TVMs and Privs...

[G0ORC]

Hi all,

Are there any unmanned station TVMs that sell privs?

It been my unwavering practice to purchase from the conductor on the EM Matlock - Derby service but bearing in mind the high concentration of pass holders in this area (many with grandfather rights) I just wondered if any machines did this.

 

[bb21]

Not that I am aware of, no.

 

[G0ORC]

Not that I am aware of, no.

Thanks, didn't think so

 

[185]

Pay on board where applicable.

In penalty fare areas, I always consider buying (full price) tickets to the value of the PRIV fare, just in case. ie- Travelling into London on Chiltern, buy a ticket maybe one or two stops, and pay the difference on arrival at Marylebone, similar to a Pertis scheme.

 

[MyFriendMary]

In penalty fare areas, I always consider buying (full price) tickets to the value of the PRIV fare, just in case. ie- Travelling into London on Chiltern, buy a ticket maybe one or two stops, and pay the difference on arrival at Marylebone, similar to a Pertis scheme.

Why? If the TOC has not provided sufficient facilities at the station to allow you to buy the ticket you wish to in your selected payment method, then you shouldn't be out of pocket. A quick word with the conductor before you jump on board would suffice, and they'd gladly sell a Priv to London for the extra commission :-P

 

[maniacmartin]

Why? If the TOC has not provided sufficient facilities at the station to allow you to buy the ticket you wish to in your selected payment method, then you shouldn't be out of pocket. A quick word with the conductor before you jump on board would suffice, and they'd gladly sell a Priv to London for the extra commission :-P

Paying the difference does not leave one out of pocket (unless a bad ticket office tries to make you buy a whole new ticket and claim a refund on the other ticket after the fact).

One reason to do it this way is that this is what the NRCoC states.

 

[Haywain]

Paying the difference does not leave one out of pocket (unless a bad ticket office tries to make you buy a whole new ticket and claim a refund on the other ticket after the fact).

One reason to do it this way is that this is what the NRCoC states.

Of course, this is all very well if there are tickets available for a lower cost than the Priv fare. And there is also an issue over buying your ticket from a TVM operated by one TOC and then rocking up at an office or on a train operated by a different TOC, in either case of which a refund will not be so readily available.

I do find it frustrating that there is no opportunity to buy Priv tickets from TVMs or online, only in person.

 

[reb0118]

I do find it frustrating that there is no opportunity to buy Priv tickets from TVMs only in person.

Probably because when certain elements of the travelling public find out the price they'll buy them too. Not all trains have a thorough revenue check and priv tickets open gates also.

.....or internet

This, I feel, could be done. A secure booking site would suffice with a login & password. The priv card number and name could be printed on the ticket too as an added security feature. Tickets could then be collected from TVMs at unstaffed stations.

 

[Haywain]

Probably because when certain elements of the travelling public find out the price they'll buy them too. Not all trains have a thorough revenue check and priv tickets open gates also.

Not much of an excuse when TVMs sell tickets with child and railcard discounts.

This, I feel, could be done. A secure booking site would suffice with a login & password. The priv card number and name could be printed on the ticket too as an added security feature. Tickets could then be collected from TVMs at unstaffed stations.

A website would also allow better management of what tickets are available by only offering those that are available according to the priv entitlement.

 

[Edmondson]

Another option that would only require a software modification to the machines is to have ones priv entitlement cards issued as 'chip & pin' cards.

The menu for priv tickets could then only be made to appear once the card has been inserted and PIN verified.

 

[swt_passenger]

Another option that would only require a software modification to the machines is to have ones priv entitlement cards issued as 'chip & pin' cards.

The menu for priv tickets could then only be made to appear once the card has been inserted and PIN verified.

They could and should get the TVMs to check for any railcard to be honest, both for walk up purchases and for TOD. It's only what they'd be doing at a ticket office anyway.

 

[455driver]

A website would also allow better management of what tickets are available by only offering those that are available according to the priv entitlement.

Is that the safeguarded entitlements or the new entry entitlements?

 

[Clip]

Not much of an excuse when TVMs sell tickets with child and railcard discounts.
.

Massive difference between 75% and 33% though.

Chip and pin PRIV cards is just an unecessary cost to the system though. Lets be realistic here.

 

[Haywain]

Massive difference between 75% and 33% though.

It's not much difference at all on a lot of long distance journeys, given the different ticket types. In fact, a return from Euston to Manchester is actually cheaper for the railcard holder.

