A decline in seat comfort: Who made the decision?

[GRALISTAIR]

The Treasury made the decision. Abolish it as Gareth Dennis would say.

 

[trebor79]

It is definitely the case that the feeling of "sitting on a metal bar" you get from Fainsa Sophia seats is less pronounced when the cover is moquette than when it is flat cloth. The few millimetres of carpet like fabric adds a noticeable bit more padding.

I originally thought it was because the cushions has been changed but now they've all aged a bit it's definitely not.

I think that "sitting on a metal bar" experience is getting worse on the GWR sets as the cushions (such as they are) break down. I was never really aware of it before, but on my most recent journeys to and from Bristol I actually got up and stood for the last half hour as I just couldn't bear it digging into the back of my thighs anymore. Such a relief to settle down into a comfy 745 Fisa Lean for the last leg of my journey home!

 

[Mikey C]

I had a couple of short GWR 80x journeys yesterday, and the seat cushion seemed in good condition, i.e. I couldn't feel the metal bar!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I had a couple of short GWR 80x journeys yesterday, and the seat cushion seemed in good condition, i.e. I couldn't feel the metal bar!

It depends on their age. I am on an 802 now and I can feel it but it isn't bad. They are otherwise fine as seats, if only they would fit cushions with a wooden or metal base it would fix the issue.

 

[Envy123]

LNER Azuma seats are perfectly comfortable for me. Far better than the Class 700 seats and I actually felt a bit more comfortable than the older train. Yes, a bit more padding would be nice but I like the structure of them.

 

[D6975]

I’ve just come back from a short break in the NW. I travelled on lots of different trains, 150,195, 331, 397, 802, mk5 and found them all reasonably comfortable, 195s/mk5s being the best. That is until the last day when I travelled in the middle coach of 158758 from Wigan to Salford Crescent, which was a whole level of comfort above all the others and emphasised just what can be done.

 

[Mat17]

In all the trains I've travelled on, nothing is as comfortable as a class 104.

 

[MattRat]

I’ve just come back from a short break in the NW. I travelled on lots of different trains, 150,195, 331, 397, 802, mk5 and found them all reasonably comfortable, 195s/mk5s being the best. That is until the last day when I travelled in the middle coach of 158758 from Wigan to Salford Crescent, which was a whole level of comfort above all the others and emphasised just what can be done.

175s are also a good example of good seats IMO.

 

[greyman42]

Unlike the awful Fainsa seats in the 80s trains which have few fans.

The seats in the electric double decker buses that run around York are more comfortable than the ones in a 8xx which is a ridiculous state of affairs.

 

[43301]

The seats in the electric double decker buses that run around York are more comfortable than the ones in a 8xx which is a ridiculous state of affairs.

Best 'service bus' seats in Yorkshire are the upstairs ones in the Transdev 36 bus (Leeds-Harrogate-Ripon).

 

[Irascible]

I've not encountered any comfortable seats on trains since the last of the MK1 compartment firsts were withdrawn from service. Travelling on any train now is a totally anodyne experience similar to using a low-cost airline. I still love trains, but for actual travelling, I much prefer my car!

They were ok - if you had an entire seat to yourself so you could lie across it :P other than any working fold down armrest, didn't do much to keep you in place - note I've never been in a Mk1 1st compartment, unless one was declassified & I didn't notice ( they were all on minor services by the time I started travelling anyway ). The earlier aircon Mk2s had the best of everything as long as the springs still worked ( muich like old car seats ). 159s are the best down this way currently.

If you spent an extra grand per seat and they last 20 years, it's still a miniscule amount on a ticket. Especially a ticket price in 20 years time...

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I’ve just come back from a short break in the NW. I travelled on lots of different trains, 150,195, 331, 397, 802, mk5 and found them all reasonably comfortable, 195s/mk5s being the best. That is until the last day when I travelled in the middle coach of 158758 from Wigan to Salford Crescent, which was a whole level of comfort above all the others and emphasised just what can be done.

Is 158 758 one of the ones that still has the original Trans-Penninse seats in it?

 

[bramling]

The seats in the electric double decker buses that run around York are more comfortable than the ones in a 8xx which is a ridiculous state of affairs.

I travelled on a bus in Swansea this week, first time I’ve been on a non-London bus for several years. Surprised how comfortable the seats were, certainly considerably better than certain modern trains.

 

[43301]

Is 158 758 one of the ones that still has the original Trans-Penninse seats in it?

If it's a 3-car one then it will still have the original seats (they aren't Transpennine as such - they are just the original seats as fitted to all 158s from new).

 

[Peter Mugridge]

If it's a 3-car one then it will still have the original seats (they aren't Transpennine as such - they are just the original seats as fitted to all 158s from new).

I'm sure the T-P ones had thicker, softer, seats than the rest of the 158s? Certainly in the maroon livery years?

 

[43301]

I'm sure the T-P ones had thicker, softer, seats than the rest of the 158s? Certainly in the maroon livery years?

