Covid restrictions to end on 19th July

[Nicholas Lewis]

I think there will be a few edge cases of smaller independent premises trying to mandate masks. But I don't think it'll last very long 'I'll shop elsewhere then' will be my stock response.
It's going to be really interesting to see how many remain masked on 19th. I think it'll be no more than 50%.

Well given @westv above reckons vaccine worth 50% off transmission rates then with 50% carrying on with masks we will be at 100% prevention of transmission. If only it were that simple but as long as there is no recriminations against those who choose to continue to wear masks then what does it matter.

 

[NorthKent1989]

So have the government given any indication (as in a date) as to when this passport will be introduced?

Newspaper reports cite Autumn, but each time it’s been raised the government has been forced to back down, far be it that such extreme measures would save hospitality, it would actually kill the whole industry off, we have never wanted any such “papers please” society, people will drink at home and set up a bar type environment in their own homes.

 

[Class 33]

I think there will be a few edge cases of smaller independent premises trying to mandate masks. But I don't think it'll last very long 'I'll shop elsewhere then' will be my stock response.
It's going to be really interesting to see how many remain masked on 19th. I think it'll be no more than 50%.

Yes, it's going to be very interesting next week to see how many people are still wearing masks in shops, and on buses, trains, etc. I think at max it will be no more than 30%(though may be a bit more on London Underground), and then further receeding as the days and weeks go on.

Yes I think some of the smaller independent shops may well still try to insist on masks to be worn. I remember watching a YouTube video someone here posted a link to about a few months ago, of some guy without a face mask(because they were exempt) going into a small NISA shop and the two shop assistants were absolutely terrified that he wasn't wearing a face mask, as though he was like a ticking time bomb, and ordering him to leave the shop immediately! I can't find this video now, I think it may have been deleted by the user. But yes you may get some paranoid shop owners terrified of non-mask wearers, so will still insist on face masks to be worn. I expect they'll start to see a decrease in revenue from 19th July!

 

[henairs]

You know the government has passed legislation to ban internal combustion engines in cars by 2035? Car companies are no longer developing designs for internal combustion engines and every company is moving into electric car production as rapidly as they can.

Rightly so and good to know but 2035 is a long way off and a lot of people will have died from pollution in that time. Can't see this government moving to fast if it can help though.

 

[Smidster]

Newspaper reports cite Autumn, but each time it’s been raised the government has been forced to back down, far be it that such extreme measures would save hospitality, it would actually kill the whole industry off, we have never wanted any such “papers please” society, people will drink at home and set up a bar type environment in their own homes.

Vaccine Passports are to be encouraged immediately in Step 4.

There is also a threat in the guidance that if orgs do not introduce them voluntarily then it will become law.

The question is what will classify as a "high risk gathering"

 

[Jimini]

I think at max it will be no more than 30%(though may be a bit more on London Underground), and then further receeding as the days and weeks go on.

On the central line it's barely even that at the moment, in my experience.

 

[Bikeman78]

That's as maybe, but try telling it to the likes of Northern Rail and TPE. I've heard announcements warning me that I "must" wear a face covering on the train and in the station in such bustling transport hubs as Glazebrook and Kirkby Stephen (Duly ignored of course, but it grates to have it barked at one).

I think all TOCs have announcements stating that they are required on stations. Almost universally ignored at unstaffed stations. I think it might actually be a legal requirement in Wales but it's still largely ignored.

 

[bramling]

I think all TOCs have announcements stating that they are required on stations. Almost universally ignored at unstaffed stations. I think it might actually be a legal requirement in Wales but it's still largely ignored.

TFW claim it’s required even in station car parks. No idea if it’s a legal requirement or not, but when we were in Wales last month we saw few being worn on platforms.

On T&W Metro at present mask use is very hit and miss on the trains, and almost non existent on stations.

 

[sjpowermac]

Also, somewhat lost in the noise about all this stuff, is the fact that tomorrow the House of Commons will be voting on whether to make vaccination compulsory for all those working in care homes - whether directly or incidentally (eg. it also covers someone coming in to change the lightbulbs, or to cut hair, or to perform entertainment for the residents). Inevitably they will pass it (though it will be interesting to see who opposes).

Another thin edge of a very troubling wedge. I seriously doubt that will end with care home staff.

Agree with all you’ve put there.

They’ve gone after the care workers first, rather than NHS staff, because the government feel they can bully them into submission. Never a good way of doing anything.

All those bleating about ‘an extra layer of protection’ for care home residents would do well to remember who it was that worked throughout the pandemic, often with little protection, to do their best for Granny.

