When Will It All Go Wrong For The Tories/ Johnson?

[AlterEgo]

MP Crispin Blunt is doing a sterling job of trying to trash his party's reputation for law and order, by releasing a statement claiming the guilty verdict in question is a miscarriage of justice:

https://twitter.com/CrispinBlunt/status/1513603624164859918

Worth bearing in mind the Tory Party have expelled Khan in response to the verdict, so Blunt is also going against his party with this arguably defamatory statement.

Crispin Blunt is rhyming slang and has been for a while.

A truly monumental own goal. He claims that his paedo mate was the victim of some unsavoury homophobic tropes during the trial, which may or may not be true. But the optics of a gay paedophile being defended immediately on conviction by another gay man are terrible, and will only fuel the most virulent forms of homphobia.

Blunt has been having a personal ethical crisis for some time and one can only hope he is removed at the next election.

 

[jfollows]

It's also a typical politician's non-apology, along the usual lines of "I'm sorry if what I said has offended people" rather than "I apologise for my unwarranted, incorrect and ill-advised statement which I totally retract and apologise for making" which he ought to have said.

 

[ainsworth74]

Also at least 30 more Partygate fines have been handed out:

Police say they have issued at least 30 more fines for breaches of lockdown regulations in Whitehall and Downing Street.
This comes on top of the 20 fines sent out last month.
The Met Police are not providing details of who will be sent a fine or about the events.
But No 10 has said it will confirm if Prime Minister Boris Johnson is among the recipients.

Partygate: Met Police issue 30 more Downing Street lockdown fines

Police say they have sent out more than 50 fines so far for Covid law-breaking in government buildings.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[SouthCentral10]

Blunt has been having a personal ethical crisis for some time and one can only hope he is removed at the next election.

I must say I agree with this. Being one of his constituents, Mr Blunt has been an excellent MP for the vast majority of his 25 years representing Reigate. However his recent record has been 'patchy', and he has misjudged the public's mood on both local and national issues. I would be very surprised if he does not stand down at the next general election.

 

[AlterEgo]

Boris and Rishi are being fined over Partygate...didn't Boris say he'd resign if he was fined? Or did I imagine that?

 

[brad465]

I look forward to seeing how many cats are killed and tossed in an attempt to try and distract from this one...

 

[96tommy]

Boris and Rishi are being fined over Partygate...didn't Boris say he'd resign if he was fined? Or did I imagine that?

He won't. He will come out saying because of the Ukraine situation it is important there is no change at the top. But yes he should go.... and have been gone a long time ago

 

[Typhoon]

It will be interesting to see who rushes out to 'form a square around the Bozster', and who, unfortunately, has got a pressing engagement elsewhere.

I would have thought that the media ought to keep a close eye on Sunak, he might decide he has better things to do with his life.

 

[dgl]

But Boris said there were no parties so the police must have fines him incorrectly, because Boris would never lie

 

[brad465]

It will be interesting to see who rushes out to 'form a square around the Bozster', and who, unfortunately, has got a pressing engagement elsewhere.

I would have thought that the media ought to keep a close eye on Sunak, he might decide he has better things to do with his life.

Sunak could try and get one over on Johnson by resigning in response to this, but in order to escape into a quieter life with his family wealth, while at the same time in doing so putting tonnes of pressure on Johnson to follow suit. Whether he will or not though remains to be seen.

 

[ainsworth74]

Wonder if they'll fight them?

 

[jfollows]

As Sky just showed, here's what Boris Johnson said on 1 December last:

Keir Starmer

(Holborn and St Pancras) (Lab)

May I join the Prime Minister in his words on disability and the victims of extreme weather? May I also mark World AIDS Day? Extraordinary advances mean that people living with HIV on effective treatment can now enjoy normal life expectancy and are no longer at risk of passing on the virus. It is within our hands to end new transmissions in the UK this decade. We must do so.

As millions of people were locked down last year, was a Christmas party thrown in Downing Street for dozens of people on 18 December?

The Prime Minister

What I can tell the right hon. and learned Gentleman is that all guidance was followed completely in No. 10. May I recommend that he does the same with his own Christmas party, which is advertised for 15 December and to which, unaccountably, he has failed to invite the deputy Leader of the Opposition?

