Would Grand Central ever find use for InterCity 225's

[turntablist]

I know its probably not going to happen, but in the tradition of "what if" threads on here with regard to rolling stock, I wonder would any open access operator ever find use for the 91's and MK4 sets once they become available

 

[Bantamzen]

Almost certainly never IMO, given that Grand Central tend to operate services from areas off the main lines and are therefore are away from the wires. If anything, they might in the future be inclined to look at the 800s. But that's a long way off yet, assuming their business model survives the march of bi-modes with the bigger operators.

 

[Willr2094]

Unless Grand Central decide to attack Virgin Trains East Coast by introducing a service from Kings Cross which terminates in York, then its highly unlikely, given that their Sunderland service is only under the overhead wires as far as Northallerton and there are no overhead wires at Bradford Interchange.

 

[yorkie]

I know its probably not going to happen, but in the tradition of "what if" threads on here with regard to rolling stock, I wonder would any open access operator ever find use for the 91's and MK4 sets once they become available

No, because the Bradford and Sunderland branches are not electrified.

 

[The 4th Rail]

First of all this would never happen. But the only potential Grand central ECML use for the 225's I can think of is an all day Skipton service. Similar to how Hull trains provides an all day service and VTEC just the one to Hull.

 

[xotGD]

First of all this would never happen. But the only potential Grand central ECML use for the 225's I can think of is an all day Skipton service. Similar to how Hull trains provides an all day service and VTEC just the one to Hull.

I would be happy with that. I doubt that they would get paths in and out of Leeds so would have to be diesel to run via Woodlesford.

 

[yorkie]

Not going to happen. There isn't the demand for it, and it's ridiculous filling the ECML with lots of short open access trains.

 

[Clansman]

Never going to happen. Although I thought the Mk4s & DVT could last somewhere else, knowing that the locos were going to be scrapped. At the end of the day, they're going, and that's how the cookie crumbles now a days.

 

[PYROOGOBBO]

will 91's see at least preservation?

 

[najaB]

will 91's see at least preservation?

Take a look at this thread and see if your questions are answered: British Rail Class 91 and Mark IV coaches where are they going to go?

 

[PeterC]

In BR days I would have expected a cascade to the GEML.

 

[D365]

In BR days I would have expected a cascade to the GEML.

Why? The Class 91s are less suitable than the Class 90s.

 

[najaB]

Why? The Class 91s are less suitable than the Class 90s.

Indeed. This was all discussed in the linked thread.

 

[Qwerty133]

Why? The Class 91s are less suitable than the Class 90s.

Since when was suitability ever considered by BR...

 

[dubscottie]

Since when was suitability ever considered by BR...

Other than pacers when was it not considered?

 

[jopsuk]

The current GC plan seems to be to take on most of/all the 180s to retire their HST fleet

 

[Townsend Hook]

The current GC plan seems to be to take on most of/all the 180s to retire their HST fleet

They're taking on the four recently withdrawn from GWR to replace their HSTs. The Hull Trains four still don't have confirmed homes once their replacement 802s are introduced, AFAIK.

 

[43096]

They're taking on the four recently withdrawn from GWR to replace their HSTs. The Hull Trains four still don't have confirmed homes once their replacement 802s are introduced, AFAIK.

GWR have/had five 180s, of which 180108 has now gone to Heaton for GC.

 

[Townsend Hook]

GWR have/had five 180s, of which 180108 has now gone to Heaton for GC.

Indeed it is, as the first ex-GWR unit to move across.

 

[DarloRich]

I know its probably not going to happen, but in the tradition of "what if" threads on here with regard to rolling stock, I wonder would any open access operator ever find use for the 91's and MK4 sets once they become available

gonna have a problem running them from Northallerton to Sunderland and from Wakefield to Bradford.......................................

 

[squizzler]

The Wikipedia on the class 91 says:

The locomotive also features an underslung transformer so that the body is relatively empty compared to contemporary electric locomotives

Space for a diesel genset?

 

[CosherB]

Space for a diesel genset?

No no no no no no no ........... what sort of locomotive are you trying to build? Last mile diesel? Genuine bi-mode?

91s are term served and justifying the huge expense of trying to achieve such a scheme (even if it is technically possible) would be a monumental task for a fleet of 30 year old locomotives. Eversholt Rail won't do it.

 

[squizzler]

Backup diesel power could be handy if there was a desire to create short formation class 91/mk4 sets for long and thin routes as an electric answer to the "pocket rocket" short HST's on Scotrail and GWR. That said, I guess that if we were looking at a bi-mode then the obvious place for the genny would be the DVT - either that or substitute DVT for a class 43 as I gather happened when the east coast sets came into service. Depending on the engineering one might be prepared to undertake the 43 could be stripped of its own traction motors and thru-wired to 91.

Actually, having written the above, and being aware of the mk 4 being considered heavier and less track friendly than the HST, the better option might be to split an HST and keep the mk3's, but with a 91 on the other end of both halves the former HST. The 43's can, as above, be turned to powerhouses by removing traction motors to save weight, friction and maintenance. As always I'm not saying this will or should happen, just speculating on what is technically possible.

 

[CosherB]

Backup diesel power could be handy if there was a desire to create short formation class 91/mk4 sets for long and thin routes as an electric answer to the "pocket rocket" short HST's on Scotrail and GWR. That said, I guess that if we were looking at a bi-mode then the obvious place for the genny would be the DVT - either that or substitute DVT for a class 43 as I gather happened when the east coast sets came into service. Depending on the engineering one might be prepared to undertake the 43 could be stripped of its own traction motors and thru-wired to 91.

Actually, having written the above, and being aware of the mk 4 being considered heavier and less track friendly than the HST, the better option might be to split an HST and keep the mk3's, but with a 91 on the other end of both halves the former HST. The 43's can, as above, be turned to powerhouses by removing traction motors to save weight, friction and maintenance. As always I'm not saying this will or should happen, just speculating on what is technically possible.

Quite right ..... none of this will ever happen. Just buy an 80X.

 

[DarloRich]

Quite right ..... none of this will ever happen. Just buy an 80X.

no.no.no. Hire in a deltic and a couple of coaches

 

[route:oxford]

no.no.no. Hire in a deltic and a couple of coaches

A Deltic would be more than capable of hauling a Mk4 set surely?

 

[43096]

Another of those "what if" threads that are an utter waste of bandwidth...
:roll::roll:

 

[squizzler]

no.no.no. Hire in a deltic and a couple of coaches

...And when we run out of Deltics, dig further back into the east coast archive and start fetching out Gresley A4's

 

[Townsend Hook]

...And when we run out of Deltics, dig further back into the east coast archive and start fetching out Gresley A4's

As modern as that? What's wrong with a nice Stirling Single?

 

[swt_passenger]

jcollins has just pointed out in a new thread that GNWR are now proposing 91s and Mk 4s for their Blackpool - Euston service that has been on the back burner for a few years.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=148297

Is GNWR close enough to GC for the question originally posed here?