• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Campaign to restore passenger services on the Middlewich Link Line

Status
Not open for further replies.

pemma

Veteran Member
Joined
23 Jan 2009
Messages
31,474
Location
Knutsford
:lol: Are they forgetting that certain areas of Knutsford that use to see 4 buses an hour now only see 1 and that on a Saturday, if you want to get to Manchester, you have to use the bus because the train and bus times don't meet?

Most commuters make journeys Mon-Fri. As Cheshire East didn't bother to include an approx 08:00 Knutsford to Wilmslow bus as part of the 88 contract it's fortunate D&G decided to run a commercial 88A in addition, otherwise there would be no suitable bus for those living in Knutsford and working in Wilmslow with a 9am start. I've observed there's always a few schoolkids in a uniform for a Wilmslow school on the 08:00 88A service so obviously Cheshire East forgot about them!

Surely if you can't walk to Knutsford station and don't want a long wait in Knutsford you would use the bus to get to Wilmslow station, where there's a much more frequent service to Manchester than from Knutsford.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
According to the Cheshire East local transport plan there are significant commuter flows to Knutsford from Wilmslow, Middlewich and Sandbach. The 88/88A bus provides a connection for the first but what about the other two?

You've beaten me to it! Please can lots of people respond to the Cheshire East consultation :)

Anyone with any energy left afterwards may also want to respond to the LEP one ;)http://www.871candwep.co.uk/resources/draft-transport-strategy/

The LEP consultation document has info about traffic flows that have been the subject of discussions here in the last few weeks.

While I'm here can I say what a lovely board this is - you're all really helpful and have great insights and make brilliant suggestions.
 
Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
Kevin the revenue enforcement officer at Northwich station has spotted that a new set of points would allow the Middlewich line to run in to platforms 1 and 2 and do away with the need to develop a 3rd platform. I’m stating who said it so he gets credited if this turns out to be an idea that saved millions of pounds. There’s a photo of the site on the Mid Cheshire Rail Link campaign Twitter page :)
 

pemma

Veteran Member
Joined
23 Jan 2009
Messages
31,474
Location
Knutsford
Kevin the revenue enforcement officer at Northwich station has spotted that a new set of points would allow the Middlewich line to run in to platforms 1 and 2 and do away with the need to develop a 3rd platform. I’m stating who said it so he gets credited if this turns out to be an idea that saved millions of pounds. There’s a photo of the site on the Mid Cheshire Rail Link campaign Twitter page :)

Although platform 3 would be needed if a shuttle was to serve the line or even if services were to run Crewe-Middlewich-Northwich-Greenbank-Knutsford-Altrincham-Manchester (i.e. extending the second hourly service to Crewe without Greenbank losing it's additional service.) Plus regardless of what happens on the Middlewich line Northwich needs the accessible footbridge put in, so the cost of that shouldn't be considered an expense for putting trains on the Middlewich line.
 

LOL The Irony

On Moderation
Joined
29 Jul 2017
Messages
5,335
Location
Chinatown, New York
Kevin the revenue enforcement officer at Northwich station has spotted that a new set of points would allow the Middlewich line to run in to platforms 1 and 2 and do away with the need to develop a 3rd platform. I’m stating who said it so he gets credited if this turns out to be an idea that saved millions of pounds. There’s a photo of the site on the Mid Cheshire Rail Link campaign Twitter page :)
Good idea but if the service (When the London-centred Gov. decides to give us one :lol:) does wind up terminating at Northwich, the main running line in one direction blocked for 5-10 minutes. I think it would still be better to have a 3rd platform and rebuild the platforms at Northwich (and every other platform on the linne that needs a hump for disabled access).
 

pemma

Veteran Member
Joined
23 Jan 2009
Messages
31,474
Location
Knutsford
Good idea but if the service (When the London-centred Gov. decides to give us one :lol:) does wind up terminating at Northwich, the main running line in one direction blocked for 5-10 minutes. I think it would still be better to have a 3rd platform and rebuild the platforms at Northwich (and every other platform on the linne that needs a hump for disabled access).

