The 717s have lots of features specific to the Moorgate line which would add unnecessary complication and cost if specified for the Coastway, such as the emergency end doors. There's no requirement for this on the Coastway: the only reason 313s are used is because they're what was available at the time. A standard Desiro City bodyshell would suffice, but the replacement for the 313s will probably end up being 377s cascaded from elsewhere on the Southern... or maybe the 707s.Is this not subjective? Some people like the 313s, but they are old.
Ideally an add-on order (if possible) of 717s that replaced the 313s on Great Northern.
No toilets
Only 3 coaches
Mouldy filthy windows
Dusty seats as hard as rocks
No toilets
Replaced comfy 377s
Still no replacement planned
1 hour plus journeys
Does anyone else loathe these trains as much as I do
They arrived only after the stock’s withdrawal from Silverlink Metro services, which dates back to around 2010.I quite like them !
Didn't know that they replaced 377s, when was that ?. I thought they'd been working the Coastway services to Worthing etc for ages.
No toilets
Only 3 coaches
Mouldy filthy windows
Dusty seats as hard as rocks
No toilets
Replaced comfy 377s
Still no replacement planned
1 hour plus journeys
Does anyone else loathe these trains as much as I do
And many short platforms so what ever replaces them needs SDO especially for the doubling up units (or equivalent)Haha! About time you made a thread about them. 313's are usually bashed by you in other, unrelated, threads.
3 Coaches - that's how they were built.
Agreed the window's aren't great but thats 70's Double Glazing for you. Mostly the stock needs a wash, like 377s, as they all get filthy in Autumn and Winter.
Dusty/Hard Seats are the same as the 3+2 seats on 377s - the other difference is the 377s have been refreshed inside so have new fabric.
The 377s had to go to London for Capacity Boost. Ala, the 10Car Metro. Currently they are still needed for said services (and the odd Tonbridge).
The Government pull the strings on the GTR franchise, so any stock replacement is down to them. At one point they were to be replaced by 377/5s but SE desperately needed them for capacity. Come the next franchise I'm sure they will go but its down to the DaFT to order them, as far as this current franchise goes.
They're not the only stock to do 1hr+ Journeys without toilets. I do agree they're not suited for Brighton- Portsmouth runs.
At the end of the day they do the job for now. I quite like driving them too.
When they aren't gapped maybeI very much like them. Reliable too so i understand.
and when they aren't on fireWhen they aren't gapped maybe
465s are beyond salvation at this point, it's best to stick with the 313s until 707s are available to displace 377s to the Coastways.They're fairly dire for staff conditions and by modern standards are poor, espeically for what the South is used to. Some of the criteria though like "over 1 hour" isn't a criticism of stock though. I'd say replace them with 465s, but at the current rate GTR's franchise may end before Southeastern's!
No toilets
Only 3 coaches
Mouldy filthy windows
Dusty seats as hard as rocks
No toilets
Replaced comfy 377s
Still no replacement planned
1 hour plus journeys
Does anyone else loathe these trains as much as I do
Clearance needs to be taken into account!465s could be fantastic if given a decent refurbishment and would make a good replacement for 313s , every other train company with PEP stock are getting rid of it, it's knackered.
And SDO would be very useful if not a key requirement which rules them out?Clearance needs to be taken into account!
One thing to remember is it’s not actually up to GTR whether or not they’re replaced, it’s up to DfT. Should there be an extension to the GTR franchise then it is of course possible that DfT will specify this, and they could theoretically do so before then if stock became available.465s could be fantastic if given a decent refurbishment and would make a good replacement for 313s , every other train company with PEP stock are getting rid of it, it's knackered.
One thing to remember is it’s not actually up to GTR whether or not they’re replaced, it’s up to DfT. Should there be an extension to the GTR franchise then it is of course possible that DfT will specify this, and they could theoretically do so before then if stock became available.
no - relatively recently it seems to me (tho I've been about long enough to recall 2 / 4 HAP type stuff on coastway!) -it was when some of the 377 fleet had to be moved away to fill other gaps.I quite like them !
Didn't know that they replaced 377s, when was that ?. I thought they'd been working the Coastway services to Worthing etc for ages.
or maybe the 707s.
Since DfT now own about half the class 365 fleet is there a good reason why they couldn't replace the 313's?
But not economically given the work required.SDO could be fitted retrospectively