Woking - Basingstoke (near Hook) landslip (15/01/23)

[dgl]

As I have said previously we are due to go to Waterloo from Weymouth on Fri with an advance ticket for the 6:55, contacting SWR on twitter and they have confirmed that we will be allowed to take the 5:26 Bristol bound train, changing at Castle Cary for Paddington. It means it will have to be a taxi to the station but we'll actually get in about an hour and a half early, we have a time limit for getting into London so wanted to make sure we didn't need to risk going the usual route, actual travel time is only about 30mins more than the fastest train so not too bad.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

I've not heard anything, but it looked fairly obvious from the state of it that it wasn't going to be a case of chuck a bit of ballast in and run a tamper through it.

Won't they need to assess the stability of the rest of the embankment in the slip area and the immediately adjacent sections, in case there's another bit on the verge of letting go?

If there putting a temp slew in best to put in long term embankment toe support along the whole length of the embankment not just slip area.

 

[fgwrich]

Has an IET ever been to Basingstoke?

Is it even cleared to go there?

Trans Pennine ones have. They ran to Eastleigh via London, Reading and Basingstoke for attention at the Works.

Yes, IETs are cleared down to Eastleigh from Reading. All the 80X affected by the cracking issue will be visiting Hitachi at Eastleigh Works over the next few years, and all the LNER / TPE / Hull Trains & most GWR examples have already visited Eastleigh Works prior to entry into service and for vinyl livery fitment.

(not my video or photos)

2020.05.07 802218 Basingstoke

While I had made the quick trip to the bridge to watch the usual 6Y48 Eastleigh - Hoo Junction engineers train on the mainline I had also noticed an Eastleigh - Acton path running behind. I has assumed that this was most likely a stone train, but what came around the corner was infact...

www.flickr.com

LNER Class 800 008 Azuma passing through Basingstoke Station.

Time : 10:10 am. Date : July 31st 2020.

www.flickr.com

 

[PG]

An aerial view from the Daily Telegraph showing trees growing on the embankment below the unsupported track.
View attachment 127158

Presumably the railway boundary extends down the embankment to the fence next to the herd of cows?

Would never have happened under BR. Oh, wait...

Thought it wasn't as if BR had a nationally available information service as the internet as we know it didn't exist. It was usually the case of looking up the local station(s) in the phone book and getting the station staff's advice, which to be fair was probably better than an of the corporate gobbledygook spouted nowadays!

 

[infobleep]

From a selfish point of view, I would love to travel to Basingstoke this week just to enjoy the single line working but alas I don't have time to do so.

Last September I was routed via Reading, Basingstoke, and Woking to reach Guildford, when issues resulted in Reading to Guildford trains being used to run extra trains to and from Baskingstoke.

Given that

Disruption is expected until the end of the day on 22/01/23

Live Train Times & Travel Information | South Western Railway

Our journey planner provides live train times and train disruption information. Plan your journey and check for changes that might affect your journey

www.southwesternrailway.com

Does this mean they are hopeful of something in place by next Monday that will, whilst far from perfect allow passengers to travel from affected stations?

This issue has led to even fewer trains fast stopping at Clapham Junction and they don't seem to have been able to add it in as an additional stop for the services that are still running. I mean generally as opposed to just from the west of England.

It's amazing how these plans can be pulled together and resourced now, but it was impossible to do in a similar timeframe when strikes were cancelled...

I am genuinely interested in how it works with rostering given the short notice.

I imagine because the staff are booked to work, that is one less hurdle. And of course, this isn't a network-wide issue.

 

[Goldfish62]

SWR has had a new MD and COO over the last year both ex TfL and other TOCs. Will be interesting to see how they change things following this their first major incident.

She's been in place for nearly a year now. The Salisbury incident was actually the first major incident under Claire Mann's tenure.

A customer-focused MD would ensure that passengers had enough information regarding alternative routes and ticket acceptance. Hiding behind the DfT contract is a cop out.

 

[Horizon22]

Complete lack of information about ticket acceptance on the website.

But that's what you get when SWR don't care, they will still get paid the same regardless if they carry 10 or 100 passengers.