If a staff member is available to put down a ramp if a wheelchair user or passenger with limited mobility turns up then you don't have to eliminate steps on to trains altogether. The Northwich step (without the hump) is far too big and it will actually be a bigger problem when Pacers are withdrawn.

My guess is the points have been put in so a freight train going on or coming off the Middlewich branch can pass another freight train standing on the line next to the abandoned platform 3.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Ianno87

Veteran Member
Joined
3 May 2015
Messages
15,215
Kevin the revenue enforcement officer at Northwich station has spotted that a new set of points would allow the Middlewich line to run in to platforms 1 and 2 and do away with the need to develop a 3rd platform. I’m stating who said it so he gets credited if this turns out to be an idea that saved millions of pounds. There’s a photo of the site on the Mid Cheshire Rail Link campaign Twitter page :)

Sets of point (including whole life cost of maintaining them) don't come cheap either. Platform may in fact be cheaper...
 
Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
Who knew? Turns out the Middlewich line used to have points that ran one track in to platforms 1 and 2 at Northwich and one in to platform 3. Shame they were removed. An old photo has just been posted on Twitter by @GaryGBrookes
 

The_Engineer

Member
Joined
24 Mar 2018
Messages
524
Indeed, here it is again.
Train2170.JPG
The crossover was used at least daily by a Crewe to Manchester parcels working which shunted vans in the loading dock at the Manchester end of Platform 1 - this was early evening through into the 80s. There must also have been a return working, I am not sure what time of day that was though. In the early 80s I also saw quite a few Manchester - Crewe expresses diverted this way to Crewe via platforms 1 and 2.
Train2203.JPG
As a bonus, here's a DMU arriving from Crewe at Northwich Platform 1 on the occasion of Northwich Steam Gala in 1980 - the last time I saw these crossovers being used. I don't know when they were removed.
 
Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
There was huge excitement along our route today as the Branch Line Society ran the 'Nosey Peaker' charter down the Mid Cheshire Link Line. It had 220 paying passengers on it. Today's train showed our line is absolutely ready for passenger services and if a voluntary organisation can manage it then the DfT can too!
 

Xenophon PCDGS

Veteran Member
Joined
17 Apr 2011
Messages
32,423
Location
A semi-rural part of north-west England
There was huge excitement along our route today as the Branch Line Society ran the 'Nosey Peaker' charter down the Mid Cheshire Link Line. It had 220 paying passengers on it. Today's train showed our line is absolutely ready for passenger services and if a voluntary organisation can manage it then the DfT can too!

Looking at next week on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday, had the aspirational service been running, it would either be subject to the machinations of the RMT or/and the "emergency" timetabling machinations. It may have even seen the same fate that has beset the Windermere Branch.
 

Ships

Member
Joined
25 Apr 2013
Messages
337
Kevin the revenue enforcement officer at Northwich station has spotted that a new set of points would allow the Middlewich line to run in to platforms 1 and 2 and do away with the need to develop a 3rd platform. I’m stating who said it so he gets credited if this turns out to be an idea that saved millions of pounds. There’s a photo of the site on the Mid Cheshire Rail Link campaign Twitter page :)

Do you know how much an S&C remodel with associated signalling works would cost? (Hint much more than a new platform face), you wouldn't just be putting in one point end as those around it from memory are pretty ancient. You'd also need to factor in renewing pretty much all the formation and probably rail sleepers and ballast from where the double track at the Sandbatch end finishes. It's very well maintained for a 20(5?) Mph freight route but not to passenger standards if the linespeeds going to be higher as suggested
 

pemma

Veteran Member
Joined
23 Jan 2009
Messages
31,474
Location
Knutsford
It was just a charter pathed along there, I can't quite see what that proves.

