Bad news for Pensioners, Commuters etc in South Yorkshire

[tbtc]

http://www.sypte.co.uk/media.aspx?id=3788

Given the budget cuts imposed upon South Yorkshire PTE, it looks like the cuts are going to fall on:

• Pensioners/ Disabled (may now have to wait until 09:30 for their free travel, which is when most of England's councils start, plus may lose free train travel - again something that was more generous in South Yorkshire)
  
• Shoppers (the FreeBee services in Sheffield and Rotherham may be cut)
  
• Commuters (the specific express service to the two Park & Ride sites in Doncaster may be cut - long running "all-stop" First services also serve those sites)

These savings mean that the following provision may be "saved":

• Child tickets won't go up this April
  
• Tendered evening/ Sunday services to remain (some of these are scaled down from the level of provision

Tough times for a lot of councils/ PTEs, and I don't want to get into an argument about whether we should have spending cuts or not - interesting to see the way that SYPTE are going though.

OAPs and FreeBee buses targeted as transport chiefs look to implement big budget cuts

30 January 2014

• FreeBee bus services to be ended
• OAP and disabled free travel cut back
• Community transport fares to rise
• Peak time express park and ride services cut
• But the good news is child fares frozen

FREE bus services in Sheffield and Rotherham are to be discontinued and the concessionary fare scheme for older people scaled back as transport chiefs look to make big budget savings from April.

The proposed cutbacks, which are due to be considered next week by councillors, come as South Yorkshire Passenger Transport Executive (SYPTE) and South Yorkshire Integrated Transport Authority aim to make savings of around 10% to their annual budget.

Under the proposals the two FreeBee bus services in Sheffield and Rotherham centres, which are funded by public subsidy, would be discontinued from the end of April. And the express 638 bus service in Doncaster, which runs weekday peak times between Doncaster North and South Park and Ride sites via the Town Centre, is proposed to be discontinued from the end of April.

The OAP and disabled persons concessionary travel scheme could also be scaled back so that weekday free travel is available from 9.30am to 11pm, bringing South Yorkshire in line with the rest of the country outside of London. Councillors are also due to consider scaling back of concessionary travel on train services.

Proposals are also to cut grants to community transport services, although operators will be able to offset this by raising fares by 50p.

But travel chiefs say that the good news is that child concessionary fares won’t go up this April and that evening, weekend and rural bus services funded by SYPTE have been protected from cuts too. Talks are taking place with operators with a view to introducing new young persons’ daily and weekly tickets, which will help to make public transport even more affordable.

Today’s announcement comes as the economic climate within the region remains gloomy, with the South Yorkshire district councils and many other public sector organisations being forced to make significant cuts. Over the past three years SYPTE has had its budget slashed by more than £17 million and has made deep cuts in its workforce. The budget cuts which SYPTE/SYITA is making to its budget for next year total £8.3 million, and is faced with reducing its workforce by a further 16%.

SYPTE oversees and delivers public transport and is specifically responsible for maintaining the county’s public transport infrastructure, including its interchanges and bus stops.

It also subsidises bus services which operators say don’t make enough money to be commercially viable. These services, which make up a sixth of all bus miles in the county, are mainly evening, weekend and rural services.

Cllr Mick Jameson, Chairman of South Yorkshire Integrated Transport Authority (SYITA), which oversees the work of SYPTE, said: “We don’t like having to raise fares and cut back on services but when your budgets are being slashed then there simply isn’t a great deal of choice. The savings have to come from somewhere.

“The good news is that we have largely been able to protect the bus network and that child fares aren’t being touched this year.”

Over the past two years SYPTE pulled in around £150 million worth of funding from Government and European sources for transport projects such as Tram-Train, Bus Rapid Transit, as well as new cycle facilities and schemes to boost access to jobs and training.

It was named as Integrated Transport Authority of the Year in the 2013 National Transport Awards.

 

[overthewater]

Surly, 638 bus service could be commercial?

 

[anthony263]

Surly, 638 bus service could be commercial?

I am sure the operator will be looking at whether or not it can run the service commercially.

New Adventure Travel have done this in south wales with the 303/304 Bridgend - Llantwit Major - Barry - Cardiff services when the local council withdrew the funding for it and many ther services.

