D&G Buses

[mangad]

This is a regular occurance on the tracking for the last journey towards Knutsford. The tracking stops before Mobberley and the driver doesn't bother to drive around the Longridge Estate but the tracking doesn't record which way it goes.

Vehicles – 88 - Altrincham - Macclesfield – bustimes.org

One day the tracking showed the driver of the 18:15 Macclesfield to Wilmslow driving out of Knutsford bus station, pulling in to the service station on the M6 and remaining there for around half an hour.

There must be one or two lazy drivers who think if there's no-one on the bus and it's the last journey of the day, they can skip the rest of the journey. If the relevant manager is aware of it, then D&G should be stripped of the contract.

My other half had something similar on the 385. Last bus to go all the way to the terminus at Mellor Shiloh Road at Mellor was running late. There's a turning circle a mile or so before used by a few buses (including the final bus of the day). She wanted the stop just after the turning circle.

Only passenger.
"Where are you going to?"
Turfed off early so the bus could turn round.
They have tweaked the timetable now and it doesn't seem to happen as much. But for a while, it was quite common for that service to mysteriously not make it all the way to the end of the route.

 

[M803UYA]

This is a regular occurance on the tracking for the last journey towards Knutsford. The tracking stops before Mobberley and the driver doesn't bother to drive around the Longridge Estate but the tracking doesn't record which way it goes.

Vehicles – 88 - Altrincham - Macclesfield – bustimes.org

One day the tracking showed the driver of the 18:15 Macclesfield to Wilmslow driving out of Knutsford bus station, pulling in to the service station on the M6 and remaining there for around half an hour.

There must be one or two lazy drivers who think if there's no-one on the bus and it's the last journey of the day, they can skip the rest of the journey. If the relevant manager is aware of it, then D&G should be stripped of the contract.

It's where a basic contract management process will follow up on the operation of the service with the operator concerned. Does D&G operate regular rostered drivers on it's services, or do those drivers work multiple routes? If the drivers are regular ones doing the route day in day out, it'll be fair to say they know who the regular passengers are, what days they travel and when to 'skip' bits of the route without anyone noticing. Obviously you should always run the registered route as you never know when someone will be out inspecting operation of the service!

It's a wonderful cost saving practice and one the customers are obviously very satisfied with. Page 28 of Transport Focus' 'Your Bus Journey' survey shows a surprisingly high level of customer satisfaction with D&G Bus - a real surprise as I read here that they were one of the worst bus companies in the country!..... (edit:have tried copying and pasting the table here and it comes out in unreadable Chinese)

 

[northwichcat]

It's a wonderful cost saving practice and one the customers are obviously very satisfied with. Page 28 of Transport Focus' 'Your Bus Journey' survey shows a surprisingly high level of customer satisfaction with D&G Bus - a real surprise as I read here that they were one of the worst bus companies in the country!..... (edit:have tried copying and pasting the table here and it comes out in unreadable Chinese)

Given how wide D&G's operating area is, I think prospectives are going to be different between areas. A lot of the views posted on here seem to relate to their Cheshire and (very limited) Greater Manchester operations. I haven't seen posts on here from people saying they're unhappy with D&G's offering in the Stoke area.

As D&G have taken on some former Arriva routes and aren't using Mellors on them, some people see that as a positive. On the other hand they are using smaller buses than Arriva did on the 31 and 37 routes.

 

[M803UYA]

Given how wide D&G's operating area is, I think prospectives are going to be different between areas. A lot of the views posted on here seem to relate to their Cheshire and (very limited) Greater Manchester operations. I haven't seen posts on here from people saying they're unhappy with D&G's offering in the Stoke area.

As D&G have taken on some former Arriva routes and aren't using Mellors on them, some people see that as a positive. On the other hand they are using smaller buses than Arriva did on the 31 and 37 routes.

The report doesn't drill it down to an area but there's a general theme on here from some posters that D&G are the worst ever bus operation to ever travel the roads because of the fleet they use and their methods of timetabling. I've met a lot lot worse in my time! I'd love to have an operation of that nature in my home area - we're stuck with the german state railway and we have the worst bus operator in the country according to that table!

From the outside looking in (well I've seen some chaserider vehicles on a Saturday and they had people on board too!) it seems to be a difficult area to service, and if it's a choice of them or no bus, what's better? 29 seat Dart MPDs/Enviro 200s/Solos can stand up to 20 people (not comfortably) in the peaks so you're moving 50 passengers when you need to - maybe that's sufficient for the loadings.

 

[northwichcat]

From the outside looking in (well I've seen some chaserider vehicles on a Saturday and they had people on board too!) it seems to be a difficult area to service, and if it's a choice of them or no bus, what's better? 29 seat Dart MPDs/Enviro 200s/Solos can stand up to 20 people (not comfortably) in the peaks so you're moving 50 passengers when you need to - maybe that's sufficient for the loadings.

With some of the morning 31/37 journeys they were deckers or Pulsars under Arriva. If Arriva were short of vehicles and used something like a Cadet they could end up overloading the bus or leaving people behind. D&G normally plan for them to be operated by their longer Enviros or Streetlites. However, if they're short out comes a small Enviro and either the driver has to pretend he hasn't that it's 15+ over maximum capacity as school kids stand blocking the doors or sat in the storage space above the front wheel.

It's not a problem exclusive to D&G though, when Little Gem had the 288 Altrincham to Manchester Airport service the same thing applied between Altrincham and Hale Barnes. A Fiat minibus that stated it has space for 1 standing or 1 wheelchair left with 15+ standing. The difference there is the D&G 88 was around 15 minutes behind it, so if the driver refused to allow the bus to be overloaded, it wasn't a 1 hour wait for an alternative service.

