Which, of course, are not Class 93s.
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Recent DRS new loco tender result for new Class 93 locos
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GrimShady
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No but they're a Stadler product, been mentioned in previous posts and also given there's been a discussion about wheel configuration on this very post....it's relevant.
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Photohunter71
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It's all gone very quiet on this one! I take it nothing doing and possibly not happening now?
Why would you think that? These are not overnight decisions.
Photohunter71
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Well, it has gone quiet on that front, they were due to announce it in March, and companies are usually quite enthusiastic to announce and promote new stock,or that they've got more contracts etc.
Photohunter71
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Has this just died altogether?
ExRes
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Don't forget DRS is a publicly owned company, there are probably more hoops to jump through than a hula hoop factory, I expect it's trying to find someone in the Civil Service brave enough or stupid enough to make a decision
Photohunter71
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No worries! I just thought there would have been something heard by now!
LOL The Irony
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Well it's even gone quiet on the ROG front despite them being scheduled for delivery in 11 months time.
hexagon789
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It's gone so quiet, I'd completely forgotten about the whole thing!
I take it this is still happening?
LOL The Irony
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Who knows? The last news on this project was 4 months ago.
hexagon789
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That's more recent than I remember, but still quite a while for no news to have passed.
LOL The Irony
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All the last news is outlined in this post.
hexagon789
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Thanks.
I note there is still an idea of using them for TPE, which assuming they can keep time on diesel/battery on the non-electrified sections seems quite sensible.
Though as they would need more than the ordered 10 locos I suspect this may not happen, they would need to order them pretty soon and even then it's not going to happen even next year with the need for construction, testing and then driver training for TPE drivers.
At least the sentiment is there I guess.
ExRes
Established Member
ROG CEO Karl Watts is giving a talk at the Institution of Railway Operators on 30th September, the Class 93 order is due to be part of his talk
hexagon789
Veteran Member
That's good, should get some long-awaited updates on the 93s then.
I was thinking GWR for the night riviera as lots of the GWR route is electrified so it makes sense to use these locomotives. I'm guessing they will just sublease some from ROG or DRS. Probably ROG as they look to be delivered first and then GWR can return the 57s to porterbrook.
I'm not sure ~30% is lots???
Not sure they would have enough power for the night riviera of the wires.
43096
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I’m thinking you don’t understand how little of the route is electrified, the gradients, the multitude of different routes the train can take or the capability of the locos.
Photohunter71
Member
I thought DRS weren't getting 93's just the ROG? Wasn't the DRS tender for 10 diesel only mixed traffic locomotives?
hexagon789
Veteran Member
The Night Riviera would be a good service to use them on, the roughly Class 37 diesel+battery output should be enough for the hills of Devon and the electric power would enable better timekeeping on electrified metals with the higher power.
Lots of ETH though...
43096
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As above, I don’t think you understand the route or the traction capabilities.
hexagon789
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Still be about class 37 performance, does the extra power of a 57 make a lot of difference with a normal maximum of 80mph?
hexagon789
Veteran Member
I know there are several steep banks (up to 1 in 37?), and that the 57s are 2,500hp from the engine, less whatever the transmission losses and ETH are, the new 93s are approx 1,800hp traction on diesel+battery, less whatever the ETH requirements are.
For 80mph max, with better running on electric would it make that much difference? Couldn't you re-time the electric section to the maximum 100 to make up for any losses on the non-electrified sections?
The battery isn't that big and so not much use over a long journey.
The extra power is useful when making up time is needed.
Trimode locos won't be cheap but the 57s are. Could easily be a 4-5 fold cost difference.
43096
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Class 57/6 is 2,750hp at the crankshaft AIUI.
The electric section, depending on route, may only be Paddington to Newbury. Only another 250+ miles to go!
Train supply is maximum of around 350hp. How long do the batteries last on a charge? Probably about 10mins at full power. Going to be a struggle over Rattery and Dainton.
ac6000cw
Established Member
I agree - based on info to date (e.g. see these posts - https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...new-class-93-locos.161943/page-6#post-3865797 and https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...new-class-93-locos.161943/page-6#post-3870821 ) they are likely to have a diesel engine in the 1200 - 1500 hp range, so if battery power isn't available then with a full ETS load the diesel performance is likely to be below class 37 levels.
They'll be great 'last 50 miles' locos off the wires, and for ROG's rolling stock haulage business as a class 37/47 replacements.
As for hauling the Penzance sleepers - given the poor economics of sleeper trains I think someone would seriously struggle to make a business case for using anything other than relatively 'cheap and cheerful' traction on it.
43096
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Agree with that analysis. The next logical step for the Night Riviera is a mid-life diesel loco, such as Class 67.
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