Which train type will you miss the least when they are all withdrawn?

[12LDA28C]

Class 165s. Uncomfortable tatty units (chiltern) which are way passed there best imo.

Simpler, more basic and better to drive than a 168 though, notwithstanding the lower maximum speed. Less to go wrong too. Let's hope their (there?) replacement in ~5 years' time is similarly good from a driver's point of view.

 

[jh64]

Quite sure this'll p*ss someone off... but for me has to be any and all class 37s. Horrible to look at, and sound like you expect someone to after they've had a tin of beans

Fully agreed - dirty, noisy, ugly things!

 

[gingertom]

the 180s and their thermal events.

 

[yorksrob]

I thought that the above would be the worst possible suggestion in this thread, and then I read this:


Another vote for 150s from me. 3+2 seats, rubbish window alignment, freezing cold in winter with the doors at thirds.

Yes, and you can guarantee that they'll always turn up just when you need a train with some capacity or a table.

They seem to infest the Hallam stopper more often than one would like

 

[Richard Scott]

Cross Country Voyagers. Worst thing to happen to long distance UK rail travel.

Without a doubt. Couldn't stand them 20 years ago and have never changed my mind.
If allowed to include foreign stock the DB 425; they're the most horrid, vile things I've ever had the misfortune to ride on. Totally unsuitable for short distances let alone the longer ones they are used on.

 

[Mikey C]

Any remaining Mk3 EMU (455, 319, 321 etc), as they're really showing their age now, and had major flaws in the design, such as the terrible window alignment. Combined with their far too low seating.

 

[Jamesrob637]

Anything without air-conditioning.

 

[CTS1990]

I agree with the previous posts about Voyagers. Unquestionably, the worst rolling stock ever constructed for a UK rail operator.

To move things on, I won't miss the Class 185s. Dull to look at, uninspiring to ride and hideously cramped when running as a 3 car unit across the Hope Valley at rush hour. I suppose most diagrams are now double units though.

 

[Mikey C]

I agree with the previous posts about Voyagers. Unquestionably, the worst rolling stock ever constructed for a UK rail operator.

To move things on, I won't miss the Class 185s. Dull to look at, uninspiring to ride and hideously cramped when running as a 3 car unit across the Hope Valley at rush hour. I suppose most diagrams are now double units though.

Hardly the fault of the trains though. If every HST just had 3 carriages, they'd have been hideously cramped too!

 

[yorksrob]

I agree with the previous posts about Voyagers. Unquestionably, the worst rolling stock ever constructed for a UK rail operator.

To move things on, I won't miss the Class 185s. Dull to look at, uninspiring to ride and hideously cramped when running as a 3 car unit across the Hope Valley at rush hour. I suppose most diagrams are now double units though.

I would say crowded rather than cramped for the 185's. The actual seat layout strikes me as very spacious, however not so much use if five carriages worth of people are crowded onto three.

I like the trains themselves though.

 

[185]

Which train type will you miss the least when they are all withdrawn?​

Everything built since 2015.

(The year, not the time)

 

[Bletchleyite]

Everything built since 2015.

People called HSTs "trams" and "plastic" when new, and 442s "plastic PIGs", but look at the following they now have...people find it hard to see that anything new will be missed in 50 years' time.

(Yay, I got 442s into the thread! )

 

[Richard Scott]

People called HSTs "trams" and "plastic" when new, and 442s "plastic PIGs", but look at the following they now have...people find it hard to see that anything new will be missed in 50 years' time.

(Yay, I got 442s into the thread! )

I disliked Voyagers when new and nothing has changed my mind. HSTs and 442s were decent trains just, at the time, there were a lot more loco hauled trains around so preferred to do them but wouldn't argue that a mark 1 was preferable to the average passenger than a mk 3. However I would rather go on a Cross Country HST than a Voyager even as a normal passenger, just more comfortable, in my opinion.
It appears next to no progress has been made in passenger comfort over 40/50 years. An IET, a 185 or whatever does not represent an advance over the mk 3 in comfort (I would argue a mk3 rides better than either of those and no underfloor engines either), which it should do.

 

[Russel]

Well, this thread turned out exactly how I thought it would before I opened it!

Cross Country Voyagers. Worst thing to happen to long distance UK rail travel.

 

[YourMum666]

Another train I won’t miss are those 166s, absolutely shoddy trains

 

[brad465]

The next passenger rolling stock to be introduced onto the network, and then the one after, etc. We seem to have peaked with train comfort.

 

[vuzzeho]

319s. Hate every single journey I have on them. At speed, they're too loud (and when a 390 or something passes you - good luck) and they just aren't that comfortable in my view. I can't wait for the day LNWR finally replaces them with something modern.

 

[fgwrich]

Simple choice really. The 165 / 166 family. Scruffy, tired, unloved, uncomfortable, slow (has anyone really, ever found a Networker Turbo with acceleration?), air conditioning that has never seemed to work and the most comfortable seats ruined by the most annoying fan in the world. Sadly it won’t allow me to upload the video of it so you can hear the pleasure of the high pitched whistle it makes.