This is particularly poor - it isn't hard to ask GWR or any other operator to accept tickets for a period. If there was also a reduced service on GWR / GTR etc. (such as a strike day) it would be understandable but outside of that, the acceptance isn't a hard process. It might be a bit of a higher level discussion as its for a prolonged period as opposed to your regular service disruption, but I can't see any other major complaints. Even things like getting the London Underground acceptance to connect at terminals within London isn't hard.

And if it is agreed, it is again, not hard (and indeed imperative) to update the website with the relevant customer information.

 

[monxton]

I'm holding two advance tickets to travel up the line to Waterloo and return on Saturday (21/1). Arrival time in London is important, so I will be setting off earlier than planned to allow for the delay. The SWR twitter seems clear now that I can take the route via Basingstoke and Reading into Paddington, and that my advance tickets will be accepted at reasonable equivalent times.

I bought a first class ticket for the return leg, just because it was only a little more expensive at the time I bought it, and the return train is sometimes a bit crowded. There would have been no catering in first class on the SWR main line, just a better seat. IIRC there is no first class on the Reading to Basingstoke line, which is fine. My query is: where am I entitled to sit on the GWR from Paddington to Reading? I don't want to make a fuss, I just want to get there and back.

 

[penguin8967]

Has an IET ever been to Basingstoke?

Yes, GWR ones have been all the way down to Eastleigh for the crack repairs (as pictured below in June last year), although I doubt any IET drivers would sign to Basingstoke (I may be wrong though)

 

[PG]

Hiding behind the DfT contract is a cop out.

I'm not perhaps as conversant as some are with the national rail contracts that the TOC's are now operating under. Do they have to seek DfT permission on ticket acceptance?

 

[Dibbo4025]

Yes, IETs are cleared down to Eastleigh from Reading. All the 80X affected by the cracking issue will be visiting Hitachi at Eastleigh Works over the next few years, and all the LNER / TPE / Hull Trains & most GWR examples have already visited Eastleigh Works prior to entry into service and for vinyl livery fitment.

(not my video or photos)

2020.05.07 802218 Basingstoke

While I had made the quick trip to the bridge to watch the usual 6Y48 Eastleigh - Hoo Junction engineers train on the mainline I had also noticed an Eastleigh - Acton path running behind. I has assumed that this was most likely a stone train, but what came around the corner was infact...

www.flickr.com

LNER Class 800 008 Azuma passing through Basingstoke Station.

Time : 10:10 am. Date : July 31st 2020.

www.flickr.com

They're cleared but with a huge set of restrictions, including platforms at Basingstoke, just not practical to run regularly, even in normal circumstances

 

[Kite159]

This is particularly poor - it isn't hard to ask GWR or any other operator to accept tickets for a period. If there was also a reduced service on GWR / GTR etc. (such as a strike day) it would be understandable but outside of that, the acceptance isn't a hard process. It might be a bit of a higher level discussion as its for a prolonged period as opposed to your regular service disruption, but I can't see any other major complaints. Even things like getting the London Underground acceptance to connect at terminals within London isn't hard.

And if it is agreed, it is again, not hard (and indeed imperative) to update the website with the relevant customer information.

Having clear ticket acceptance on the website/journey checker might even reduce the number of queries to the twitter support team with those pesky passengers asking if they can travel into Paddington on an advance from place X.

 

[Bill57p9]

Looking from the outside in, there doesn't seem to be a playbook for this despite the fact that a blockage on the SWML would seem a credible scenario for a business dependent upon it to plan for.
As critical national infrastructure, do (or did) TOCs (& FOCs for that matter) not routinely produce contingency plans for incidents resulting in the closure of key locations?
Or do the current contracts simply not make such pre-planning business sense?

 

[JamieL]

I'm holding two advance tickets to travel up the line to Waterloo and return on Saturday (21/1). Arrival time in London is important, so I will be setting off earlier than planned to allow for the delay. The SWR twitter seems clear now that I can take the route via Basingstoke and Reading into Paddington, and that my advance tickets will be accepted at reasonable equivalent times.

I bought a first class ticket for the return leg, just because it was only a little more expensive at the time I bought it, and the return train is sometimes a bit crowded. There would have been no catering in first class on the SWR main line, just a better seat. IIRC there is no first class on the Reading to Basingstoke line, which is fine. My query is: where am I entitled to sit on the GWR from Paddington to Reading? I don't want to make a fuss, I just want to get there and back.