 

[Snow1964]

It will be interesting to see who rushes out to 'form a square around the Bozster', and who, unfortunately, has got a pressing engagement elsewhere.

I would have thought that the media ought to keep a close eye on Sunak, he might decide he has better things to do with his life.

We know that a few letters regarding confidence were issued to chairman of 1922 committee, and then it went rather quiet pending Sue Grays report, and that publication of that report was deferred pending police finishing their investigation and fines.

I believe Conservative party rules requires 15% of MPs to request the no confidence vote. That is if the prime minister doesn’t resign for his lying about no parties to public and the House of Commons.

 

[Kite159]

Both will probably decide they have had enough of the witch-hunt and will quit for the sake of their own & families mental healths.

After-all they don't need the money, and I dare say they can make more money away from politics (after-dinner speeches etc).

Not like in 2019 the public had much of a choice, vote for Boris or Corbyn, neither were good options.

 

[DanNCL]

I’m sure Boris Johnson thinks this is a resignation matter. The question is who does he think should resign for it, because we all know it won’t be him!

 

[jfollows]

The PM's wife has also received a fixed penalty notice.

Continuing speculation that Rishi Sunak has already decided to resign, eg moving out at the weekend was for real, and getting the fine might be enough to make him decide to go (post #1720 from brad465 said essentially this already).

 

[96tommy]

The PM's wife has also received a fixed penalty notice.

Continuing speculation that Rishi Sunak has already decided to resign, eg moving out at the weekend was for real, and getting the fine might be enough to make him decide to go. (post #1720 from brad465 said essentially this already)

Wonder if Rishi will do a dignified resignation and accept mistakes happened pushing the spotlight onto Boris.......

 

[AlterEgo]

Sunak has a much easier exit strategy than Boris does though...I think Sunak will resign and Boris will be under severe pressure.

 

[jfollows]

The other question is whether they'll pay the fine or contest it - on the face of it it's less likely that Rishi Sunak won't pay up now, but Boris Johnson might think he's not guilty (he's deluded himself?) and therefore should not be found guilty of the breach of the rules. My quick thought is that although this might seem attractive to him, the spectacle of going to court would be more damaging to him than paying up.

EDIT Plus it's a double or quits strategy; losing in court would mean a criminal record and that'd be worse than accepting and paying a fine from fixed penalty notice.

Further to statements in the House of Commons, on December 7th. 2021:

Karl Turner

(Kingston upon Hull East) (Lab)

T6. The Chancellor was evasive when interviewed by the media last week, but we need a clear answer on this very important point because many people across the country made great personal sacrifices during the lockdown. So will he categorically deny in the House that he or any of his officials or Spads attended any of the Downing Street Christmas parties on 27 November or 18 December last year? (904628)

Rishi Sunak

No, I did not attend any parties.

December 8th.:

Q1. If he will list his official engagements for Wednesday 8 December. (904643)

The Prime Minister

(Boris Johnson)

May I begin by saying that I understand and share the anger up and down the country at seeing No. 10 staff seeming to make light of lockdown measures? I can understand how infuriating it must be to think that the people who have been setting the rules have not been following the rules, because I was also furious to see that clip. I apologise unreservedly for the offence that it has caused up and down the country, and I apologise for the impression that it gives.

I repeat that I have been repeatedly assured since these allegations emerged that there was no party and that no covid rules were broken. That is what I have been repeatedly assured. But I have asked the Cabinet Secretary to establish all the facts and to report back as soon as possible. It goes without saying that if those rules were broken, there will be disciplinary action for all those involved.

 

[Typhoon]

The other question is whether they'll pay the fine or contest it - on the face of it it's less likely that Rishi Sunak won't pay up now, but Boris Johnson might think he's not guilty (he's deluded himself?) and therefore should not be found guilty of the breach of the rules. My quick thought is that although this might seem attractive to him, the spectacle of going to court would be more damaging to him than paying up.

EDIT Plus it's a double or quits strategy; losing in court would mean a criminal record and that'd be worse than accepting and paying a fine from fixed penalty notice.

Further to statements in the House of Commons, on December 7th. 2021:

If they contest them 'Partygate' will still be a story at the time of the local elections. Won't affect the government but there might be some rather disgruntled ex-councillors.