 

[Mat17]

153 - although where I am they've all left, so 155 is the next worst.

 

[Western 52]

153 - although where I am they've all left, so 155 is the next worst.

153s were built as 2 car 155s and later converted. I agree though, I won't miss them. They are everywhere in my area!

 

[gazr]

376's - Soulless trains. The Networkers aren't far behind, but that's due to lack of care- they all reek inside.

 

[yorksrob]

376's - Soulless trains. The Networkers aren't far behind, but that's due to lack of care- they all reek inside.

I would say that the Networkers haven't aged quite as well as their predecessors.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I'll be very sad indeed when the networkers go and you can be guaranteed to see me on pretty much every farewell tour or enthusiastic excursion offered

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I will not miss:

GWR HSTs - if they turn up I know it could have been an IET, which I vastly prefer for many reasons, so I tend not to be very pleased
TfW/Northern 150s - quite frankly sick of the cold, miserable things
153/155/156s - not as bad but still not pleasant
230s - vanity project that stopped lines otherwise getting nice new stock
319s - should have been gone yonks ago
320s - really very boring, 318s I prefer
323s - not as disgusting as the 465/466 fleet but still uncomfortable, too bright and dingy
334s - very grimy inside due to the cheap lino which is absolutely shocking on every unit
350s - overrated
360s - with how they've ruined EMR services on the Corby route they ought to be scrapped asap
380s - probably as bland a train as can be
455s - they've had their time and I'd much rather the replacement
465/466s - probably the nastiest grimiest trains in the UK
507/508 - see 455s
700/717 - just not very loveable. Extremely efficient, practical and good at their main purpose, but I could never grow actually fond of them enough to miss them when they're gone

 

[bramling]

I would say that the Networkers haven't aged quite as well as their predecessors.

To be fair the EPB fleet wasn’t exactly in the best state when replaced, and they didn’t have as long a life as some fleets (eg 313s) have had.

The big issue with the 465/466 fleet, and same with the 165/166, is they just haven’t been looked after. The 465/466 fleet never has, and the Turbo fleet seems to have been allowed to go to ruin once taken off London work, no doubt because of the usual sweating of assets seen with regional DMU fleets (same as we saw with the old Northern and ATW franchises).

As the 365s well demonstrated, it is quite possible for the Networker concept to provide a decent travelling experience. In their original form especially they were second to none.

 

[SolomonSouth]

As the 365s well demonstrated, it is quite possible for the Networker concept to provide a decent travelling experience. In their original form especially they were second to none.

Well, I'm not sure about that. The 365s are modified 465s, and the issues that plague the 465s such as a sticky floor, defective internal doors, various creaks and squeaks, loud motors, loose seat cushions, a lack of armrests and no air conditioning would be even more prevalent with the long services 365s operated.

Now the 465s (especially the /9s) are smooth and ride well but it just doesn't make up for it. Since the 387 doesn't have many of those flaws (though the ride is shocking at speed I have to say) I imagine many non-railfans prefer them.

Bramling, the love for Networkers is love on the forum only. They are pretty bad trains on the whole and most people who use GN probably prefer the 387, due to:

- Armrests
- Air con
- Less annoying creaks
- Full-sized tables
- More legroom
- Quieter
- Though the seats are not that comfy the cushions actually stay on the seats!

Personally I think the 350/1 has the best qualities of a 365 and 387. It has the modern feeling of a 387 without the ironing boards and rough ride. 1st Class on a 350/1 is comfy also. I remember being pleasantly surprised when I sat in it.

What I'm saying is that the 365s were scrapped young for a reason - heck, the Networkers even acquired the nickname "Notworkers!" so make of that what you will!

 

[12LDA28C]

I will not miss:


230s - vanity project that stopped lines otherwise getting nice new stock

How exactly were the 230s a 'vanity project'? Admittedly they took longer to get into service than envisaged but when they worked they were decent units which were much cheaper than buying similarly-specified brand new units which were clearly never going to be procured.

Has the Marston Vale got 'nice new stock' now that the 230s have gone? No.

 

[Jpr463]

I will not miss the Northern Class 150s. There's nothing as depressing as the sight of a 2 car 150 pulling up on a rush hour service and commencing the game of Human Tetris to somehow slot yourself into one of the hideously cramped seats or finding somewhere to stand whilst maintaining a modicum of personal space. They're slow, noisy, freezing in winter and hot in summer. Whoever thought putting those laid back style seats in (sorry I don't know the proper name) has clearly never sat in them either.
I thought the Pacers were awful, but at least they were so bad that they actually had some charm. The Class 150 is just awful without the charm. Why did Northern not order enough 195s to replace these horrid things as well?

 

[JKF]

Class 19, because I’ve never encountered one so impossible to miss.

 

[yorksrob]

To be fair the EPB fleet wasn’t exactly in the best state when replaced, and they didn’t have as long a life as some fleets (eg 313s) have had.

Over forty years - which is isn't a bad innings. The 313's are a bit of an outlier.