My local council are planning a massive cut to school bus services in 2014/2015 although to be fare we have the most generous school bus network in Wales. One or two routes have already be registered commercially and I suspect we will see a couple more

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I see these South Yorkshire PTE details as an interesting comparison to the other thread that discussed how TfGMC put forward their 2014/2015 budget proposals, where staff cuts were one method of finance overhead reduction.

Interesting how the holders of the ENCTS pass are viewed for rail service use of that pass in South Yorkshire when compared to those in the TfGM area.

I speak as a neutral from Cheshire East with no axe to grind either way.

 

[34D]

Good. About time that bizarre situations such as a SY pass holder being able to board a bus in WY before 09:30 (or a train in WY after then) were iradicated.

 

[anthony263]

The Welsh Government are looking at placing more restrictions on the use of free bus passes

 

[ECML180]

I would surprise me if the 638 was retained in it's current form, when I used to catch the other (stopping) service it passed me more than half empty all the time, though to be fair it was always getting busier.

On the other hand, if the buses were redeployed on the stopping service over the southern end (55) it could be worthwhile as they can be very busy, plus the 638 vehicles are single deckers and these may be a more appropriate size for the 55 during the day.

Of course this all depends of how revenue is handled, ISTR you buy bus tickets from a car park ticket machine before boarding, so where the money ends up or how much anyone gets I don't know!

 

[Tetchytyke]

Until the government finally abolish the expensive and pointless ENCTS, all this is just fiddling with deckchairs on the Titanic.

I would imagine ditching express park and ride buses would be a big mistake though. I can't imagine people continuing to use the park and ride if they have to use all-shacks service buses. I don't think King Lane in Leeds is used anywhere near as well as it should.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Until the government finally abolish the expensive and pointless ENCTS, all this is just fiddling with deckchairs on the Titanic.

May I enquire as to your age and the number of years that you have been contributing income tax to HM Government. I am almost 69 years of age, worked all my working life and paying income tax in every one of those years.

In our area of Cheshire East, neither my wife or I are entitled to anything but bus travel, unlike those over the border in Greater Manchester who also seem to qualify for the use of that pass at certain times on both trains and trams with the boundaries of that area.

Perhaps we shall now see people of pensionable age being put forward as to have their free prescriptions terminated..

 

[brompton rail]

Until the government finally abolish the expensive and pointless ENCTS, all this is just fiddling with deckchairs on the Titanic.

I would imagine ditching express park and ride buses would be a big mistake though. I can't imagine people continuing to use the park and ride if they have to use all-shacks service buses. I don't think King Lane in Leeds is used anywhere near as well as it should.

I can't imagine that removing the Peak Times only 638 bus will make any real difference to Doncaster's Park and Ride. Both sites (north and south) are also served by frequent services which travel the same roads. None of the P&R sites are overwhelmed by users.
Rossington Bridge, Highfields, are served by buses at least every 10 minutes.
White Rose Way (Morrisons) has its own (mostly empty) dedicated 10 minute service. Adwick station and Bentley station have 2 trains per hour and neither is yet full. Both offer much quicker journeys into Town of course.

Regarding reductions in Pensioners Pass facilities the change from 0900 to 0930 will just move the peak half hour on.

Scaling back on train travel perhaps might mean withdrawal of the concession to travel to West Yorkshire.(SY passes are valid to Leeds/Wakefield/Huddersfield on through Northern (only) trains). However it could also mean that passes are only valid on Northern trains (I.e. Not on XC, EMT or TPE) and that the Northern concession to WY remains. I suspect removal of this letter concession would cause the greatest Press fuss. 'scaling back' does not suggest removal of the rail concession ( maybe in reserve for further massive spending cuts 2015 and beyond?).

 

[Batman]

Regarding child fares, I'm surprised nobody's suggested the idea of only giving discounted fares to kids who get free school meals. They would of course need to be issued with photo ID cards to prove their eligibility.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Removing the 'FreeBee' bus in Sheffield city centre would be a big mistake in my opinion. Sheffield is not a place that's blessed with convenient topography between the railway station and the main shopping area! Given that shopping in Sheffield is only just now starting to recover some of the trade it lost after Meadowhell opened, anything that makes it less convenient will seriously affect trade. Whether Rotherham can justify such a service is another matter though- the only places I've ever visited in Rotherham are Millmoor and C.F. Booth's!

