What about creating a 1980s style preserved railway?

[VEP3417]

i was personally more thinking of the nse period rather than earlier 80s but i just labled it as "80" as most people do but its probably more 90s if anything as nse would have only been from 86 to 90 at that period anyway even though it continued well past that, as said i personally remember the early to mid 90s nse period

 

[D6130]

Indeed, it would need to be bankrolled at a loss by a mad and very rich enthusiast.

Has anyone mentioned the idea to Mr Hosking?

 

[Mike Machin]

That's a very good point

It annoys me when I see a programme/ film set in the 1980s and everyone is wearing 1980s fashions/ listening to 1980s music etc (when the reality of any decade is that a lot of the "culture" that people are consuming dates from previous years - it takes a long time for the trends of catwalks to filter their way through to provincial High Streets)

I think that a 1980s railway would be a fascinating one - much more my era than the Victorian themed nostalgia that many railways seem to aim for (which is fair enough, they know their market, they can attract more people with "Downton Abbey" than "Only Fools & Horses")

Some places saw little change over the 1980s, some saw a transformational decade - especially if you were in what became NSE (where they didn't just get lots of new trains but fantastic attention to details when it came to "everyday" things like clocks and lamp posts - many people bemoan privatised TOCs for "unnecessarily" spending money on repaints but NSE were quick to do exactly that, and it paid off)

As someone who lived in the ScotRail area at the time, my 1980s experience was split between the final years of diesel locomotives on a number of services and the modern/plastic Sprinters - the locos became fewer and fewer but more and more colourful - I think that the large logo livery and a few Highland "stags" etc would be wonderful, but if we are talking "representative" then it'd be more humdrum 150s instead.

I do find the premise of the thread very interesting - I was at Beamish shortly before the pandemic started and it's really interesting the way that the "museum" is evolving from 1850s to 1950s - nostalgia is evolving - but do railways want to remain primarily focussed on the nineteenth century? The 1980s are now half way between the Second World War and today, after all.

That's so true! As a designer I have always been aware that in any time period, the styles from previous periods still abound. Someone I know was involved in designing the inner-city pub interiors for the original episodes of the TV series 'Life on Mars' and they were asked to recreate a typical mid-1970s pub.

They quickly realised, that a run-down urban pub would most likely have been last refurbished in the 1950s, so the overall decor and furniture of the 1950s was adopted, with just a few more modern '70s accessories such as the TV, radio, a few items of 70s furnishings, plus 1970s beer pumps, crisp packets and 1970s posters - it was most convincing!

 

[32475]

I like the idea of a 1980s themed railway but as mentioned by others it would appeal to a very niche enthusiast market and not much to the general public. That’s not to say that some heritage lines couldn’t adapt a station or two with a 1980s flavour relatively simply by changing signage, posters, benches, litter bins, lighting, rude staff etc, however the biggest impact would be something like for example a NSE class 50 with a rake of mk1s and mk2s.

 

[D6968]

For that all 1980’s experience how’s about just buggering up everyone’s moves by just ripping something off and then putting a Class 47 on?

 

[alexl92]

Not 80s per se but the Wensleydale Railway have just refurbed a rake of mk2s into BR Blue/grey and are running them with their 14, 33 or 37 on the first Sunday of each month.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Yes, but wouldn't really fit the overall early-60s look of the linew. Nor does the Pacer of course, but there isn't a 60s livery for one

To be fair, the Worth Valley does have an early 1960s version of a Pacer in the form of the two W&M Railbuses.

 

[D6968]

To be fair, the Worth Valley does have an early 1960s version of a Pacer in the form of the two W&M Railbuses.

Have you tried riding in one?

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

Loving the idea of a restored Traveller's Fayre buffet complete with the celebrated BR ham sandwich, maybe even a branch of Casey Jones!

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Have you tried riding in one?

Yes... "lively" would be an understatement!

 

[JKF]

Catering would be scalding hot Maxwell House coffee in a foam cup with a Kit-kat or a Bowyers’ sausage roll.

When I was working at Edge Hill depot not that many years ago cleaning up/investigating an oil spill (around 2010 maybe) there was quite a lot of ancient rubbish in the cess where they cleaned out the coaches in the evenings, including the plastic lids for maxpax coffees with an embossed double arrow logo. Wish I‘d grabbed a few, but they’re probably still there. I did find a whole blue cup and saucer with the BR logo on the base, and fragments of old tea cups with pre-nationalisation logos going back as far as LNWR.

 

[xotGD]

For that all 1980’s experience how’s about just buggering up everyone’s moves by just ripping something off and then putting a Class 47 on?

I can just see it - a diesel gala advertising all manner of exotic traction, and when you get there everything is worked by Duffs!