Indeed. It's not even the first charter train to have used the Middlewich branch in recent times, the charter also did Buxton to Chinley to Northenden to Altrincham to Middlewich to Crewe. Using the same logic DfT should be looking at running Altrincham to Chinley & Buxton services avoiding Stockport, which I somehow think is unlikely.
 
Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
You’re all aware of the viability of the line. It’s great publicity when services use our line because it allows campaigners to show people who aren’t in the know what’s possible. Change managers probably call it vision presentation or something!
 
Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
That report was just feedback to the CWLTB from the meeting the LEP had with stakeholders and the DfT.

It's a business case that's being prepared not another feasabity study so I don't think that is anything like long grass. The business case is expected to be ready by the end of the year.

The campaigners won't let this be held up. Don't forget, in 3 years their new team has taken this from 'never happening/Meh' to a stakeholder meeting with the DfT and lthe preparation of a business case. The LEP and the 3 most local MPs actively support it too so it's happening! There's no way if this was a line through the heart of Surrey it would be left without a passenger service so no one should accept it being left without a passenger service here.
 

The Ham

Established Member
Joined
6 Jul 2012
Messages
10,326
There's no way if this was a line through the heart of Surrey it would be left without a passenger service so no one should accept it being left without a passenger service here.

You mean like the reopening of the Cranleigh line...
 

Tirov

Member
Joined
17 Jul 2014
Messages
47
The government have allowed 1500ish homes to be built at Dunsfold just by Cranleigh yet they didn't make it a condition that the Guildford to Cranleigh line be re-opened. Tram trains would be just the job as they could leave the old rail line just before Cranleigh just before the built on section of the line and travel down the road to Cranleigh! As usual no one has any brains in Surrey where transport is concerned.
 
Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
The importance of this line as a passenger route was shown again today when Virgin trains used it on diversion because there was a fire between Crewe and Chester.
 

The Planner

Veteran Member
Joined
15 Apr 2008
Messages
15,965
Again, that is nothing new, it is planned as a diversionary route all the time and in perturbation like occurred yesterday. I don't think that has any correlation with the requirement for a station, it certainly would't be included in the various studies that have been done.
 
Joined
8 Aug 2015
Messages
92
Again, that is nothing new, it is planned as a diversionary route all the time and in perturbation like occurred yesterday. I don't think that has any correlation with the requirement for a station, it certainly would't be included in the various studies that have been done.

It is vital in helping show non railway minded people (aka purse string holders, and consultation form fillers), like Borough Councillors and LEP staff (at least 20k from each just put up for the study) and the public, that this line has not just freight but passenger trains already. Not just little local trains either, massive Virgin Trains. That gets people seeing what’s possible and wanting it. So it has a direct connection with getting funding, people demanding services and also working to achieve them. Don’t forget, even on this board fairly recently (old thread) even railway people were saying ‘no chance/Meh); locals has forgotten the line was there, Knutsford, Hale, Altrincham and Northwich didn’t realise they could still go direct to Crewe, Gadbrook Park maybe hadn’t thought about having a station, the BCs and LEP weren’t pushing for reinstatement and only one MP was involved. Look at the state of play now.

Once the business case is done and people get consultated it’s vital they don’t just go ‘eh?/meh’ but fill in the form and say what they want and they’re more likely to do that now they’re consistently seeing what’s possible
 

The Planner

Veteran Member
Joined
15 Apr 2008
Messages
15,965
It has diverted passenger trains, you could use that analogy on many many lines. The West Mids is currently a case in point, I don't believe that because Cross Country go via the Camp Hill lines that it is a driver for the proposed new local stations.
 

furnessvale

Established Member
Joined
14 Jul 2015
Messages
4,582
It has diverted passenger trains, you could use that analogy on many many lines. The West Mids is currently a case in point, I don't believe that because Cross Country go via the Camp Hill lines that it is a driver for the proposed new local stations.
I may be mistaken, but I think the point being made was that one line (Middlewich) was insitu and up to passenger carrying standards, whereas in another proposal the track wasn't even there.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top