In addition, I can’t see this helping with recruitment for care home staff, with all the attendant dangers that under-staffing brings.

Quite so about the thin end of a wedge, particularly with the Covid passports

 

[Bikeman78]

You can get a piece of paper from NHS Wales which is "official" confirmation of vaccination.
NHS Wales says it is "working on" integrating its system with England's NHS app.

Thanks. I will look into that in the vain hope that I might be able to go away in September. Not holding my breath though.

 

[NorthKent1989]

Vaccine Passports are to be encouraged immediately in Step 4.

There is also a threat in the guidance that if orgs do not introduce them voluntarily then it will become law.

The question is what will classify as a "high risk gathering"

I don’t know about the last but it does sound vague but goodbye hospitality industry, I shan’t abide by this check point society, I hope the little locktavists are happy I have zero respect for them, they’ve backed this authoritarianism to the hilt, they better not moan when their civil liberties are under threat.

 

[Bikeman78]

Not sure why you would continue to avoid deep tubes. Transport with its cleaning measures are not and have never been hotbed for covid.

Primary and high school with unvaccinated children on the other hand…. I would avoid if possible by a mile if vulunerable and not able to have a jab.
I would however agree with you and think twice visiting a busy pub on a Saturday evening filled with young lager louts…!

I've had the Covid app since the day after it was launched. It's never gone off, despite extensive travelling on trains. I think the risk associated with using public transport has been somewhat overstated.

 

[westv]

You know the government has passed legislation to ban internal combustion engines in cars by 2035?

That's a ban on new car sales.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

I think all TOCs have announcements stating that they are required on stations. Almost universally ignored at unstaffed stations. I think it might actually be a legal requirement in Wales but it's still largely ignored.

The The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Wearing of Face Coverings on Public Transport) (England) Regulations 2020 only refer to when you are on board a public transport vehicle - thats not a station so not sure how they could have enforced it anyhow.

All irrelevant now but i will have a mask with me at all times for the time being and will deploy when i feel im in setting that could present a risk.

 

[Dent]

Cars simple as that. The Government has no intention of doing anything to stop pollution by cars as there's to much money to be made from motorists. Rail will never contend with road users and neither will buses or any other form of traction.
And not only that but virtually all train drivers and bus drivers have to get to work. How. By car of course.
So forget Covid because air pollution is a much bigger killer in the long run

That is not a source for the claim "the majority of the population do not use Public transport whatsoever in the average week", and it is off-topic.

 

[westv]

I think all TOCs have announcements stating that they are required on stations. Almost universally ignored at unstaffed stations. I think it might actually be a legal requirement in Wales but it's still largely ignored.

I think LNER had a twitter post last year mentioning masks and showing a clip of somebody wearing one on a totally deserted station platform.

 

[quantinghome]

Rightly so and good to know but 2035 is a long way off and a lot of people will have died from pollution in that time. Can't see this government moving to fast if it can help though.

We're going massively O/T, but how long do you think would be realistic for the car industry to shift from ICEs to batteries and electric motors? It should have started a lot earlier than it did, of course. But from where we are now, is it realistic to move faster? I honestly don't know the answer.

That's a ban on new car sales.

Indeed. Should have clarified.

 

[yorkie]

The comparison with air pollution is quite valid and interesting, and I don't wish to stifle debate, but this is heading way off topic, so can I ask that if anyone wishes to discuss this further, they create a new thread please? It would make a lot more sense for that matter to be debated in a thread separate to this one.

Feel free to link to any such thread from this one.

 

[trebor79]

I think all TOCs have announcements stating that they are required on stations. Almost universally ignored at unstaffed stations. I think it might actually be a legal requirement in Wales but it's still largely ignored.

I've never seen masks actively enforced on stations, even large staffed ones. I never wore one on any platform, even before I realised I was exempt and stopped wearing them in trains. It's absolutely facile to suggest they are in any way necessary on an open air platform, or even a large "enclosed" station such as Leeds.

 

[island]

Well given @westv above reckons vaccine worth 50% off transmission rates then with 50% carrying on with masks we will be at 100% prevention of transmission.

That… isn’t how maths works. Reducing by 50% twice gives you 25% of the original amount, not 0%.

I've never seen masks actively enforced on stations, even large staffed ones.

Some Cornish stations are enforcing them enthusiastically, as are some staff in East Croydon.

It's absolutely facile to suggest they are in any way necessary on an open air platform, or even a large "enclosed" station such as Leeds.

Indeed.

 

[johntea]

Here we go...sigh!

