Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[GusB]

On a completely different note; does anyone happen to have a complete list of all the Atlanteans which were rebuilt to either coach spec or open top, and any names they carried.

I don't think anyone else picked up on this question. Unfortunately one of my fleet books has gone missing, but I can provde a partial list.

The source is Capital Transport's Scottish Bus Handbook from 1989 and it lists buses 40-43 (BFS40-43L) as being open-top (O45/33F) and name as Edinburgh Star, Lothian Star, Highland Star and Lowland Star.

While not specific to your question about Altaneans, Leyland Tiger/Duple Laser 2 64 is shown as being named Councillor Ian A Cramond.

If I recall correctly, the 1991 book lists a few more named vehicles. It's a bit late in the day to go hunting for it, but I'll try to have a look tomorrow.

 

[DunsBus]

I don't think anyone else picked up on this question. Unfortunately one of my fleet books has gone missing, but I can provde a partial list.

The source is Capital Transport's Scottish Bus Handbook from 1989 and it lists buses 40-43 (BFS40-43L) as being open-top (O45/33F) and name as Edinburgh Star, Lothian Star, Highland Star and Lowland Star.

While not specific to your question about Altaneans, Leyland Tiger/Duple Laser 2 64 is shown as being named Councillor Ian A Cramond.

If I recall correctly, the 1991 book lists a few more named vehicles. It's a bit late in the day to go hunting for it, but I'll try to have a look tomorrow.

The E-reg Atlanteans converted to coaches in 1977-78 didn't carry names, however, their X-reg replacements 660-665 did and were, in order, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, J M Barrie, Robert Louis Stevenson, Sir Walter Scott, Robert Burns and Sir Compton Mackenzie. Although officially demoted to buses in 1989 they kept the coach livery and the names until  repainted into madder and white in the autumn of 1990.

 

[NorthEastern]

These replies from DunsBus and GusB are great examples of all that’s good about Railforums and this group in particular.

 

[DunsBus]

These replies from DunsBus and GusB are great examples of all that’s good about Railforums and this group in particular.

Why, thank you. Always happy to help when I can.

I can also provide some background to the name carried by Leyland Tiger/Duple Laser 2, 64. The councillor it was named after was Lothian Region's transport convenor from 1982 until his untimely death at the age of 48 in August 1985.

64 was one of two C-reg Leyland Tiger/Duple Laser 2 coaches which were new around that time and was thus named in Ian's memory.

 

[VioletEclipse]

I don't think anyone else picked up on this question. Unfortunately one of my fleet books has gone missing, but I can provde a partial list.

The source is Capital Transport's Scottish Bus Handbook from 1989 and it lists buses 40-43 (BFS40-43L) as being open-top (O45/33F) and name as Edinburgh Star, Lothian Star, Highland Star and Lowland Star.

While not specific to your question about Altaneans, Leyland Tiger/Duple Laser 2 64 is shown as being named Councillor Ian A Cramond.

If I recall correctly, the 1991 book lists a few more named vehicles. It's a bit late in the day to go hunting for it, but I'll try to have a look tomorrow.

The E-reg Atlanteans converted to coaches in 1977-78 didn't carry names, however, their X-reg replacements 660-665 did and were, in order, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, J M Barrie, Robert Louis Stevenson, Sir Walter Scott, Robert Burns and Sir Compton Mackenzie. Although officially demoted to buses in 1989 they kept the coach livery and the names until  repainted into madder and white in the autumn of 1990.

Why, thank you. Always happy to help when I can.

I can also provide some background to the name carried by Leyland Tiger/Duple Laser 2, 64. The councillor it was named after was Lothian Region's transport convenor from 1982 until his untimely death at the age of 48 in August 1985.

64 was one of two C-reg Leyland Tiger/Duple Laser 2 coaches which were new around that time and was thus named in Ian's memory.

Thanks both! There are very few occasions I can think of where vehicles have been named in memory of staff at the company. Otherwise I think just Tridant 650, Ian Peffers.