 

[tbtc]

An 80's branch line recreation would just be a BR basic railway. All sidngs lifted and a single line for 1 platform

As they say on The Simpsons, "It's Funny Because It's True"

Beamish has been mentioned upthread. As middle aged people like myself are at the younger end of those who remember the 80’s why not a museum dedicated to the 1970’s/80’s and possibly even 90’s with a short running line as part of it. A ‘the way we lived in the modern era before the internet’ sort of thing.

There is a large classic car scene for that era, probably buses and trains so why not combine it with a Beamish style village? It would work for me and my family far more than a dedicated heritage line.

I know that Beamish has more than one bit of railway (a tram line orbits the site, there's a regular steam line in the far corner and also some tracks for the "colliery" area), maybe the "evolution" of the place will see a BR era diesel railway too one day, which might make more sense than having one railway focussed on that era

I've not been to Summerlee (at Coatbridge) for about thirty years, and I've never been to the Black Country Living Museum (though would like to go), so I don't know how the others compare in terms of history from the second half of the twenty first century, but it'd be nice to know that they are evolving (whereas a visit to some National Trust mansion or English Heritage castle is fairly stuck in time)

That's so true! As a designer I have always been aware that in any time period, the styles from previous periods still abound. Someone I know was involved in designing the inner-city pub interiors for the original episodes of the TV series 'Life on Mars' and they were asked to recreate a typical mid-1970s pub.

They quickly realised, that a run-down urban pub would most likely have been last refurbished in the 1950s, so the overall decor and furniture of the 1950s was adopted, with just a few more modern '70s accessories such as the TV, radio, a few items of 70s furnishings, plus 1970s beer pumps, crisp packets and 1970s posters - it was most convincing!

That's a great story!

Yeah, Life On Mars felt a lot more authentic than most programmes/ films set in the past (e.g. compare the BBC's "White Gold" - a modern sitcom set in the 1980s - versus the BBC's Only Fools & Horses - a sitcom filmed in the 1980s but it doesn't ram it down your throat, things feel a lot more authentic because it wasn't ramming 1985 down your throat with props that were only from 1985 - people seeking "retro" design could learn a lot from Life On Mars

 

[AY1975]

i know were going off topic a bit with the 80s themed preserved railway but it would be nice to see a full on nse themed railway which would be a nice change from the steam era's that most of them are

Well I suppose the Epping-Ongar Railway kind of fits the bill, as it has NSE-liveried Thumper 205 205 and some ex-NSE Mark 2s, though it was previously part of the London Underground (and before that part of BR and its predecessors). The Mid Hants also has a Thumper (albeit in green livery) and ex-NSE Mark 2s (again green rather than NSE livery).

i was personally more thinking of the nse period rather than earlier 80s but i just labled it as "80" as most people do but its probably more 90s if anything as nse would have only been from 86 to 90 at that period anyway even though it continued well past that, as said i personally remember the early to mid 90s nse period

The NSE era was actually 1986-94 but NSE livery (and NSE colours on stations) was still around long after that.

...could even save a 456 and run that

or a 455, a 465, a 313, a 317, a 319, a 321 or a 165/166.

 

[Pigeon]

I've always thought of the ELR as being an attempt at recreating the 80s bashing experience, collecting all the celebrity beasts. Shame there's no chance of them rebuilding to Accrington, as the thrash over Baxenden would be epic.

 

[VEP3417]

The NSE era was actually 1986-94 but NSE livery (and NSE colours on stations) was still around long after that.

i know i meant if you where representing an 80s line you would probably only represent up to 89/90 so at that point nse would have only been around from 86 to 90 at that point, but the period after that that some may wish to represent had more faded nse liveries and run down stations as the earlier period they probably looked quite nice freshly painted in red

 

[sprinterguy]

I've always thought of the ELR as being an attempt at recreating the 80s bashing experience, collecting all the celebrity beasts. Shame there's no chance of them rebuilding to Accrington, as the thrash over Baxenden would be epic.

During my last two visits to the East Lancs, they certainly seem to have been doing their utmost to recreate an authentic 1970s/80s BR experience: Extensive delays due to loco failures on single line sections, loco substitutions, an overcrowded 2-car DMU deputising for a loco-hauled formation and seemingly little to no information being communicated to staff "on the ground".

Don't get me wrong I'm not complaining; I enjoyed the authenticity, the undercurrent of uncertainty is exciting and it meant more time in the pub. My regular Friday night drinking companion and I have often discussed running a preserved railway in a stereotypically bleak late 70s/early 80s manner if money were no object, as we both admit, as others have said on this thread, that it would be quite a niche interest, primarily to entertain ourselves: Grimy, run down stations, late and shortformed trains, unexpectedly closed ticket offices (I've experienced that one on the Great Central) and uninformed, uncooperative or totally absent staff.