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks​

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks

Masks will not be legally required on public transport when Covid restrictions are eased in England.

www.bbc.co.uk

The government has said bus and train companies must decide whether passengers will be required to wear face coverings on their services from Monday, when Covid rules are relaxed.
Face masks have been mandatory on public transport for the past year to reduce the spread of the virus.
But those rules will be replaced with government guidance advising passengers to wear masks only on busy services.
Transport firms will be left to decide whether to enforce that advice and how.
Health Secretary Sajid Javid said masks would still be "recommended" on public transport, but people without a face covering would no longer be fined after restrictions are eased on 19 July.
Nevertheless, bus and train companies will still be able to turn away passengers who refuse to wear one - unless they are exempt.
Transport Secretary Grant Shapps said it was "up to them" to decide whether to make face coverings compulsory for passengers.

This is going to cause absolute chaos...also how on earth can a train company turn away a passenger? (a bus is slightly less complex) 'You aren't wearing a mask get off at the next station!' 'No' 'OK then I'm ringing BTP' 'But I'm not doing anything wrong based on the new Government guidance...'

 

[island]

If someone’s not breaking the law I can’t see BTP hurrying to assist. (Not that they often hurry anyway…)

 

[takno]

Some Cornish stations are enforcing them enthusiastically, as are some staff in East Croydon.

Mask-wearing was well below 50% when I went through East Croydon yesterday, so they were obviously off work

 

[wireforever]

I am waiting for a govt minister to visit a nightclub when it reopens and try and look trendy

 

[HS2isgood]

Here we go...sigh!

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks​

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks

Masks will not be legally required on public transport when Covid restrictions are eased in England.

www.bbc.co.uk

This is going to cause absolute chaos...also how on earth can a train company turn away a passenger? (a bus is slightly less complex) 'You aren't wearing a mask get off at the next station!' 'No' 'OK then I'm ringing BTP' 'But I'm not doing anything wrong based on the new Government guidance...'

Will any TOC decide to mandate masks (looking at you, TfL and LNER!)? Even though if LNER did it, it would possibly just kick a relevant portion of its passengers to the Midland Mainline.

 

[Class 33]

Here we go...sigh!

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks​

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks

Masks will not be legally required on public transport when Covid restrictions are eased in England.

www.bbc.co.uk

This is going to cause absolute chaos...also how on earth can a train company turn away a passenger? (a bus is slightly less complex) 'You aren't wearing a mask get off at the next station!' 'No' 'OK then I'm ringing BTP' 'But I'm not doing anything wrong based on the new Government guidance...'

I don't like the sound of this atall. Even though it will no longer be legal to have to wear face masks on public transport, the government is going to leave it to all the transport operators to decide on whether passengers are required to wear face masks on their services! So if we're not doing so, they can refuse us entry to a bus/coach/train? And in the case of trains, if a conductor finds people not wearing face masks they can demand we get off at the next station??!!

Will have to see what happens over the coming days. I do hope a load of train, bus, coach operators aren't going to insist on this face mask wearing nonsense to remain on their services.

 

[Watershed]

If someone’s not breaking the law I can’t see BTP hurrying to assist. (Not that they often hurry anyway…)

I'm sure the numerous laws on railway trespass could be wheeled out if required.

This really is a watershed moment - if the RDG and DfT don't make masks entirely optional on National Rail, I can still see a mask mandate being in place in 1 or 2 years' time.

 

[Dent]

Here we go...sigh!

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks​

Covid: Bus and train firms must decide whether to require masks

Masks will not be legally required on public transport when Covid restrictions are eased in England.

www.bbc.co.uk

Whoever said that doesn't know what they're talking about. Train travel is subject to the National Rail Conditions of Travel, train companies are not free to unilaterally impose their own arbitrary conditions.

 

[Ralph Ayres]

The National Rail website has for some time only said that passengers must "Wear a face covering in enclosed areas of stations and throughout your journey" which seems quite sensible, so I'm surprised by recent mentions of people being told to wear a mask on a platform unless the individual concerned was getting uncomfortably close to other people. TfL of course is different and has mandated it on stations and trains in the Conditions of Carriage.

 

[102 fan]

I don't like the sound of this atall. Even though it will no longer be legal to have to wear face masks on public transport, the government is going to leave it to all the transport operators to decide on whether passengers are required to wear face masks on their services! So if we're not doing so, they can refuse us entry to a bus/coach/train? And in the case of trains, if a conductor finds people not wearing face masks they can demand we get off at the next station??!!

Will have to see what happens over the coming days. I do hope a load of train, bus, coach operators aren't going to insist on this face mask wearing nonsense to remain on their services.

Then like shops, just boycott the ones that do. They'll soon stop when there's empty trains/buses.