 

[johnnychips]

Regarding child fares, I'm surprised nobody's suggested the idea of only giving discounted fares to kids who get free school meals. They would of course need to be issued with photo ID cards to prove their eligibility.

£7 a week with a 70p child fare, compared with, say, a First Doncaster weekly pass for £13. That assumes child only takes one bus there and back a day. Of course the pass could be used at weekends as well. I think almost doubling the fare would be politically unacceptable.

Trying to issue photocards to free school meal holders would be a costly and bureaucratic problem as the register of eligible students changes frequently.

 

[NorthernSpirit]

Until the government finally abolish the expensive and pointless ENCTS, all this is just fiddling with deckchairs on the Titanic.

My wife has to use one because of her disability, she is autistic and it helps her get about. Remove that privilidge and she will have to get a car but the DVLA won't give her a licence because of her disability.

 

[david16]

Good. About time that bizarre situations such as a SY pass holder being able to board a bus in WY before 09:30 (or a train in WY after then) were iradicated.

There's nothing to stop thrm travelling before 9.30am .

Just that they have to pay a fare if they want to have a good day out for 4 hours + at a distant destination.

Perhaps a £1 single for a journey on any bus before 9.30am and £2 day fare if they wish to travel by train or coach to travel afar if they board the initial bus before 9.30am. Expecting pensioners to pay full fare when boarding a bus before 9.30am is rather excessive.

A good day out to a town 50 miles away from where you live when travelling after 9.30am and you can only travel on all stopping buses, and it involves 2 or 3 changes each way with lengthy waits at bus stops is impossible. It's not a good day out at all if all you can do is have a cup of tea and a piece of cake at the bus station before you have to start returning home less than an hour later.

 

[SuperOwl86]

Not sure if i have got this wrong or not, but are sypte reducing the Mobility pass from all day to 9.30am- 11pm like the OAP pass?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Not sure if I have got this wrong or not, but are SYPTE reducing the Mobility pass from all day to 9.30am- 11pm like the OAP pass?

Please desist from the use of "OAP" pass, as the correct definition is "ENCTS"..:roll:

 

[northwichcat]

May I enquire as to your age and the number of years that you have been contributing income tax to HM Government. I am almost 69 years of age, worked all my working life and paying income tax in every one of those years.

In our area of Cheshire East, neither my wife or I are entitled to anything but bus travel, unlike those over the border in Greater Manchester who also seem to qualify for the use of that pass at certain times on both trains and trams with the boundaries of that area.

Perhaps we shall now see people of pensionable age being put forward as to have their free prescriptions terminated..

It's not just pensioners who are affected by the postcode lottery. I have to pay £7.85 for a prescription, while someone in Wales pays nothing whatever their age. While the local train fares are much higher in Cheshire than in Greater Manchester or Merseyside.

 

[sheff'd victoria]

• Pensioners/ Disabled (may now have to wait until 09:30 for their free travel, which is when most of England's councils start, plus may lose free train travel - again something that was more generous in South Yorkshire)
  

• 
  
  Fully agree with this, they should be charged either a flat rate of 70p or get 50% knocked off a full fare.

 

[transmanche]

It's not just pensioners who are affected by the postcode lottery.

People only call it a 'postcode lottery' when they don't get something that people living elsewhere do.

When it's the other way round, it's called devolution - or local decision-making meeting local needs.

 

[northwichcat]

People only call it a 'postcode lottery' when they don't get something that people living elsewhere do.

vWhen it's the other way round, it's called devolution - or local decision-making meeting local needs.

In the case of prescriptions I can see why children and pensioners could be seen as needing free or reduced rate ones. However, I fail to see why working age people in Flintshire need free prescriptions more than those in say Teeside.

 

[transmanche]

In the case of prescriptions I can see why children and pensioners could be seen as needing free or reduced rate ones. However, I fail to see why working age people in Flintshire need free prescriptions more than those in say Teeside.

They don't. But it's a political decision made based on the wants/needs of the Welsh electorate. I.e. devolution in action.

In England the DoH state that 90% of all prescriptions are free. (Not just pensioners and children, but pregnant/new mothers, people on various benefits and those with certain medical conditions, etc also get free prescriptions.)