In terms of rolling stock to use as a basis I've suggested before that the Mid-Norfolk Railway might be suitable, though I'm not in any way suggesting that they exhibit any of the more negative features that I've listed.

 

[WAO]

If you mean a January 1980 railway, the time of Sir Peter Parker's "crumbling edge of quality", then you are thinking of the (at best) corporate image of blue or blue/grey with unionised sloppy (younger) staff and grumpy older ones who remembered the blitz.

If you mean a December 1989 railway, the time of Sir Robert Reid I, a proper railwayman, then you are thinking of sectors, with IC, NSE and OPS/PSS. There are rakes about, of IC mark 3's both with class 43's and a class 87. There is also an NSE Society showing how good the state-owned railway could be, when well run, without privatisation.

WAO

 

[JonathanH]

The Mid Hants also has a Thumper (albeit in green livery) and ex-NSE Mark 2s (again green rather than NSE livery).

The Mark 2s are long gone from the Mid Hants.

 

[Jim Jehosofat]

I can just see it - a diesel gala advertising all manner of exotic traction, and when you get there everything is worked by Duffs!

No. When you get there it has been cancelled due to staff shortage!

 

[xotGD]

shortformed trains

I beg to differ - 12 Mark 1s in various states of decrepitude for the authentic 1980s Summer Saturday vibe.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

To be fair , NSE had "Operation Sparkle" to clean up neglected stations on such gems as the Watford - Euston DC lines , and Network showpiece stations such as Richmond and others. Formation of local heavy cleaning gangs and setting standards for cleanliness (including periodicity of washing trains) ,and planned interior heavy cleans , was a soft benefit - but one that was noted.

The ambience of most stations pre such initiatives was pretty dire to be fair - brake block encrusted woodwork (it needed hot water and steel wool to remove) - passenger information provided by finger boards .

Any recreation would need to include this , plus smoking allowed pretty much everywhere and dim lighting.

 

[AngusH]

Does the Old Dalby test track have gaps when it's not being used?

You could run most types of stock possibly even at proper speeds too...

 

[VEP3417]

id forgotten about the brake dust, as a kid i seem to remember everything being covered in an orangey brown dust, trains. buildings, platforms all sorts, was almost romantic how it glistened in the early morning summer sunshine

some rarely used stations like beaulieu road still have concrete platform edging covered in a brown film, very nostalgic

 

[ChiefPlanner]

id forgotten about the brake dust, as a kid i seem to remember everything being covered in an orangey brown dust, trains. buildings, platforms all sorts, was almost romantic how it glistened in the early morning summer sunshine

some rarely used stations like beaulieu road still have concrete platform edging covered in a brown film, very nostalgic

Reliably informed by a fleet engineer of the highest standing that 3 tons of brake block dust a day were sprinkled over Southern England , when the old stock was running around.

(the brake blocks came from Horwich Foundry)

 

[JRT]

The Weardale Railway would have been an ideal candidate, but...

Bishop Auckland–Stanhope was operated by a 141 DMU 141003? last time I went past a few years ago? Around 15 years ago. Unfortunately the timetable was altered so I was unable to travel and then the 141 (and spare) were scrapped.

 

[Paul Jones 88]

How about creating a class 210 using some of the redundant class 317 vehicles?
Could run in multiple with a class 317as well.
That would be fantastic on a heritage 80s railway.

 

[yorksrob]

id forgotten about the brake dust, as a kid i seem to remember everything being covered in an orangey brown dust, trains. buildings, platforms all sorts, was almost romantic how it glistened in the early morning summer sunshine

some rarely used stations like beaulieu road still have concrete platform edging covered in a brown film, very nostalgic

In the 90's in Kent the train Windows were often covered in orangey brown dust. I think the various hose pipe bans precluded the railway from using the carriage washer.

Hose pipe bans. Imagine that nowadays.

 

[RichJF]

And the cost. Oh good lord the cost of putting up OLE for less than 100 running days a year. What I can see some 3rd-rail based Preserved railways doing is installing dummy 3rd rail and fitting battery packs to their units. It would have the right 'look and feel' without breaking the bank, and although the trip hazard is still present there wouldn't be the issues of live rail. Preserved railways could easily manage a couple of round trips at 25mph then back in the shed to charge overnight. Not sure Dummy OLE would be quite as worthwhile.

I keep thinking the Bluebell will end doing exactly that when they extend to Ardingly in the mid-distant future. Using their 'new' class 33 & 4VEP.

 

[VEP3417]

@ChiefPlanner @yorksrob

probably why you diddnt see many white trains back in the day but there seems to be a lot of white or silver liveries today, they still become quite dirty though quite quickly swr having a lot of white in its livery including quite a lot of the roof