 

[stevenedin]

Nobody has mentioned it but according to bus times, 453 also moved to Seafield yesterday so assuming that it is being repainted and transferred to Lothian Country.

451 and 453 should probably replace 843 and 844 I would imagine.

Is there any word if Lothian are selling 841, 849 & 944? They have been out of service since April or are they keeping a hold of them in case they need them? Also 938 is withdrawn too.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Nobody has mentioned it but according to bus times, 453 also moved to Seafield yesterday so assuming that it is being repainted and transferred to Lothian Country.

451 and 453 should probably replace 843 and 844 I would imagine.

I would expect this to be the plan. 451 likely moved to Livingston tomorrow night.

 

[Graeme Duncan]

According to the Lothian Buses tracker 721 is out on service 8.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

According to the Lothian Buses tracker 721 is out on service 8.

It’s not out. Entered service on Monday.

 

[VioletEclipse]

424 seems to have gained a new orange LED next stop display upstairs just under the 'Stopping' light

 

[Lothiangem22]

Next batch of 48 BZL’s are due to begin delivery in July

 

[atfd26]

Are 1141-1153 starting getting repainted note that 1146 is away currently

 

[Baileygirl]

Next batch of 48 BZL’s are due to begin delivery in July

Will the first batch be complete by then?

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Will the first batch be complete by then?

Highly unlikely. 14 outstanding, none of which are at Seafield at the moment.

July may be the planned delivery for the second batch of 48, but I’d be amazed if it actually happens.

 

[Bus9120UK]

Are 1141-1153 starting getting repainted note that 1146 is away currently

Damage is the likely reason it's at Seafield. Vehicles being repainted at the moment are Longstone eVoRas, Central 7900s & 11 plate B9TLs, and 66/17 plate cascades to Lothian Country and East Coast Buses.

 

[Resuwen]

Highly unlikely. 14 outstanding, none of which are at Seafield at the moment.

July may be the planned delivery for the second batch of 48, but I’d be amazed if it actually happens.

Do we know why the Lothian deliveries have been so slow or erratic?

Warrington and Manchester don’t (to my knowledge) have similar problems.

 

[stevenedin]

451 has now moved to Lothian Country

 

[percycranky]

Does Lothian have a reputation for closing bus stops down with seemingly no prior warning until you get to the stop itself? I had noticed the south-east bound stop after Bernard Terrace (where services 7, 31, 37 and 47/47B stop) is now closed, but could not find any information on such a closure from a search online.

 

[stevenedin]

Does Lothian have a reputation for closing bus stops down with seemingly no prior warning until you get to the stop itself? I had noticed the south-east bound stop after Bernard Terrace (where services 7, 31, 37 and 47/47B stop) is now closed, but could not find any information on such a closure from a search online.

Lothian don't close bus stops, the Council do or utility companies I think.

 

[NorthEastern]

Does Lothian have a reputation for closing bus stops down with seemingly no prior warning until you get to the stop itself? I had noticed the south-east bound stop after Bernard Terrace (where services 7, 31, 37 and 47/47B stop) is now closed, but could not find any information on such a closure from a search online.

Fortunately this is Edinburgh so the next stop is only 50m away

 

[ejstubbs]

While Edinburgh does undeniably have some inexplicably adjacent bus stop (local to me there's Oxgangs Library and Cockit Hat just 100m apart, and New Swanston just a bit over 200m beyond that) in this particular case the next stop in the southbound direction is ~460m away (as measured on Google Maps). The previous stop is ~270m away, so that's 730m between stops; a bit under half a mile.

 

[NorthEastern]

While Edinburgh does undeniably have some inexplicably adjacent bus stop (local to me there's Oxgangs Library and Cockit Hat just 100m apart, and New Swanston just a bit over 200m beyond that) in this particular case the next stop in the southbound direction is ~460m away (as measured on Google Maps). The previous stop is ~270m away, so that's 730m between stops; a bit under half a mile.

