CAF class 197 Civity for TfW: News and updates on introduction.

[berneyarms]

I am not too sure given the Welsh Gov recently acquired extra Mark 4 carriages. My presumption was they would operate all of the trains on the route given they have enough for at least seven sets.
Yes, the 158 has a few more seats, and, yes, the toilet thing has been mentioned about a million times. However, the capacity is basically the same. My point still stands too. An hourly service between Aberystwyth and Shrewsbury and potentially onto Birmingham would be heavily favoured by route users over a slightly larger capacity train on a two per hour service.

The extra Mark 4 sets are for South Wales-Manchester. The original sets will operate three return trips between Cardiff and Holyhead.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Really? I spoke to the local MS not too long ago who assured me in her discussions with the minister, she was 'guaranteed' that Aberystwyth to Shrewsbury would run hourly (with an increase on the pre-Covid schedule when there wasn't actually a train every hour) when the new fleet was fully impletemented.

I thought that too, it was rather Pwllheli that sees a capacity reduction (just as British beach holidays are getting popular again).

 

[berneyarms]

Pre covid the service was nearly hourly. 1tph Shrewsbury to Birmingham Int with the service continuing to Aberystwth/Pwhelli or Holyhead in alternate hours. There was also an additional Aberystwyth - Shrewsbury only service in most of the alternate hours. Tfw had confirmed there would be no increase in capacity when the 197s come in.

To be clear, pre-Covid there were gaps in the service on the Cambrian mainline on weekdays at:
10:30, 14:30, 16:30 ex-Aberystwyth

08:30, 12:30, 14:30, 16:30 ex-Shrewsbury

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Sep 2021 ==

Really? I spoke to the local MS not too long ago who assured me in her discussions with the minister, she was 'guaranteed' that Aberystwyth to Shrewsbury would run hourly (with an increase on the pre-Covid schedule when there wasn't actually a train every hour) when the new fleet was fully impletemented.

That’s what I understood was the plan too.

 

[Rhydgaled]

To be clear, pre-Covid there were gaps in the service on the Cambrian mainline on weekdays at:
10:30, 14:30, 16:30 ex-Aberystwyth

08:30, 12:30, 14:30, 16:30 ex-Shrewsbury

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Sep 2021 ==


That’s what I understood was the plan too.

Indeed, there were a few 2hr gaps to Aberystwyth on weekdays but there were also periods when it was hourly. It was always planned to go to full hourly at some point (the Welsh Government once claimed it would be done by 2011), KeolisAmey decided that they would deliver this by putting 197s on the Cambrian but it could also be delivered with 158s (as it is on Sundays) especially given that there are more 158s with ETCS than there would be 197s with ETCS.

 

[Caaardiff]

Indeed, there were a few 2hr gaps to Aberystwyth on weekdays but there were also periods when it was hourly. It was always planned to go to full hourly at some point (the Welsh Government once claimed it would be done by 2011), KeolisAmey decided that they would deliver this by putting 197s on the Cambrian but it could also be delivered with 158s (as it is on Sundays) especially given that there are more 158s with ETCS than there would be 197s with ETCS.

The number of ERTM's fitted 197's is irrelevant as there's a fair number of services not on the Cambrian operated by 158's.
Can we not turn this into another discussion about your dislike of the 197's?

 

[berneyarms]

Indeed, there were a few 2hr gaps to Aberystwyth on weekdays but there were also periods when it was hourly. It was always planned to go to full hourly at some point (the Welsh Government once claimed it would be done by 2011), KeolisAmey decided that they would deliver this by putting 197s on the Cambrian but it could also be delivered with 158s (as it is on Sundays) especially given that there are more 158s with ETCS than there would be 197s with ETCS.

Umm, I was pointing out the gaps in the hourly service.

 

[Mag_seven]

Just a reminder that this is a Traction and Rolling Stock section thread for discussion of CAF Civity for TfW.

If anyone wants to discuss anything else such as climate change or Welsh devolution then they are welcome to start another thread in the appropriate section of the forum.

thanks

 

[wobman]

197001 is at Donnington for maintenance work apparently

 

[The_Train]

197001 is at Donnington for maintenance work apparently

Don't quote me on this but I suspect it has moved to Donnington for easier transfer to a low loader for road transport to South Wales. I believe that getting trains in and out of Crewe LNWR/Arriva Traincare is impossible by road because of a low bridge or low electrical wires (or something that is low anyway )

 

[PHILIPE]

Don't quote me on this but I suspect it has moved to Donnington for easier transfer to a low loader for road transport to South Wales. I believe that getting trains in and out of Crewe LNWR/Arriva Traincare is impossible by road because of a low bridge or low electrical wires (or something that is low anyway )

It has already had one trip back to the Works with road transfer at Donnington which is the location to do the transfer similar to the WMR 196s

 

[wobman]

Don't quote me on this but I suspect it has moved to Donnington for easier transfer to a low loader for road transport to South Wales. I believe that getting trains in and out of Crewe LNWR/Arriva Traincare is impossible by road because of a low bridge or low electrical wires (or something that is low anyway )

Thanks for that information. Imagine if the Newport plant had a rail connection and how much easier things would be.