The Welsh Government has obviously decided that by saving the money spent in administering all these schemes, then the 'extra cost' of making the remaining 10% of prescriptions free at the point of issue is something they can afford - and is something the electorate wants.

That's not a 'postcode lottery' - that's devolution.

 

[34D]

My wife has to use one because of her disability, she is autistic and it helps her get about. Remove that privilidge and she will have to get a car but the DVLA won't give her a licence because of her disability.

Or she pays for her bus fare

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

No-one can decry the pre 0930 Monday to Friday bus travel arrangements of ENCTS pass holders that are issued by TfGM as they pay the same full bus fare as those travelling to work. I cited a cost of £1.70 for a two bus stop travel in another thread recently in part of Stockport, where an elderly female resident (a friend of my wife) having walking difficulties had to visit a local health centre for an 0845 "non-changeable" medical appointment within a specialist part of the health centre.

 

[david16]

It's not as though there are many 10's of 1000's of OAP's right across the uk are going on lengthy day trips going through several counties or districts by bus for free for most of the year every single year.

But even if it was proven to be the case they are still meeting the terms and conditions of the bus pass of free nationwide bus travel.

It's not fair now that a lengthy distance day trip for pensioners in south yorkshire is limited to a cup of tea and a scone e.g. once they get there now.

 

[transmanche]

I'm not sure what the objection to the ENCTS pass is here.

Is it an objection to the whole thing (i.e. pensioners should not receive free bus travel), or the fact that it covers the whole of England?

If its the latter, then would it be preferable for it to be confined to a regional entitlement (e.g. Yorkshire and the Humber region) - rather than a specific borough or county (e.g. SYPTE) as previously.

 

[overthewater]

The English scheme is far too big, but restricting people to a regional area would open up a can of worms, because if you live on the boundary line, it would mean you could only travel one way.

The best solution would be zones, so people could travel in their local area and one zone out.

I don't understand why people are objecting to the scheme. The problems are not caused by the users or bus companies; its the fault of local councils who are doing it on the cheap. It is the councils people should be complaining to.

 

[transmanche]

The English scheme is far to big but again making only to a regional area would open up a can of worms: because if you live on the boundary line, means you could only travel one way.

But this already happens to people living in border areas (e.g. Chester, Berwick upon Tweed - although there are sometimes local arrangements for limited cross-border availability.)

 

[34D]

But this already happens to people living in border areas (e.g. Chester, Berwick upon Tweed - although there are sometimes local arrangements for limited cross-border availability.)

Are there not cross border arrangements for _all_ areas along both sides of both english-welsh and english-scotland fronteirs?

 

[ModernRailways]

Without my Grandad's ENCTS pass he wouldn't go out. Right now, he goes to Morrisons in the car for his shopping and then he'll go up to the town with me on a weekend. If he didn't have his pass he wouldn't do so. His pass gets him out and about.

I also have an ENCTS pass for being disabled. It's valid all-day because I am in full-time education, on top of that it's £25 for a year of travel on the Metro. I'd be happy to pay a lot more as I was paying £30 every 4 weeks previously. I've found however that I am making a lot more journey's than I used to make. I used to travel by bus maybe once or twice a year, now it's more once or twice each week. I've started to visit more places etc. too because I know I am able too.

Removing the pass to people would basically be removing their livelihood, there are a lot of people in my local area who are elderly and use the bus to go 3 or 4 stops up the road to the local Labour club. If the bus wasn't there it's a lot less likely they would go out.

You must also remember that these elderly people have also paid their taxes etc. over the years they were working. The ENCTS pass is essentially a way of saying 'Thank You' for helping the economy and country grow!

A zonal system would also be pointless as most journeys right now are just made within a certain area. It's not often you see a stray pass holder for a different area - I've only seen 1. What would be better is for a blanket rule of that it only entitles you to free bus travel. Certain areas could offer benefits to pass holders, but those benefits must also be given to all pass holders and not just those in the area. Local residents may get a discount, for example right now a Gold Card for the T&W Metro is £25 for local residents or £35 for residents outside of the T&W PTE area. A similar system should be put in place across all areas.

I'm amazed that those with Freedom Passes in London get free travel on all services! That must cost an absolute fortune yet meanwhile other systems are struggling... I think that's the issue here certain areas getting pretty much all travel for free and others having to pay normal adult fares.