Yes I’m sure you’re correct, my remark was tongue in cheek

 

[Busman757]

Lothian Country’s Service 43 has won the award for Best Bus Service Award at the Scottish Transport Awards.

 

[318266]

Lothian Country’s Service 43 has won the award for Best Bus Service Award at the Scottish Transport Awards.

Congratulations - but I have to ask how on earth it won! I can think of a million better routes, even in Lothian itself. (A number of Eastcoastbuses spring to mind)

 

[Siemens Trains]

Congratulations - but I have to ask how on earth it won! I can think of a million better routes, even in Lothian itself. (A number of Eastcoastbuses spring to mind)

When you read the criteria and the 43's supporting case this award seems well-justified. Admittedly some successes are exaggerated, for example the increase in passenger numbers is partly due to cuts on the 41, followed by re-routing it away from Queensferry Rd and Princes St in its change to the 47/B. Simplifying fares wasn't the major bonus for passengers' pockets suggested by their 33% figure, but at least they've acknowledged that it made a significant operational difference.
I'd dispute the 'faster peak-time options' point too. These were included on introduction in 2017 then withdrawn in 2020 if I remember rightly, never to return. They weren't particularly helpful or faster - just included in the normal frequency while observing fewer stops.
It's far from ideal for every individual's journey. But all things considered, the 43 is a big improvement over the situation on this route for 20 years prior to 2017.

 

[overthewater]

Congratulations - but I have to ask how on earth it won! I can think of a million better routes, even in Lothian itself. (A number of Eastcoastbuses spring to mind)

Thank goodness someone else thinks this, ANY OTHER Lothian city route or even East Lothian route would have been better like the X7.

The 43 route isn't good and Stagecoach route 40/A was far better. If you watch the passengers at the old Bridge tolls nearly every stagecoach coach ends up stopping both ways. You have to feel sorry for people in Scotstoun Ave, it quicker going to further afield.

43 runs every 20mins along the same route that First bus operate, the only difference is now it Lothian and some newer buses, that it.

 

[318266]

When you read the criteria and the 43's supporting case this award seems well-justified. Admittedly some successes are exaggerated, for example the increase in passenger numbers is partly due to cuts on the 41, followed by re-routing it away from Queensferry Rd and Princes St in its change to the 47/B. Simplifying fares wasn't the major bonus for passengers' pockets suggested by their 33% figure, but at least they've acknowledged that it made a significant operational difference.
I'd dispute the 'faster peak-time options' point too. These were included on introduction in 2017 then withdrawn in 2020 if I remember rightly, never to return. They weren't particularly helpful or faster - just included in the normal frequency while observing fewer stops.
It's far from ideal for every individual's journey. But all things considered, the 43 is a big improvement over the situation on this route for 20 years prior to 2017.

Perhaps it could be referring to the X47? The only difference in actual route is the particulars of either termini...

 

[Grumpyscot]

Back to the 26 route parking at Seton Sands - Friday - 3 buses parked in a line at the camp bus stand, 1 200 metres up the road on its way to the city and another waiting on the coast road at the turn off to turn into the camp - just no space left!. 5 buses all within a minute of each other? Getting ridiculous to the stage its impacting on camp dwellers getting in and out of the camp.

 

[buslad1988]

Back to the 26 route parking at Seton Sands - Friday - 3 buses parked in a line at the camp bus stand, 1 200 metres up the road on its way to the city and another waiting on the coast road at the turn off to turn into the camp - just no space left!. 5 buses all within a minute of each other? Getting ridiculous to the stage its impacting on camp dwellers getting in and out of the camp.

Have you forgotten it was the Highland Show and a seriously hot day on Friday… not to mention it was simply a Friday! Plus a host of temporary roadworks throughout the route.

I think you’re just trying to find excuses to complain about the loss of route to Tranent.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Have you forgotten it was the Highland Show and a seriously hot day on Friday… not to mention it was simply a Friday! Plus a host of temporary roadworks throughout the route.

I think you’re just trying to find excuses to complain about the loss of route to Tranent.

I would agree. I think that example given seemed a rare extreme one.