This lower 100 miles/ hour restriction generally does not apply now, as a recent change.especially if a 100mph (vice 110mph) Clas 350 is used on the LNWR operated leg, having doner it myself and sweated on the connection.
This lower 100 miles/ hour restriction generally does not apply now, as a recent change.especially if a 100mph (vice 110mph) Clas 350 is used on the LNWR operated leg, having doner it myself and sweated on the connection.
This is what I thought. However, as I hinted early on, this is a contradiction with the facts. The reality is that these services almost never call at Chesterfield, Burton-on-Trent or Tamworth. I have already mentioned the 1830 and 2030 from Birmingham New Street. Does the OP have a real issue with these two services? They've not alluded to them specifically.why do the fast northeast services that usually skip the 3 stations mentioned sometimes
There is a fair amount of Interchange from MK, Rugby at Tamworth and on a two hourly basis the LNWR service does connect with the Scotland service - though its a bit tight especially if a 100mph (vice 110mph) Clas 350 is used on the LNWR operated leg, having doner it myself and sweated on the connection.
Yes, I think we’re on the same wavelength. I did have a check of the timetable, and would agree such calls are very much in a minority. Which led me to the possibility the calls the OP noticed might have been a temporary alteration for perfectly valid planned reasons.This is what I thought. However, as I hinted early on, this is a contradiction with the facts. The reality is that these services almost never call at Chesterfield, Burton-on-Trent or Tamworth. I have already mentioned the 1830 and 2030 from Birmingham New Street. Does the OP have a real issue with these two services? They've not alluded to them specifically.
I'm actually surprised XC and EM haven't considered stopping at Meadowhall which is a major shopping hub in its own right as well as offering tram connections and rail connections to Rotherham and Barnsley
I thought including a little extra context might be of help or interest given the substance of the original question does not seem to entirely make sense. Perhaps I ought to have worded that more clearly. I could easily have posted in the general and without wider context, as other members whose contributions are no less valuable than mine often do, but that would have looked something like this:I think any posts above referring to the ex-Central trains regional service normal calls, and the calls in the other NE service, are probably a bit of a red herring.
It doesn't.Why does it call at these stations?
A good point. Not that we'll ever know unless the OP comes back to enlighten us.Which led me to the possibility the calls the OP noticed might have been a temporary alteration for perfectly valid planned reasons.
Actually Chesterfield is a good interchange for getting on the long distance XC services when travelling from/to Nottingham, easier than Sheffield since you just stay on the same platform; I change there quite frequently.
Yes it is a popular connection. Lots of Network rail staff use it to get between Derby and MK
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I think it's in general slightly more likely that these services will be 4 car Voyager trains, and as such it is in general less likely they could accommodate the additional traffic. In terms of rolling stock the XC 'Turbostar routes' have been dealt a particularly poor hand.I don't think enough cross country services stop at Tamworth considering Reading/Southampton - Newcastle services have lots of waiting time en-route (this is the only cross country service I don't regularly use so I have no idea whether it's too crowded upon leaving Birmingham to make tamworth calls viable, obviously its more important that all long distance passengers can physically board the train before we consider extra stops).However, Nottingham services are often 2 carriages at busy times and completely full between Tamworth and Birmingham. Also, lots of people do interchange between wcml and XC services at Tamworth.
They would mostly be adequate if they didn't have to carry Birmingham commuter/shopping passengers from/to Burton, Tamworth and the three other stations some of them call at. Birmingham and Nottingham are the two largest cities in the Midlands and 1hr15min for a train journey which is only 50 miles by road isn't really good enough.I think it's in general slightly more likely that these services will be 4 car Voyager trains, and as such it is in general less likely they could accommodate the additional traffic. In terms of rolling stock the XC 'Turbostar routes' have been dealt a particularly poor hand.
I don't think enough cross country services stop at Tamworth considering Reading/Southampton - Newcastle services have lots of waiting time en-route (this is the only cross country service I don't regularly use so I have no idea whether it's too crowded upon leaving Birmingham to make tamworth calls viable, obviously its more important that all long distance passengers can physically board the train before we consider extra stops).However, Nottingham services are often 2 carriages at busy times and completely full between Tamworth and Birmingham. Also, lots of people do interchange between wcml and XC services at Tamworth.
