Arriva Green Line 757 to stop serving Luton Airport

[Smethwickian]

From what I could see when I went to Luton on Saturday, the 757 is still well used, despite the requirement to change buses at Luton station and the existence of the National Express A1 service. This may be mainly because of Terravision branded tickets bought on the plane or at foreign airports which can only be used on Green Line. Most of the people I saw using the airport to Luton station section of Arriva service 'A' were using it as a connection to Green Line.

I had an outing on the new busway last Friday, starting at the airport where signposting of the new arrangement at the relevant stop was very poor, I thought, although a member of Arriva staff loitering near the stops appeared to be there to answer perplexed tourists' questions. But that didn't help one young Asian lady who, much later on the journey on route A, by now approaching Dunstable, went to speak to the driver to ask where she should change for London....

And yes, it appeared many people making the connecting journey were clutching pre-paid vouchers booked with airline tickets. I wonder how long this arrangement would last if National Express were to persuade airlines to switch?

Several other buses between the airport and town centre, such as the 61, now appear to have been curtailed in town, leaving the A as the only local bus route connecting the airport and town centre, as far as I could see.

Sorry to go off topic but while here, my one other observation of the busway was that routes surely could have been better planned as time saved on the busway itself on route A is wasted by passengers from Houghton Regis and further on going on a big one-way loop around Dunstable centre - in fact, from Luton, serving the retail park stop twice!

 

[radamfi]

Sorry to go off topic but while here, my one other observation of the busway was that routes surely could have been better planned as time saved on the busway itself on route A is wasted by passengers from Houghton Regis and further on going on a big one-way loop around Dunstable centre - in fact, from Luton, serving the retail park stop twice!

Passengers wanting services from Houghton Regis to Luton are better off on Centrebus service E which doesn't go around the Dunstable loop, albeit only half hourly. Service A can really be considered to be 2 routes connected: Airport to Dunstable and Dunstable to Houghton Regis.

 

[howittpie]

Went to Luton today and noticed some of Nat Ex's A1 service are extended to Luton interchange so seems to be trying to increase competition with Greenline. A quick check it appears to operate hourly however the fare seems to be £18 return which is more expensive.

The northbound Greenline I caught northbound had a reasonable loading of about 35 most for the airport the southbound trip at tea time was a lot quieter.

 

[radamfi]

Went to Luton today and noticed some of Nat Ex's A1 service are extended to Luton interchange so seems to be trying to increase competition with Greenline. A quick check it appears to operate hourly however the fare seems to be £18 return which is more expensive.

That shows that NX is quite concerned about Green Line. I admit I didn't think Green Line would last this long. If anything, the NX service looks more vulnerable given they have to fork out large sums to the airport for the privilege of stopping there.

 

[howittpie]

That shows that NX is quite concerned about Green Line. I admit I didn't think Green Line would last this long. If anything, the NX service looks more vulnerable given they have to fork out large sums to the airport for the privilege of stopping there.

Greenline actually addeda couple of journeys from the 25th September as demand had been greater than anticipated when they withdrew from the airport.

 

[glennds999]

Greenline are back in Luton Airport following legal proceedings from the 3rd of March - new coaches are on order!

 

[gage75]

sweet

 

[winston270twm]

Greenline are back in Luton Airport following legal proceedings from the 3rd of March - new coaches are on order!

I wonder how this decision will affect NX's 7 year concession at the airport which must be pretty worthless now?

 

[transmanche]

I wonder how this decision will affect NX's 7 year concession at the airport which must be pretty worthless now?

There's a pretty useful summary of the case here - although it doesn't really answer your question, I found it quite interesting.

 

[freetoview33]

It does sound like it is worthless to me!