 

[Clip]

It's not much difference at all on a lot of long distance journeys, given the different ticket types. In fact, a return from Euston to Manchester is actually cheaper for the railcard holder.

But most people dont try an evade paying the correct fare on a Euston to Manchester journey do they? They try to do so where there are few guards and less ticket checks.

Speaking of the railcard thing though, I see no reason why each one cant have a QR code on them unique to the card only showing the date of issue on it to be presented to a small reader on the TVM.

 

[PermitToTravel]

But most people dont try an evade paying the correct fare on a Euston to Manchester journey do they? They try to do so where there are few guards and less ticket checks.

Speaking of the railcard thing though, I see no reason why each one cant have a QR code on them unique to the card only showing the date of issue on it to be presented to a small reader on the TVM.

Chip and PIN would probably be cheaper, the TVMs already have appropriate readers, and the ink wouldn't rub off as it would for a QR code(/expiry date )

 

[185]

But most people dont try an evade paying the correct fare on a Euston to Manchester journey do they? They try to do so where there are few guards and less ticket checks.

That's if the TM comes round, which increasingly doesn't happen on many London Intercity operators.

 

[Clip]

Chip and PIN would probably be cheaper, the TVMs already have appropriate readers, and the ink wouldn't rub off as it would for a QR code(/expiry date )

Im not sure how much chip cards cost to make to be honest but would it be cheaper? Mind you a move to actually having railcards laminated or some such would be a great move whatever happens

That's if the TM comes round, which increasingly doesn't happen on many London Intercity operators.

Really? I have never not been checked on both Virgin and East Coast - and I travel on East Coast rather often and for a long old way too.

 

[Haywain]

Really? I have never not been checked on both Virgin and East Coast - and I travel on East Coast rather often and for a long old way too.

You experience is different to mine then. I find it quite unusual to have a ticket check on Virgin services.

 

[sarahj]

I was playing around with a ticket machine at a very quiet station in Germany and noticed there was an option for cheap priv (or whatever their version is) to buy. You were sent to a screen where you had to input a code to rpove it was you.

Whenever I'd had to buy privs in the uk from a unmanned station, just gone straight up to the guard and bought one. Though I have to admit this has only ever been between Metro Centre and Newcastle central.

 

[Clip]

You experience is different to mine then. I find it quite unusual to have a ticket check on Virgin services.

mind you Im normally always sat in 1st after having a 'chat' with them on Virgin so maybe thats why....






Cant wait for the inevitable backlash that will provoke some on here

 

[island]

Speaking of the railcard thing though, I see no reason why each one cant have a QR code on them unique to the card only showing the date of issue on it to be presented to a small reader on the TVM.

Because somebody would have to pay for upgrading every TVM in the country with a reader

 

[PermitToTravel]

Im not sure how much chip cards cost to make to be honest but would it be cheaper? Mind you a move to actually having railcards laminated or some such would be a great move whatever happen

A single digit number of pennies each, but I'd forgotten that railcards have to be produced in stations as well as online. Such a move would require the sale of railcards on stations to cease

 

[dcsprior]

They could and should get the TVMs to check for any railcard to be honest, both for walk up purchases and for TOD. It's only what they'd be doing at a ticket office anyway.

I didn't think there was a rule saying that you had to hold a railcard to buy a railcard-discounted ticket, only to use it?

 

[hairyhandedfool]

The three main railcards have the following condition:

Tickets for your journey should be purchased before boarding the train and when buying tickets you must show the Railcard.

So you do have to show a TVM (or your computer) the Railcard, something you can't do if you don't have one. However, the new Two Together Railcard has this:

Tickets for Your journey should be purchased before boarding the train. When buying tickets in person from a member of staff either You or the Second named cardholder must show the Railcard. If you are buying online or from a ticket vending machine (TVM) You must declare that You have a valid Railcard by selecting the Two Together Railcard option. If You fail to do so, You and the Second named cardholder will be required to pay the full price Standard Single fare for Your journey as if no tickets were purchased before starting the journey and in some cases a Penalty Fare. This does not apply if there was no ticket office at the station at which You began the journey or if the ticket office was closed, and there was no working ticket machine from which You could buy discounted tickets, or You have a disability which prevented You accessing ticket retailing facilities in these cases You will be able to use Your Railcard on train or at Your destination.

Punctuation doesn't appear to be ATOCs strong point, but I suspect the other Railcards will have this added when the leaflets change next.