In my experience, especially in the evenings, the Reading crowd tend to sit in First Class whether they have a ticket or not. Very occasionally an inspector comes through, shouts "tickets please" and a mass exodus occurs.

 

[antharro]

Just noting that the incident page on the SWR website is now showing some ticket acceptance with GWR. As far as I can see from reading it, it's Basingstoke - Reading - Paddington and includes 'via Woking' tickets. No acceptance on GWR services via Swindon or Newbury. I suppose some is better than none but I really would have expected to see a bit more flexibility.

 

[30907]

Just noting that the incident page on the SWR website is now showing some ticket acceptance with GWR. As far as I can see from reading it, it's Basingstoke - Reading - Paddington and includes 'via Woking' tickets. No acceptance on GWR services via Swindon or Newbury. I suppose some is better than none but I really would have expected to see a bit more flexibility.

Twitter is being a little more flexible, but there aren't many stations from which other routes are a clear advantage other than Exeter itself from which SW fares considerably undercut GW's, so I can understand their thinking.
I haven't heard what Basingstoke-Reading is like on the locals, though!

I bought a first class ticket for the return leg, just because it was only a little more expensive at the time I bought it, and the return train is sometimes a bit crowded. There would have been no catering in first class on the SWR main line, just a better seat. IIRC there is no first class on the Reading to Basingstoke line, which is fine. My query is: where am I entitled to sit on the GWR from Paddington to Reading? I don't want to make a fuss, I just want to get there and back.

You are clearly entitled to sit in first on GW (where it exists!).

 

[swt_passenger]

Looking from the outside in, there doesn't seem to be a playbook for this despite the fact that a blockage on the SWML would seem a credible scenario for a business dependent upon it to plan for.
As critical national infrastructure, do (or did) TOCs (& FOCs for that matter) not routinely produce contingency plans for incidents resulting in the closure of key locations?
Or do the current contracts simply not make such pre-planning business sense?

Yes they do have plans for a closure of that route section - it was blocked Basingstoke to Woking last weekend for routine engineering work anyway, it happens 4 or 5 times every year. As mentioned earlier in the thread they can and have done short notice diversions via Havant and Fareham before, it’s odd they haven’t done any this time, even if not all day in both directions.

 

[endecotp]

there aren't many stations from which other routes are a clear advantage other than Exeter itself

Dorchester and Weymouth?
Maybe Yeovil?

 

[CannonCharge]

Absolute shambles at Woking this morning. I arrived at 07:45 to see 07:43 running 9L and 07:54 due on time.

Both services arrive fairly full looking and depart completely packed with hoards left on the platform.
Even better, the 07:54 is formed of 8 cars which seems madness given the amount of services that aren't running.

Tried talking to one of the managers on the platform to ask if they'd at least manage to make the trains of 12 carriages and his excuse was that many trains were trapped the other side of the landslip. He didn't seem to agree that 3 days was more than enough for them to have moved them to a suitable position!

Then ensued a long wait for the next service to Waterloo which is the 08:24.
During which time 10 empty cars pass through headed for Waterloo and then 12 cars sit in Platform 2 ready to form the 09:19 shuttle service to Basingstoke.
Add to that 2 stopping services cancelled which impact on others further up the line.

My main gripe here is the poor use of the resources they have. A look at RTT shows so many services running as only 8 cars all morning - where is the rest of the stock that's not being used due to the mass cancellations?
Why are 12 cars sitting at Woking station for 1 hour 15? That could easily form a fast service to Waterloo and get back in time to run it's booked service.

I'd think I'm fairly tolerant of the trouble that can arise immediately after an incident but we're 3 or 4 days post that now and to not have something more customer focused in place feels like they're really not trying any more

 

[yorksrob]

I must admit, I'm surprised that they haven't put in an hourly Bournemouth Waterloo via Havant.

 

[Colin1501]

Yesterday (17th January), the down shuttle between Woking and Basingstoke was running on the up slow. Given that this is adjacent to the platforms at all of the intermediate stations, why is this service not calling at Fleet, Winchfield and Hook?

