West Coast Railways Suspended (now reinstated)

[yorkie]

I've split the posts enquiring about training steam drivers into a new thread: Training steam drivers?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I've split the posts enquiring about training steam drivers into a new thread: Training steam drivers?

As ever, you make life so easy for us...

 

[infobleep]

Thanks Yorkie.

 

[TUC]

I do get the impression that some stream enthusiasts are rather like pirate radio fans-convinced that 'the establishment' is out to get their industry and seeing suspicious motives behind every action, no matter how justified.

 

[bnm]

I do get the impression that some stream enthusiasts are rather like pirate radio fans-convinced that 'the establishment' is out to get their industry and seeing suspicious motives behind every action, no matter how justified.

What about the river and canal enthusiasts?

 

[TUC]

What about the river and canal enthusiasts?

They're already convinced that they've been sold down the river!

 

[edwin_m]

What about the river and canal enthusiasts?

Are they the ones that barge in front when someone's trying to take a photo?

 

[D1009]

I do get the impression that some stream enthusiasts are rather like pirate radio fans-convinced that 'the establishment' is out to get their industry and seeing suspicious motives behind every action, no matter how justified.

I totally agree, when you see what Network Rail has done to facilitate high speed steam runs in the last couple of years, you can't blame them for taking action when things go pear shaped from the TOC side.

 

[55z]

Network Rail WCR ban reveals ongoing safety concerns

Highly damaging repercussions are piling up for West Coast Railways following the serious Signal Passed at Danger (SPAD) by its steam charter on March 7, in which a 100mph collision was avoided by barely a minute (see separate story).

Network Rail quickly responded with an unprecedented network-wide suspension of WCR’s track access rights from April 3, with the hardline comment that “recent events lead NR to believe that the operations of WCR are a threat to the safe operation of the railway”.

Meanwhile, the Office of Rail and Road (ORR, formerly the Office of Rail Regulation) announced that it is “reviewing the company’s safety certification - needed to operate trains on the rail network”.

In simple terms, it has launched formal proceedings to revoke WCR’s safety certificate. This means that even if WCR satisfies the stringent NR demands to end the track access ban imposed until May 15, it would still be unable to run any trains itself if the ORR revocation goes ahead.

In addition, ORR is investigating possible criminal prosecution of WCR for health and safety breaches, for which there is already precedent (First Capital Connect in 2014, RAIL 771).

“Our initial investigation has found significant weaknesses in the company’s safety management systems,” an ORR spokesman told RAIL.

“ORR is carrying out further assessments to determine whether health and safety laws were breached, and the appropriate enforcement action required.”

Both ORR and the Rail Accident Investigation Branch (RAIB) are investigating the SPAD, which ranked as the most serious this year anywhere on the network. RAIL understands that both organisations have visited WCR’s offices to collect evidence.

Following the track access suspension, WCR released an official statement saying: “Passenger safety is our number one priority.”

It says in relation to “a recent breach of safety regulations”, WCR “considers this to be sufficient to carry out a full internal inquiry with the support of NR, and at this time will not be running trains under their current operator licence”.
- See more at: www.railmagazine.com

 

[ainsworth74]

Well this appears to be getting worse for WCRC as time goes on...

 

[Darren R]

Well this appears to be getting worse for WCRC as time goes on...

Indeed. When the RAIB report is published it's going to make for grimly fascinating reading...

 

[Clarence Yard]

The RAIB inspector looking into the Winchfield incident had something to say about them acting not in accordance with their SMS (same bloke doing maintenance and then the inspection) so the ORR would have (or should have) had them on their radar for a closer look.

The ORR and RAIB taking away evidence after an incident of this nature is not uncommon but the statement to a journalist about serious shortcomings in their SMS most certainly is. if that is true, licence revocation is a very real risk for them but not an absolute certainty by any means.

I would also expect the crew concerned as well as the co. owners have already worked out that this incident could have serious legal repercussions for them and sought out their own personal legal advice.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

What sort of charter trains % do WCR:

* Provide rolling stock for
* Provide locos for (steam and/or diesel)
* Provide train crews for

 

[TDK]

Well this appears to be getting worse for WCRC as time goes on...

I think it was pretty bad from the outset to be fair, they have allegedly breached the safety systems put in place by NR to run a safe railway and they will no doubt pay the price by doing this, it would be the same for any TOC/FOC that did the same.

I honestly think it has been run by amateurs who do not understand the consequences of breaching the rules set out by NR and unfortunately they have been busted because of this very serious incident with the steam train.

I will be surprised if they ever run trains under their own company again!

 

[alexl92]

Hypothetically, supposing they lost their licence to operate permanently, wouldn't that be pretty devastating for the railtour market in the UK?

