duffers2324
Member
Merry Christmas everyone hope you are all well and have had a lovely day
£1 million of the increase was writing down the value of property and most of the rest due to having more drivers and having to pay more for drivers.
What property are we talking about?
Service changes in August 2018, overall neutral, So we must be on about Jan 2019 changes, Surly the three extra buses needed on 22, 26 and 27, did not cost million and half pound? No 38 went back to every 15mins at this point in time however that is Midland bluebird. It wasn't until after accounts finished that big extra buses were added like the 600 to Whitburn, x23 being every 30mins 21 every 30mins from Armdale to Whitburn. another six buses. Plus the tours.
I think Million has to have gone on competition money lost to LCB how could three extra daytime buses and six drivers cost that much?
Blast I mist that point about revenue being down. LCB must be just as bad, there brought new coaches etc
they bought vehicles but first didn’t in that time period some can’t compare too much in that sense
Albeit First did transfer quite a number of vehicles about so that at least on paper will make a difference.
In assets yes but not profit
Interesting that most of the lost revenue was from concessions..
Which means what some of us have been is on the money, First has managed to keep most of its fare paying passengers.
Ive seen a real mix bag, some busy lcb, some busy first, some empty LCB, some Empty First. Kirkliston has been lost to LCB but first has managed to hold Winchburgh.
Well, I live in Winchburgh, and I haven't used a single 38 since the X38 started running.
?????
That was in response to the point that First have "held" Winchburgh. I was just pointing out that I've happily abandoned them completely. The benefit of tickets valid on the bigger Lothian network has led me to use the X38 instead. I doubt I'm alone.
Not certain the observations of either party can be taken to prove anything when viewed seen through the prism of personal bias....
Well, that's the point I'm making. Lots of people reckon First are winning this war, lots reckon Lothian is. I was just contributing an observation that disproves a point someone else was making. I'm not saying that proves anything big or conclusive, just that it's all ongoing, and it's very hard to tell what will ultimately happen.
Full disclosure: I'm a former First employee forced out by bullying, so I'm not neutral in this.
Personally I dont think either one is winning and both are clearly losing bucket loads of money. LCB only hope is the Main Edinburgh network is bailing it out, with First hopeful its cutting is loses or breaking even with tour revenue.
Why I made the point on BOTH parties.
However if you look at the First figures, whilst clearly a substantial loss, it raises some very interesting questions on LCB’s performance.
First are planning another tour to take more money of Lothian. Here is the thing, is the loses at First smaller or Bigger than the losses on LCB network PLUS the losses from the tours?
Personally I dont think either one is winning and both are clearly losing bucket loads of money. LCB only hope is the Main Edinburgh network is bailing it out, with First hopeful its cutting is loses or breaking even with tour revenue.
The thing is, the tour market in Edinburgh is massive and expanding all the time, so I don't really think the level of competition will make Lothian lose any sleep. There's probably plenty of room for both of them right now. First are probably making easy money off it, but I doubt Lothian are losing any sleep over it. I suspect it's barely made a dent in their tour revenue.
How many vehicles do LCB run?
Possibly, but Lothian is a very different animal, operating in a generally much stronger position, with a profitable monopoly within Edinburgh that no-one is realistically going to be able to destroy. If they continue to make an overall profit, they can afford to take a hit on West Lothian for some time, possibly until First throw in the towel.
First now have a tiny network in Edinburgh - you can't really even call it that - and they're going to be very unattractive to anyone who wants to travel from West Lothian to a destination beyond the city centre. I think First are in a very weak position, and Lothian are just playing the long game. They seem able to do so.
If First can make 2 million a year from the tours then First will just happily sit this out.
First still has more buses on the routes compared to LCB, and there is still a few gaps on the LCB network, so to make another dent it would have to put in more resources.
Lothian can do that but if they’re burning through £3m a year and First decide to sit it out, it begs some interesting questions. It may be that First simply can’t be seen to walk away.