Questions about driving trains.

[civ-eng-jim]

Is there anything drivers can do to make up for lost time? Can one overspeed with permission? Can one drive faster than the maximum train speed as long as you're within linespeed?

 

[A-driver]

Is there anything drivers can do to make up for lost time? Can one overspeed with permission? Can one drive faster than the maximum train speed as long as you're within linespeed?

No to all those questions in short.

If you are late you are late. No one expects a driver to make up for any lost time, no matter how it is caused. Even pushing braking points isn't expected or at all advised.

If line speed is 75 you never ever exceed 75. If unit speed is 75 you never exceed that. If you can only comfortably get 45mph between 2 stations you don't push to get 55 as you are 6down.

As many drivers say, if you are running 10 mins late and manage to make up 4 of the lost minutes en route no one is going to give you a medal, pay rise, prize or even say thank you or well done. However if you attempt to make up lost time and overshoot a platform, trigger TPWS, speed over points, SPAD etc then your head will be on the block. Claiming you were trying to make up lost time is no defence and all you will be told is "if you are late, you are late. Safety must come first".

 

[civ-eng-jim]

Thank you!

A few more:

I work in design and often have to propose walkways to lineside phones. How often, if ever, do drivers use lineside or signal post phones rather than the in-cab phone? And if you ever do use the lineside phone, is the 20 odd metre walkway a bit unnecessary?

 

[HSTfan!!!]

It's dying off now with the widespread rollout of GSM-R, whereas in the past we'd have to get down and phone at a red signal, I don't even have to move off my backside to press the SG button.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Thank you!

A few more:

I work in design and often have to propose walkways to lineside phones. How often, if ever, do drivers use lineside or signal post phones rather than the in-cab phone? And if you ever do use the lineside phone, is the 20 odd metre walkway a bit unnecessary?

In places I imagine it is still a regular occurrence, GSMR has probably reduced the instances where you would go down to the signal post telephone (SPT) by 90% but there are still times and areas where GSMR coverage is spotty at best and they are when a landline is very much appreciated. I guess it can seem weird that the time when we are spending so much money on making safe walking routes to SPT's is also the time when a new radio system has almost rendered them obsolete but I guess that's what a culture of suing each other for damages has done to the world.

 

[Nym]

Thank you!

A few more:

I work in design and often have to propose walkways to lineside phones. How often, if ever, do drivers use lineside or signal post phones rather than the in-cab phone? And if you ever do use the lineside phone, is the 20 odd metre walkway a bit unnecessary?

It isn't the best thinking to try and make it so one doesn't have signal post telephones, or remove walkways to them. GSM-R won't always work...

 

[notadriver]

It isn't the best thinking to try and make it so one doesn't have signal post telephones, or remove walkways to them. GSM-R won't always work...

Isn't that what they've done on the Cambrian Coast line that has ERTMS. No SPTs there.

 

[JoeGJ1984]

On No-Signalman Token Remote lines (such as the Heart of Wales line), are the Tyer's token instruments (such as number 9) normally used? When these are used with a signalman, the signalman at the opposite end has to push his plunger to allow a token to be withdrawn. But in No Signalman token operation, there may be nobody on the corresponding machine at the other end (although they have to contact a signaller at a central location). So how does this work?

 

[yorkie]

Is there anything drivers can do to make up for lost time? Can one overspeed with permission? Can one drive faster than the maximum train speed as long as you're within linespeed?

The only time I can think of where the latter applies, is the Sleeper generally has an 80mph restriction for comfort. The loco and rolling stock is capable of 100mph though (the Caledonian Sleeper has some Mk2 vehicles, otherwise it'd be 110mph capable). If the train is very late, the train can be authorised to run faster than the usual 80mph speed, but within the maximum speed for the loco, stock, and track of course.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

I'm told that Pendolino's have a boost mode which the driver can activate if they are late. I know they are designed for 140mph work but are limited to 125 by UK siganlling so they only run around at something like 85% power (I'm pulling a number out of the air there by the way) and the boost mode makes more power available. It can't increase the top end obviously so I presume it increases acceleration. If it actually exists of course.

 

[notadriver]

I've been told the same mate but boost mode simply restores power to the what they were originally capable of rather than nominally running at 85% power. I'm not sure about the savings. With electric traction the most efficient way to operate is to reach cruising speed as soon as possible.

As has been said trains cannot exceed their speed limits to make up time and even incredible except on the few lines equipped with some form of ATP it is solely down to the driver to do so. One advantage of using alternate modes of transport such as coaches is that they can make up time speeding by exceeding the lower limits away from motorways.

 

[jopsuk]

It isn't the best thinking to try and make it so one doesn't have signal post telephones, or remove walkways to them. GSM-R won't always work...

When you no longer have signal posts, how do you decide where to put SPTs?