 

[TheKnightWho]

Hypothetically, supposing they lost their licence to operate permanently, wouldn't that be pretty devastating for the railtour market in the UK?

Unlikely. DBS will likely expand their business, and we may see other up and coming operators.

Indeed, when an industry giant (albeit in a very small industry) goes down it can usually be quite good for the industry as a whole. Fresh faces and perspective etc.

 

[Tracky]

I'm not sure DB have any interest in expanding their charter operation. Outside of Stewart's Lane and Bristol they have very little steam capacity.

DRS will happily take on more diesel hauled work. I can see them going for the Belmond Royal Scotsman and Statesman contracts.

It is possible Scotrail may look to operate steam in house.

I'd like to see ATW do some in house steam operations between Crewe/Manchester and Llandudno/Holyhead but that is sadly unlikely.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Wasn't it DBS pulling out of most of the charter market that led to the rapid expansion of WCRC in the first place?

 

[Darandio]

DRS will happily take on more diesel hauled work. I can see them going for the Belmond Royal Scotsman and Statesman contracts.

They have been turning down work though.

 

[Tracky]

They have been turning down work though.

Well they can't suddenly increase their resources to cope with demand. I suspect that the future of charters will be promoters working more closely with operators to use resources more efficiently.

 

[alexl92]

Unlikely. DBS will likely expand their business, and we may see other up and coming operators.

Indeed, when an industry giant (albeit in a very small industry) goes down it can usually be quite good for the industry as a whole. Fresh faces and perspective etc.

But DBS only operate air-braked trains don't they? So there's one stumbling block.

And I know what you're saying in the second part but can it be a good thing when one of the only two big steam-operating TOCs for charters goes down and the other expands? To my mind it's just reducing the competition. It's not like there are 5 or 6 other small companies with steam licences for the main line waiting to step in and fill the gap, is it?

What happens if DBS have crewing issues again like they did a couple of years back?

 

[CosherB]

They have been turning down work though.

If WRC failed, I'm sure DRS would be, at the very least, interested in becoming the sole user of Class 57s .....

 

[Mark62]

I have read many reports about the incident. They all seem to confirm the actions of the driver. Should he not face a criminal investigation by the police in the event that it can be showed that the driver wilfully and knowingly acted in such a negligent way. For me, they big question is, why would the driver turn off the aws etc?

 

[Tracky]

They all suggest actions of somebody on the footplate. Im sure the legal side will follow NR investigations into WCR and reports...

 

[Clarence Yard]

If any action against an individual or individuals is required, it is initiated by the ORR as the safety regulator for rail, following reports. NR does not have that regulation role, being effectively just the infrastructure provider and manager.

I would hope all individuals concerned will have already consulted their lawyers as, not wishing to go further into what may or may not have occurred for very obvious reasons, the implications for them personally are serious.

 

[D1009]

What concerns me as a steam fan is that if effectively WCR's operations cease permanently, is it lilkely that another operator will be allowed to operate vacuum braked stock at normal main line speeds? If not the amount of main line steam operation will be vastly reduced.

 

[infobleep]

Unlikely. DBS will likely expand their business, and we may see other up and coming operators.

Indeed, when an industry giant (albeit in a very small industry) goes down it can usually be quite good for the industry as a whole. Fresh faces and perspective etc.

I don't see how another company could spring up that easily. There is a lot of safety stuff required when running a railway and unless some group of people with that knowledge start a company, not sure how they would go about doing it.

There again how did Grand Central start up? Was that people with the right knowledge of the railways. I guess it is possible, just not something that can happen quickly.

Wonder what will happen with other Steam Dreams tours. They seemed to be doing well.

 

[CosherB]

I don't see how another company could spring up that easily. There is a lot of safety stuff required when running a railway and unless some group of people with that knowledge start a company, not sure how they would go about doing it.

There again how did Grand Central start up? Was that people with the right knowledge of the railways. I guess it is possible, just not something that can happen quickly.

Wonder what will happen with other Steam Dreams tours. They seemed to be doing well.

Grand Central is a subsidiary of Arriva Trains UK.

 

[D1009]

Grand Central is a subsidiary of Arriva Trains UK.

It is now, it wasn't when it started.

 

[mtbox]

I have read many reports about the incident. They all seem to confirm the actions of the driver. Should he not face a criminal investigation by the police in the event that it can be showed that the driver wilfully and knowingly acted in such a negligent way. For me, they big question is, why would the driver turn off the aws etc?

The interim report by the RAIB clearly states the AWS was NOT isolated.

Some people need to stop pointing fingers and wait for the full report to come out.