 

[tomuk]

Thanks for that information. Imagine if the Newport plant had a rail connection and how much easier things would be.

I though it did have a connection. I'm sure I read the planning application.

 

[PHILIPE]

I though it did have a connection. I'm sure I read the planning application.

No. It has no connection and there has been some discussion well up thread (Page 44). Although I couldn't turn anything up, I have read that it is due to Tata Steel on whose site it is, refused to allow access.

 

[wobman]

No. It has no connection and there has been some discussion well up thread (Page 44). Although I couldn't turn anything up, I have read that it is due to Tata Steel on whose site it is, refused to allow access.

It's baffling building a rolling stock facility with no rail access, it's mad how everything has to be moved by road transport in this day and age.

 

[Dai Corner]

It's baffling building a rolling stock facility with no rail access, it's mad how everything has to be moved by road transport in this day and age.

The CAF facility in Newport is within about 20 metres of having rail access. This aerial photo shows CAF bottom right, the Tata-owned tracks in the middle and the main line at the top.

https://goo.gl/maps/pvMS6kbHaguGSjhr6

 

[Envoy]

This must be the only train manufacturing site in the world that is right by the railway yet they have to move the trains out by road transport to a site many miles away. Absolutely bonkers!

 

[wobman]

The CAF facility in Newport is within about 20 metres of having rail access. This aerial photo shows CAF bottom right, the Tata-owned tracks in the middle and the main line at the top.

https://goo.gl/maps/pvMS6kbHaguGSjhr6

But CAF always choose to use road transport, it's baffling why this happens.
The northern / wmt and TFW units are all being transported by road.

I know the TFW now have 2 units so the next 75 will be transported by road !

 

[aleandrail]

197002 arrived into Crewe yesterday, just as I was about to board my train home. Managed to take a quick couple of images

 

[PHILIPE]

A move for Friday so assume it must be 197003 which is being formed up today

www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R05552/2021-09-24/detailed

 

[wobman]

A move for Friday so assume it must be 197003 which is being formed up today

www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R05552/2021-09-24/detailed

If it's a 3 car set as some people are saying it could be 197103, there will hopefully be some pictures of it once it's assembled at Donnington and moved by the ROG guys to Crewe Arriva traincare depot.

 

[wobman]

If it's a 3 car set as some people are saying it could be 197103, there will hopefully be some pictures of it once it's assembled at Donnington and moved by the ROG guys to Crewe Arriva traincare depot.

197101 probably

 

[PHILIPE]

197101 probably

Confirmed by an eye-witness at Donnington

 

[wobman]

Confirmed by an eye-witness at Donnington

A good guess then, some pictures will appear when it's on the move tommorow on its way to Crewe Arriva traincare depot

 

[PHILIPE]

A good guess then, some pictures will appear when it's on the move tommorow on its way to Crewe Arriva traincare depot

Have since seen a picture on FB all three of them

 

[03_179]

Forgot to post this the other day.


Tuesday I was at Chester around 10:45 and 197002 appeared on test from Llandudno Jn.

Speaking to the driver he said that there was about 6 more weeks of testing before they start to enter service.

How accurate it is I don't know but thought prudent to let people know.

 

[Caaardiff]

Forgot to post this the other day.


Tuesday I was at Chester around 10:45 and 197002 appeared on test from Llandudno Jn.

Speaking to the driver he said that there was about 6 more weeks of testing before they start to enter service.

How accurate it is I don't know but thought prudent to let people know.

I don't think there's any plans for them to enter passenger service until next year at least. Have any guards been trained yet?

 

[craigybagel]

AFAIK it's just instructor training taking place at the moment. 002 has been going out every day with Driver Trainers and Driver Instructors onboard but training for regular drivers hasn't started yet. I'd be astounded if they entered service in 6 weeks - but I wouldn't rule out it happening before the end of the year.

 

[03_179]

Maybe it was a little misunderstood

 

[craigybagel]

Have any guards been trained yet?

Same as with the drivers - instructors are learning them at present but no regular training has started yet

 

[Caaardiff]

Maybe it was a little misunderstood

Maybe the driver meant in service for regular driver/guard training as apposed to passenger service.