 

[PG]

Also available is the High Court Judgement, which makes very interesting reading

It's little wonder Greenline didn't throw in the towel given that without the 757 the future of much of Arriva's operations around Luton/Dunstable would surely have been in jeopardy -

28. The 757 service was the most significant revenue earner of all the Green Line services. In the year to 1 May 2013, the 757 service generated about £7,445,000.
It was a very profitable route.
ATS’ evidence was that the 757 service, together with the 755 service, has historically accounted for about 8 per cent of its annual turnover but about 32 per cent of the company’s annual profit. On turnover of £7,455,000, ATS earned an operating profit of £3,409,000 representing a profit margin of 46 per cent.

It seems a new broom swept into Luton Airport late in 2011, and this guy decided that the airport needed a significantly larger cut. Up till NX's new concession Greenline were paying roughly £100k a year to the airport - on a non exclusive basis. NX agreed to pay £1.4m in the first year rising to £2.1m in year seven for their exclusive (but anti-competitive) rights.
It's worrying that NX were prepared to pay so much for something that a court of law has now basically deemed is worthless. :roll:

 

[Tetchytyke]

Also available is the High Court Judgement, which makes very interesting reading

It does, doesn't it?

The judge REALLY didn't like Rupert Lawrie, the commercial director at Luton Airport. That judgment isn't all that far short of a character assassination.

As for Arriva The Shires, the fact they didn't know how much money they made on the route from internet sales, and almost talked themselves into a £20m debt they didn't owe, says wonders about their competence.

 

[PG]

TBH I don't like the sound of Mr Lawrie - sounds like a nightmare to negotiate with.

What's the betting NX are furiously trying to get their concession payments reduced now?

erm yes, bit of egg on the face at ATS', although I doubt they're alone in the industry in that respect.

Got to love the judge (who we assume has no prior knowledge of the industry) with her observation that buses in a bus station have there own version of Parkinsons law - they expand to fill all the space

 

[winston270twm]

TBH I don't like the sound of Mr Lawrie - sounds like a nightmare to negotiate with.

What's the betting NX are furiously trying to get their concession payments reduced now?

erm yes, bit of egg on the face at ATS', although I doubt they're alone in the industry in that respect.

Got to love the judge (who we assume has no prior knowledge of the industry) with her observation that buses in a bus station have there own version of Parkinsons law - they expand to fill all the space

As the NX concession is now worthless, NX should only pay departure charges or the same as Arriva will be paying from March onwards.

 

[Robertj21a]

As the NX concession is now worthless, NX should only pay departure charges or the same as Arriva will be paying from March onwards.

That will depend on how the contract between National Express and the airport was worded.

Personally, I rather hope that NX are forced to pay out the full contracted price for the next 7 years, then it might make them think again of trying to force a monopoly.

Robert

 

[Deerfold]

That will depend on how the contract between National Express and the airport was worded.

Personally, I rather hope that NX are forced to pay out the full contracted price for the next 7 years, then it might make them think again of trying to force a monopoly.

Robert

I suspect the concept of exclusivity will be in there somewhere.

I don't think you can blame NX particularly for trying. The monopoly was the airport's idea - at the expense of Arriva (they could either lose the route or pay through the nose...)

 

[winston270twm]

I suspect the concept of exclusivity will be in there somewhere.

I don't think you can blame NX particularly for trying. The monopoly was the airport's idea - at the expense of Arriva (they could either lose the route or pay through the nose...)

I'd agree, NX won the concession fair & square and were going to have to pay a handsome price for the privilege of exclusive access to the Airport, well above what Arriva were previously paying.

If anything, it is Luton Airport that have got too greedy & its backfired.

 

[Titfield]

I wonder how much the favourable advantage given to easyBus played a part in the destination?

It almost appears that LLAO decided to allow easyBus to compete with Nexp but not Greenline without any valid justification.

 

[Mr Manager]

That Summing up is very interesting indeed.

