that free speach and discussion is being eroded for no apparent reason but to protect others.

 

[Busaholic]

Where were the McCanns on September 11th 2001? Were they in New York? Has either of them ever learned to fly a plane? They've been remarkably silent on the matter, that's for sure.
What about November 22nd 1963? Somebody was up in that Book Depository window. Who's to say it wasn't one of them? Not born yet? Sounds to me like getting your excuses in early, just in case.
Hang on, the pitbull's just eaten one of my sprogs, suppose they'll wanna destroy it now. Over my dead body!

Trolls, what trolls?

 

[starrymarkb]

Are you saying that what she has said there is the lone voice of 1 person in this country then? Or the voice of many and just another one who has spoken up about it when it has all been quashed by the media and forums through their lawyers?To prove my point go and visit the MSE forum - all talk about them is null and void and can result in a ban - why is that then? You can talk about just about everything else which is the topic of the moment but them. Is that because its too sensitive - if so why is it? If its because they dont want to get in bother then from whom?

And why should discussion like that be quashed?

DigitalSpy were the same, you could discuss anything about the case in general, other suspects as soon as there was a suggestion the parents may have been involved - thread deleted and poster banned!

 

[GatwickDepress]

In the three and a half years that I have been a member of this website, I can bring to mind (without naming any forum usernames) about five instances of outright " trolling for trolling sake" that led to the eventual departure of those unfortunate individuals from this website.

None of the instances involved "stifling criticism and debate" as in every case, the subject chosen by the said trolls were ones that could easily be countered effectively by those forum members with an incisive mind and also with not a little amount of sarcasm inbuilt into posting responses once the weak points of the troll suppositions had been effectively countered.

Thank you for your contribution, but I was referring to the internet generally not this specific forum.

 

[Oswyntail]

.... And why is it that no one can have that opinion of them without being shot down?Lots of forums out there where you cant speak about it. ....

Of course anyone can hold an opinion, and one can even discuss them privately. But what gave this woman the belief she could share that opinion with every user of Twitter, or the internet, without having to have information to back up her opinion if challenged? IMHO, that is the really stupid aspect of people's contributions to social media (including RUK). Too often we forget we are not in a cosy snug with our mates, but standing on Mt Everest with a massive megaphone.
Of course, the same applies to those who responded inappropriately. Our opinion is not worthy to be shared just because we hold it, but because it adds new light to the subject under consideration.

 

[Greenback]

I don't use Twitter, I haven't seen the messages in question, but this sorry tale reminds me why I detest it and have nothing to do with it. So many people are unable to use it properly and end up bringing misery to themselves and others.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I don't use Twitter, I haven't seen the messages in question, but this sorry tale reminds me why I detest it and have nothing to do with it.

With that, we are of one and the same mind.

 

[meridian2]

I don't use Twitter, I haven't seen the messages in question, but this sorry tale reminds me why I detest it and have nothing to do with it. So many people are unable to use it properly and end up bringing misery to themselves and others.

I think that's quite a sad outlook on Twitter. It may have it's faults but it's benefits far outweigh its drawbacks.
'Unable to use it properly' sounds to me as if those expressing their opinion disagrees with your own, such as this lady, for which 'Clip' has summed up my opinion quite well.

 

[Clip]

Of course anyone can hold an opinion, and one can even discuss them privately. But what gave this woman the belief she could share that opinion with every user of Twitter, or the internet, without having to have information to back up her opinion if challenged? IMHO, that is the really stupid aspect of people's contributions to social media (including RUK). Too often we forget we are not in a cosy snug with our mates, but standing on Mt Everest with a massive megaphone.
Of course, the same applies to those who responded inappropriately. Our opinion is not worthy to be shared just because we hold it, but because it adds new light to the subject under consideration.

She didnt really share it with every user just those looking for the hashtag and also those who followed her.

The same as if you are gobbing off in the pub - people will hear.

People may not have evidence to back up what they are saying but they are allowed to speak about hypothetical s are they not? This forum and its ideas are a stem of such a thing.

 

[Flamingo]

I don't use Twitter, I haven't seen the messages in question, but this sorry tale reminds me why I detest it and have nothing to do with it. So many people are unable to use it properly and end up bringing misery to themselves and others.

I've never concealed my opinion that Twitter and Facebook are the curse of the modern world...

On a related topic, I know a relationship guidance counsellor, and they say that at the first consultation they are sitting there waiting for the first mention of Facebook - it never goes beyond five minutes...

 

[Oswyntail]

She didnt really share it with every user just those looking for the hashtag and also those who followed her.

Which is, potentially everyone. That is the nature of social media. It is not the place to express private opinions that you cannot back with evidence.

The same as if you are gobbing off in the pub - people will hear.

Exactly. And there are laws about defamation that apply in public - and social media are public.

People may not have evidence to back up what they are saying but they are allowed to speak about hypothetical s are they not?

No, not without the risk of breaking the law. ("But, M'Lud, I was only writing hypothetically", "Send him down")

This forum and its ideas are a stem of such a thing.

Which is why we have moderators, to protect individuals (and the forum) from their own unthinking illegalities!

 

[fowler9]

A friend of mine recently said he wasn't going to bother with Facebook any more as it was full of people talking rubbish. He told us he was going to stick to Twitter instead. How we laughed.

 

[Greenback]

I think that's quite a sad outlook on Twitter. It may have it's faults but it's benefits far outweigh its drawbacks.
'Unable to use it properly' sounds to me as if those expressing their opinion disagrees with your own, such as this lady, for which 'Clip' has summed up my opinion quite well.

You are entitled to your opinion. There are benefits to social media, but for those who think they can post just about anything on it, it can be a total curse. I don't have a problem with people having differing opinions to me, but I do sometimes have a problem with the way that opinions are expressed.

Twitter and Facebook seem to bring out the worst in some people.

 

[Smudger105e]

I consider that anyone should be able to have their own opinion on twitter and facebook, but this individual posted a huge number of tweets (I believe it was over 4000 on a year) all spouting unsubstantiated comments about the McCanns.

I am personally no longer on facebook because I got sick of the large number of right wing posts that people seem naive enough to keep reposting...