 

[ChrisTheRef]

When you no longer have signal posts, how do you decide where to put SPTs?

At a guess, probably just put them every 1/8th of a mile or so - like we have on motorways at present. Maybe every 1/4 mile, and just have a lineside phone next to every mile post?

 

[Llama]

(wrong thread)

 

[ComUtoR]

When you no longer have signal posts, how do you decide where to put SPTs?

I've seen plenty of SPT's that aren't on a signal post. They are often posted on walls, platforms, and even placed in the track.

Why can't Drivers use ther mobiles ?

 

[A-driver]

I've seen plenty of SPT's that aren't on a signal post. They are often posted on walls, platforms, and even placed in the track.



Why can't Drivers use ther mobiles ?

Well if it's not on a signal post then it's not an SPT! It's a line side phone which you have seen which is different, it's a normal internal railway phone, not a direct line to the controlling signaller.

Drivers can only use mobiles when stationary but it's obviously dependant on having signal, there are a surprising number of locations where you don't have mobile signal to call the box.

 

[455driver]

It's dying off now with the widespread rollout of GSM-R, whereas in the past we'd have to get down and phone at a red signal, I don't even have to move off my backside to press the SG button.

Those ballast operated signals are just not the same now though!


This refers to the fact that quite often, as soon as the drivers feet touched the ballast the signal would clear.

 

[O L Leigh]

TCB = Track Circuit Ballast.

Of course there are also those DRA controlled signals and, in CSR and GSM-R areas, SG controlled signals too.

O L Leigh

 

[A-driver]

TCB = Track Circuit Ballast.

Of course there are also those DRA controlled signals and, in CSR and GSM-R areas, SG controlled signals too.

O L Leigh

I thought that the SG button was actually wired up to the green bulb as whenever I press it, after a delay of about 2 seconds, the signal changes from red straight to green!

 

[Hairy Bear]

I thought that the SG button was actually wired up to the green bulb as whenever I press it, after a delay of about 2 seconds, the signal changes from red straight to green!

Ha, Thats what I thought as well !.

Could do with another that means "Oi , set the road, I'm coming".

What else could we have ?.

 

[carriageline]

When you no longer have signal posts, how do you decide where to put SPTs?

Are you talking about ERTMS? Surely they will still have marker boards (similar to HS1?) as some have SPTs on them IIRC


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ComUtoR]

Well if it's not on a signal post then it's not an SPT! It's a line side phone which you have seen which is different, it's a normal internal railway phone, not a direct line to the controlling signaller.

Ok.

Following on from that. How many different types of telephone are there ?

 

[A-driver]

Ok.

Following on from that. How many different types of telephone are there ?

Off the top of my head and I've probably missed some but...

SPT
Lineside
Level crossing
ECO (very rare)
Can't remember the technical term but normal phone aswell.

They should be listed in the PTS rule book module.

 

[Nym]

When you no longer have signal posts, how do you decide where to put SPTs?

Station starters, control points and any other applicable point.

 

[Skoodle]

Well if it's not on a signal post then it's not an SPT! It's a line side phone which you have seen which is different, it's a normal internal railway phone, not a direct line to the controlling signaller.

It's the symbol on the front of the particular phone that defines whether it is an SPT or a line side phone, not its location.

 

[carriageline]

I have a few signals that are SPTs, one is about 15 foot away from the signal


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[A-driver]

It's the symbol on the front of the particular phone that defines whether it is an SPT or a line side phone, not its location.

I have a few signals that are SPTs, one is about 15 foot away from the signal


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well an SPT gives a direct line to the controlling signaller. It will he associated with a signal but not always attached to the post. Many new signals going in have the SPT by a walkway about 100m away from the signal. I believe this is so that a driver can reach the phone without walking up the ballast.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Probably SPAD preventative measures too. Someone somewhere must have gone past a red 'un because they were drawing right up to the SPT.

 

[Tomnick]

I did hear that they were planning to phase out SPTs with the spread of GSM-R, by not including them in new resignalling schemes and removing them elsewhere when they were up for renewal. Not sure whether that's still the plan - but personally I think there'll always be a need for SPTs for as long as there are fixed signals.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Probably SPAD preventative measures too. Someone somewhere must have gone past a red 'un because they were drawing right up to the SPT.

That's the reason I'd heard for it - removing the temptation for the driver to draw right up to the signal in the pouring rain! 100m in rear sounds a bit much though. It does make a lot of sense, but equally it can sometimes mean that the driver's voice is drowned out by the noise of the adjacent loco!

 

[t_star2001uk]

SPT
Lineside
Level crossing
ECO (very rare)
Can't remember the technical term but normal phone aswell.

They should be listed in the PTS rule book module.

Also

Standard telephone
Emergency Telephone