 

[swt_passenger]

I must admit, I'm surprised that they haven't put in an hourly Bournemouth Waterloo via Havant.

I’ve been told before there’s a clear path at least Woking to Southampton available each way most hours in the normal timetable. It’s used by the mid-day ECS route learners

 

[yorksrob]

I’ve been told before there’s a clear path at least Woking to Southampton available each way most hours in the normal timetable. It’s used by the mid-day ECS route learners

And there will be plenty vacated East of Woking for the timebeing as well now.

 

[The Ham]

It's interesting to compare with when Dawlish washed out, that was sorted in 8 weeks (and they had to paddle in the sea!), there was a half decent rail replacement service and GWR would have had bigger issues with trains being the wrong side of the incident.

Add to that it was in the national news for a few days and ministers visited, it appears very much like a lot of people aren't caring very much (obviously there's a lot going on behind the scenes, and I suspect the NR guys are working hard, but it's more the impression).

 

[winks]

Reading the SWR info page on the landslip - they are hoping to increase services by the weekend.

Is this looking hopeful?

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Absolute shambles at Woking this morning. I arrived at 07:45 to see 07:43 running 9L and 07:54 due on time.

Both services arrive fairly full looking and depart completely packed with hoards left on the platform.
Even better, the 07:54 is formed of 8 cars which seems madness given the amount of services that aren't running.

Tried talking to one of the managers on the platform to ask if they'd at least manage to make the trains of 12 carriages and his excuse was that many trains were trapped the other side of the landslip. He didn't seem to agree that 3 days was more than enough for them to have moved them to a suitable position!

Then ensued a long wait for the next service to Waterloo which is the 08:24.
During which time 10 empty cars pass through headed for Waterloo and then 12 cars sit in Platform 2 ready to form the 09:19 shuttle service to Basingstoke.
Add to that 2 stopping services cancelled which impact on others further up the line.

My main gripe here is the poor use of the resources they have. A look at RTT shows so many services running as only 8 cars all morning - where is the rest of the stock that's not being used due to the mass cancellations?
Why are 12 cars sitting at Woking station for 1 hour 15? That could easily form a fast service to Waterloo and get back in time to run it's booked service.

I'd think I'm fairly tolerant of the trouble that can arise immediately after an incident but we're 3 or 4 days post that now and to not have something more customer focused in place feels like they're really not trying any more

With so many trains missing running everything as a 12 car should be base case and clearly is for the shuttles.

They can get stock over via Fareham to Fratton so poor excuse and must have plenty of drivers they could deploy to move some units.

Anyhow hope you put in a complaint

 

[DelW]

I’ve been told before there’s a clear path at least Woking to Southampton available each way most hours in the normal timetable. It’s used by the mid-day ECS route learners

Apart from anything else, there are the paths of the second hourly Portsmouth semifasts via Guildford, which haven't run since Covid (xx:15 from Waterloo), unless there are problems with those timings on the lines west of Cosham.

 

[philthetube]

But even the school-only bus operators with just morning/afternoon work would still be needed elsewhere for a few hours morning and afternoon, plus a middle of the day break for their drivers to comply with driving hours regulations, so it’d be questionable how much use you’d get out of them anyway. Maybe 0930-1330, and probably not much later as after school runs (which can often see a run for a school finishing about 1500 followed by a college run an hour or two later) the drivers would be limited how much more they could do before they’d be thinking about rest period for work the next day.

They couldn't work 0700 to 1330 without a break in the middle of that either, so probably needing two breaks, additionally depending on the actual work done they may run under bus driving hours and have to do the work on coach hours, further reducing the availability of drivers.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Apart from anything else, there are the paths of the second hourly Portsmouth semifasts via Guildford, which haven't run since Covid (xx:15 from Waterloo), unless there are problems with those timings on the lines west of Cosham.

oh yes good point they could be used but no doubt haven't got sufficient crews with retained route knowledge

 

[swt_passenger]

Reading the SWR info page on the landslip - they are hoping to increase services by the weekend.

Is this looking hopeful?

That will be possible with the track slew they are apparently going to do. (As has been discussed over the last day or so.)

But my reading of SWR’s latest summary suggests nothing in the way of major work has actually started, they note that an access road is to be built.