The missing Internet sales money i think is the next one to be sorted out also the Hyper link email was a bit of a blow. Like said previous the Judge certainly did not like Rupert at all. And the easy bus saga also. "5 days to remove all easybus advertising and features" was a key factor also. start finding little things then all of a sudden you have a big issue and he is the issue. i would think his days with the operations team are now numbered and national Express will be licking their wounds to an extent that i think some heads may roll also. From Arrivas point of view there are a lot of Questions still unanswered and i expect this will drag on and on until resolved.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I'd agree, NX won the concession fair & square and were going to have to pay a handsome price for the privilege of exclusive access to the Airport, well above what Arriva were previously paying.

If anything, it is Luton Airport that have got too greedy & its backfired.

Thirded!

The fact is that NatEx will have exclusivity clauses in their contract between themselves and the airport. If that exclusivity has gone, then the contract is gone.

Depends on the payment structure, and whether the payment is a monthly amount (no real issue) or an annual (will need to get back x/12 worth) or even larger tranches? However, the issue lies with the airport not NatEx. I don't think that heads will roll there, but as for the airport....??

 

[Mr Manager]

Legal costs would have been figures we can only dream off. i think its between the Airport and Nat expresss as who pays. Nat exp for breach of contract. Luton Airport for anti competitive agreements. i can see another court case looming as who is responsible for Arriva's legal costs

 

[Deerfold]

Legal costs would have been figures we can only dream off. i think its between the Airport and Nat expresss as who pays. Nat exp for breach of contract. Luton Airport for anti competitive agreements. i can see another court case looming as who is responsible for Arriva's legal costs

Why on earth would NatEx be liable for any of Arriva's costs?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Absolutely. The case was brought by Arriva against Luton Airport. Therefore, NatEx will not be liable for any costs

 

[PG]

If anything, it is Luton Airport that have got too greedy & its backfired.

Definitely.

I wonder how much the favourable advantage given to easyBus played a part in the destination?

It almost appears that LLAO decided to allow easyBus to compete with Nexp but not Greenline without any valid justification.

If it hadn't been for the easyBus exception I think the judgement might well have gone against Arriva.

Wonder if there's any chance of easyBus getting back into bed with Greenline?

 

[gingerheid]

It is Luton Airport that have breached the terms of their contract with NatExp; they contracted to give them exclusive rights to run services to Victoria and have failed to do so. NatExp will have negotiated a lower fee for the non-exclusive rights they now have!

 

[gage75]

Greenline are back in Luton Airport following legal proceedings from the 3rd of March - new coaches are on order!

Services resume as of morning of Sunday 2nd March as am currently sitting on ready to depart for Airport

 

[daikilo]

It is Luton Airport that have breached the terms of their contract with NatExp; they contracted to give them exclusive rights to run services to Victoria and have failed to do so. NatExp will have negotiated a lower fee for the non-exclusive rights they now have!

Actually it is Luton Airport Operations which apparently have abused their rights. One question I would ask is whether the owners of the airport itself (Luton Borough) ever authorised LAO to exploit such a position regarding the bus station. Indeed, what rights does LAO have regarding the use of the public bus station?

 

[glennds999]

Services resume as of morning of Sunday 2nd March as am currently sitting on ready to depart for Airport

Sorry - yes you are right Services did indeed start today! Wonder how long the A will run for then...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Actually it is Luton Airport Operations which apparently have abused their rights. One question I would ask is whether the owners of the airport itself (Luton Borough) ever authorised LAO to exploit such a position regarding the bus station. Indeed, what rights does LAO have regarding the use of the public bus station?

Indeed, I haven't seen one single thing mentioned about/by Luton Borough Council through this whole saga. One must wonder what was in their contract with LLAOL in terms of what rights they have.

 

[Deerfold]

Sorry - yes you are right Services did indeed start today! Wonder how long the A will run for then...

Given a couple of other local services were withdrawn from the airport when the A was introduced I'd expect it to survive (although not sure about the frequency or the overnight service).

 

[34D]

Indeed, what rights does LAO have regarding the use of the public bus station?

I'm not sure that it is 'public'. I read it as being land owned by LBC but leased to LAO.