Thicker cushions than the original ones were widespread - most or all of the Serco/Abellio Northern fleet had them (some of them were ex-Transpenning, but not all). They make the issue of insufficent legroom even worse!

 

[greyman42]

Thicker cushions than the original ones were widespread - most or all of the Serco/Abellio Northern fleet had them (some of them were ex-Transpenning, but not all). They make the issue of insufficent legroom even worse!

The original seats in a 158 had a spring.

Best 'service bus' seats in Yorkshire are the upstairs ones in the Transdev 36 bus (Leeds-Harrogate-Ripon).

Yes, Transdev are pretty good.

 

[317 forever]

I thought there was a 2-word answer to this question: Failing Grayling.

 

[yorksrob]

The Treasury made the decision. Abolish it as Gareth Dennis would say.

Indeed. The Treasury ought to have its functions separated out, rather than being allowed to behave like a government within the government.

It was done with the old Home Office.

 

[class26]

Unpopular opinion, but I'm actually happy that I can actually sit upright and look out the window or use the table in modern seats, compared to being slumped into some awkward semi-reclined posture that ruins my back and/or neck. I agree that a bit more padding wouldn't go astray though.

But for how long?
It might be ok on a 30 - 45 minute commute but 4 hours bolt up[right on an Azuma is a completely different thing.

LNER Azuma seats are perfectly comfortable for me. Far better than the Class 700 seats and I actually felt a bit more comfortable than the older train. Yes, a bit more padding would be nice but I like the structure of them.

Decided to do the Settle and Carlisle last weekend and the Northern 158 was sheer bliss after the Azuma I arrived in Leeds on The inadequate air con of the 158 is another story though.

 

[XAM2175]

But for how long?
It might be ok on a 30 - 45 minute commute but 4 hours bolt up[right on an Azuma is a completely different thing.

Nope, having done a number of multi-hour trips in 800s, 802s, and 397s I still prefer that posture.

 

[507 001]

Nope, having done a number of multi-hour trips in 800s, 802s, and 397s I still prefer that posture

I tried Liverpool to Newcastle on an 802 not long after introduction. My back was aching by York. Upgraded to 1st on the way back to avoid the rubbish seats.

I also often travel on a Mk5 set Lea Green to Vic of a morning. They’re not much better on short hops.

 

[PeterY]

At least I'm not alone in finding ironing board seats extremely uncomfortable. I'm basically quite skinny, so I find the hard seats dig into the bones on my bum, akin to seating on a wooden church pew.

I've often thought about getting a thin, say 1" thick flat cushion or so, to sit on, it might be a solution for me.

Perhaps if people started binging their own cushions, it may start a trend No doubt a H&S risk

 

[Mike Machin]

I haven’t encountered any comfortable seats on the national network since the first class compartments in the REP/4-TC sets on my daily commute from Bournemouth up to Waterloo in the 70s and early 80s!

 

[Wolfie]

Indeed. The Treasury ought to have its functions separated out, rather than being allowed to behave like a government within the government.

It was done with the old Home Office.

You display a fundamental misconception about the role of HMT.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Perhaps if people started binging their own cushions, it may start a trend No doubt a H&S risk

I saw that happen on a Mk4 set once. Passenger got on at Peterborough, sat down on the other side of the aisle from where I was with the benefit of a cushion she had whipped out of her travelling bag.

The really funny thing was that I was having an on board meeting at the time with the senior GNER bod who was in charge of the "customer experience"... I had to convince him that I hadn't set it up for his benefit!!

 

[Envy123]

Decided to do the Settle and Carlisle last weekend and the Northern 158 was sheer bliss after the Azuma I arrived in Leeds on The inadequate air con of the 158 is another story though.

Azumas are very comfy for me and have better leg room than the older trains, but then again, my commute is Peterborough to London. I haven’t made a 4 hour trip with it yet.

 

[QSK19]

Azumas are very comfy for me and have better leg room than the older trains, but then again, my commute is Peterborough to London. I haven’t made a 4 hour trip with it yet.

I agree on the leg room; but I must say that I’m in the “think the seats are like ironing boards” camp.

I’m really looking forward to the Aurora seats once they finally come into service (EMR website states 2024 now!) - all the indicators are promising; so let’s hope that EMR stood their ground against the penny-pinching attitude of the DfT!

 

[Mikey C]

I was on a 4 abreast 375 on Saturday, and thought the seats were really comfortable, far far nicer than later Electrostars like the 387s. It makes such a difference to the passenger experience

 

[Non Multi]

At least I'm not alone in finding ironing board seats extremely uncomfortable. I'm basically quite skinny, so I find the hard seats dig into the bones on my bum, akin to seating on a wooden church pew.

I've often thought about getting a thin, say 1" thick flat cushion or so, to sit on, it might be a solution for me.

Perhaps if people started binging their own cushions, it may start a trend No doubt a H&S risk

*Glances over at the 1" thick, grey IKEA Hillared seatpad, AKA 'the Sophia cushion'.*