XCs stops are almost certainly legacy
I think in the context of the OP this should be just about the long distance XC services, not the former Central Trains regional service. I don’t think anyone’s suggesting that they might be withdrawn, although I’ve always thought they should have been kept separate from the traditional XC routes and TOC.I use the XC from Birmingham New Street to Burton regularly. There is no other service that stops there other than this, so if XC were to withdraw it, I could no longer get to Burton...
I think in the context of the OP this should be just about the long distance XC services, not the former Central Trains regional service. I don’t think anyone’s suggesting that they might be withdrawn, although I’ve always thought they should have been kept separate from the traditional XC routes and TOC.
If they’d stayed with LM when it was a new franchise would we be having this discussion at all?
I believe the works at Derby last year were supposed to enable some significant time savings for the torturous northbound leg of those Reading-Newcastles between Birmingham and Sheffield, though these have obviously fallen by the wayside with the troubles that have dogged the last few national timetable changes. Southbound the timings are much tighter between Sheffield and Birmingham, including only a six minute reversal at the latter, not enough time to insert one of Burton / Tamworth as a call.
Problem with speeding up Reading to Newcastle services is that they would conflict with ECML services at Doncaster and the preceding XC Edinburgh service at York....
I don't think enough cross country services stop at Tamworth considering Reading/Southampton - Newcastle services have lots of waiting time en-route (this is the only cross country service I don't regularly use so I have no idea whether it's too crowded upon leaving Birmingham to make tamworth calls viable, obviously its more important that all long distance passengers can physically board the train before we consider extra stops).However, Nottingham services are often 2 carriages at busy times and completely full between Tamworth and Birmingham. Also, lots of people do interchange between wcml and XC services at Tamworth.
when I lived in Atherstone my parents used the XC to Tamworth and the local to Atherstone. Those were the days of 304'sDurham has a university and students generate a lot of passenger traffic.
I am intrigued by the idea of Tamworth as an interchange - I am struggling to think of any major flows that would be best served by this route, particularly as the only WCML trains that stop at Tamworth are the slow LNW services.
Yes they may look minor but there isn't really a need for extra platforms for these stations as all the services are reassembly spaced out when passing or stopping. Looking at the DFT category for these stations Tamworth is classed as a important feeder (C2), Burton is Medium Staffed (D) and Chesterfield is Busy/City Station (C1). As with the pathing for a extra service I don't think it would be much of a issue outside of the Birmingham area and there would be a issue of finding the trains to run the service as well.Sorry for the delay guys - I posted this as an off-hand question in another thread totally expecting to just get one reply explaining why. I now see it has been split into a new thread by a mod and generated quite a bit of discussion.
I have posted screenshots of the two trains I typically take each week - the outbound from New St to NCL missing all of those stations, whereas the inbound calls at all of them. Reason I felt they are 'minor' stops is because the other stations New St - NCL are all multi-platform, large stations where several people get on and off, whereas these are all 2 or 3 platform 'small' stations where not many people get on and off. Obviously Durham is only 2-platform but anyone living on the ECML knows this is a fairly major stop which is nearly always very busy, despite the large number of services which stop there.
Interestingly, according to the official XC map (see attached) they deem all the stations I have referred to as indeed being minor, but also seem to place Doncaster in the same category, which is a bit of a surprise.
Regarding the points people have made, I appreciate only XC serve these stations and I am by no means suggesting their services are cut full stop. I was suggesting that, instead, could West Midlands Railway not run a local stopping service between Birmingham and Derby which would serve these stations. However, according to what people have said, there is not enough capacity to do this.
Another good point made is that my outbound service actually takes longer than my inbound service despite missing all of these 'minor' stations out, this is largely due to quite lengthy waiting times - we often spend around 15 minutes at Derby and Sheffield, and approximately 10 minutes at Doncaster and York.
Depends on the service I think. The Southampton/Reading to Newcastle services are busy but normally have seats even with 4 car sets where the Scotland to Plymouth services can be full and standing from Birmingham.Is usually a 4-car voyager which is full to standing on leaving New Street at peak time. Not sure how busy it gets outside of peak hours.