 

[Gloster]

I suspect they will pay them, but drop broad hints that they consider them unjust. However, they have “much weightier matters to deal with at the moment” and really can’t spare the time to contest the fine.

 

[SteveM70]

Tory MPs starting to say it’s serious and there will be a day of reckoning but world events mean that won’t be now. Roger Gale at the front of the queue.

Interestingly Tom Tugendhat is second favourite should Boris for the first time in his life to the honourable thing

 

[brad465]

Tory MPs starting to say it’s serious and there will be a day of reckoning but world events mean that won’t be now. Roger Gale at the front of the queue.

Interestingly Tom Tugendhat is second favourite should Boris for the first time in his life to the honourable thing

They of course seem to forget that Churchill was not in charge when WW2 began, and came in just before the Battle of Britain and the Blitz began.

 

[68000]

Johnson and Sunak should resign but all the sycophants do not get a free pass, they need to go as well. Telling lies with impunity for years

 

[Typhoon]

They of course seem to forget that Churchill was not in charge when WW2 began, and came in just before the Battle of Britain and the Blitz began.

I would recommend they read 'The Churchill Factor. How One Man Made History', available on ebay for £4.10 (free postage). There is bound to be an accurate account within.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

He won't. He will come out saying because of the Ukraine situation it is important there is no change at the top. But yes he should go.... and have been gone a long time ago

And realistically, the Ukraine situation is more important. If we'd known 4 months ago what we know today, then I'd have been saying, yes, Boris must resign, his position is untenable. But he didn't, and we are now in an international crisis situation which Boris and the Government generally seem to be handling reasonably well (other than the issue of visas for Ukrainian refugees for which there are serious problems). The last thing you want to be doing in these circumstances is getting into a major change-the-prime-minister distraction - especially when doing so would involve a full ballot of Conservative members, leaving a potential power vacuum for at least a month or so.

My suspicion is that most Tory MPs are going to feel the same way, which probably means Boris is safe for the foreseeable future, since by the time the Ukraine crisis is over and it becomes reasonable to have a leadership contest, the memories of partygate will have sunk into history. It's not ideal but it's how things work. You have to deal with the situation as it is today, not with what should've happened (but didn't) several months ago.

 

[Howardh]

And realistically, the Ukraine situation is more important. If we'd known 4 months ago what we know today, then I'd have been saying, yes, Boris must resign, his position is untenable. But he didn't, and we are now in an international crisis situation which Boris and the Government generally seem to be handling reasonably well (other than the issue of visas for Ukrainian refugees for which there are serious problems). The last thing you want to be doing in these circumstances is getting into a major change-the-prime-minister distraction - especially when doing so would involve a full ballot of Conservative members, leaving a potential power vacuum for at least a month or so.

My suspicion is that most Tory MPs are going to feel the same way, which probably means Boris is safe for the foreseeable future, since by the time the Ukraine crisis is over and it becomes reasonable to have a leadership contest, the memories of partygate will have sunk into history. It's not ideal but it's how things work. You have to deal with the situation as it is today, not with what should've happened (but didn't) several months ago.

If he can't tell the truth about a simple party, how can we trust him to tell the truth about the Ukraine war?

 

[DarloRich]

But he didn't, and we are now in an international crisis situation which Boris and the Government generally seem to be handling reasonably well

h'way man you cant be serious with this nonsense.

 

[Snow1964]

Tory MPs starting to say it’s serious and there will be a day of reckoning but world events mean that won’t be now. Roger Gale at the front of the queue.

Interestingly Tom Tugendhat is second favourite should Boris for the first time in his life to the honourable thing

I don’t think wars stop removal of Prime ministers

Didn’t H H Asquith get replaced by David Lloyd George during WW1, Neville Chamberlin get replaced by Churchill during WW2, and Margaret Thatcher was replaced during Gulf War

A war in Ukraine doesn’t even have British troops so not a good excuse to say not now (although local elections in 3 weeks doesn’t make it good timing)

 

[DynamicSpirit]

h'way man you cant be serious with this nonsense.

Could you explain which bit of us being in the middle of an international crisis situation you consider to be 'nonsense'? Have I by some chance been imagining all those headlines from the last 6 weeks about a certain country in Europe not that far from the UK having been invaded by the same country that has in the past carried out chemical/nuclear attacks on UK soil?