By the way, the ex-Metroline Enviro 200s at D&G just have 26 seats and they do have an even smaller baby Solo, but fortunately that one doesn't stray on to the wrong routes all that often.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Are there any likely timing or route changes under consideration for the service 130 Macclesfield to Manchester Airport?

 

[northwichcat]

Are there any likely timing or route changes under consideration for the service 130 Macclesfield to Manchester Airport?

The 130 is now a contracted service, using diverted funding from one of the government schemes that was originally supposed to fund reinstated or new services. So there's unlikely to be any siginificant changes until the contract expires, unless both D&G and Cheshire East agree changes are mutually beneficial.

 

[SeanM1997]

Are there any likely timing or route changes under consideration for the service 130 Macclesfield to Manchester Airport?

Did you hear anything for why the 130 could be changing?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Did you hear anything for why the 130 could be changing?

Just think of the number of route changes on the 130 made by D&G since taking over from Arriva and you get into the habit of wondering what the next route change might be....

 

[SeanM1997]

Just think of the number of route changes on the 130 made by D&G since taking over from Arriva and you get into the habit of wondering what the next route change might be....

Next one will be timetable changes on 49 and 82 from 2 April (although timetables not on D&G website yet)

There could be some S106 funding for routes across Cheshire and Staffordshire soon - so I would assume D&G may bid for some of those routes

I suspect when the 312 S106 funding ends, part of the 88 or 130 will change in Wilmslow area will change to add sections in

D&G Bus

dgbus.co.uk

49 Weaverham - Northwich - Rudheath
From 1st April additional journeys will run on service 49, funded by Cheshire West and Chester Council and the Bus Service Improvement Plan.

https://dgbus.co.uk/assets/49_2024-04-01.pdf

82 Northwich - Hartford - Sandiway - Kelsall - Tarvin - Chester
From 1st April there are changes to Saturday afternoon journeys on service 82, and an additional Saturday early evening journey funded by Cheshire West and Chester Council.

https://dgbus.co.uk/assets/82_2024-04-01.pdf

Additionally, 2 routes are being amended from 5 May 2024:
8 Wistaston Green - Crewe - Sydney

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100 Hanley - Trentham Gardens - Barlaston - Stone

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[daodao]

Earlier today, driving along Hale Road in Altrincham, I had a "double take" on passing a D&G bus in the red and cream livery of the former North Western Road Car Company (NWRCC), which was very familiar to me from 60 years ago when NWRCC used to run most of the services in this area (other than Manchester Corporation's former tram routes 47 and 48). I presume that this bus was specially repainted to commemorate NWRCC's centenary last year.

 

[mangad]

Earlier today, driving along Hale Road in Altrincham, I had a "double take" on passing a D&G bus in the red and cream livery of the former North Western Road Car Company (NWRCC), which was very familiar to me from 60 years ago when NWRCC used to run most of the services in this area (other than Manchester Corporation's former tram routes 47 and 48). I presume that this bus was specially repainted to commemorate NWRCC's centenary last year.

There's some pictures of it earlier in the thread:

D&G Buses

Traveled yesterday on the 11.23am 1A from Newcastle to Audley. Of the approximate 20 people that got most got off before Parksite, and 4 (including myself abd a Friend) left on the bus . By the the time we got to Audley 3 left (which included me and my friend,who were visiting Audley). The...

www.railforums.co.uk

It's one of a few vehicles painted up to celebrate the 100 years since the founding of the North Western Road Car Company.
Stagecoach Manchester have a double decker painted up that's been running round Stockport, and Stagecoach Yorkshire have one too. As do Hulley's.

 

[Simon75]

My only gripe with them, is that buses don't seem to get washed much and seating is often worn and tired

 

[northwichcat]

Earlier today, driving along Hale Road in Altrincham, I had a "double take" on passing a D&G bus in the red and cream livery of the former North Western Road Car Company (NWRCC), which was very familiar to me from 60 years ago when NWRCC used to run most of the services in this area (other than Manchester Corporation's former tram routes 47 and 48). I presume that this bus was specially repainted to commemorate NWRCC's centenary last year.

It's been a regular on the 88/89 route for a few months now, but it did spend a month or so out-of-service. There was a suggestion it was going to end up at High Peak (there is a mention of East Cheshire and North Derbyshire on the rear of it).

My only gripe with them, is that buses don't seem to get washed much

When I travelled on one of their buses at night in December there were a few compliants from older passengers that they couldn't see where the bus was, so didn't know when to press the stop button.

and seating is often worn and tired

Very much the case on the small Enviros which have the old First Group colour seating.

 

[SeanM1997]

From 5th May additional journeys will run on service 8 on Monday to Saturday evenings and Sunday daytimes.

https://dgbus.co.uk/assets/8_2024-05-05.pdf

From 5th May some journeys on service 100 are retimed to improve reliability.

https://dgbus.co.uk/assets/100_2024-05-05.pdf

 

[northernrail2009]

Does anyone know if D&G do contactless payments on the 38 service from Macclesfield to Crewe?

I never use cash anymore so would be using my debit card.

 

[SeanM1997]

Does anyone know if D&G do contactless payments on the 38 service from Macclesfield to Crewe?

I never use cash anymore so would be using my debit card.

You can use contactless on all buses in Cheshire East

 

[northwichcat]

You can use contactless on all buses in Cheshire East

Do both Aimees and Mikro accept contactless? I know Belle Vue have only recently started accepting contactless.

D&G operated the 17:27 Birmingham to Four Oaks Rail Replacement Bus this evening (Thursday).

Regarding drivers missing out parts of journeys. I've also noticed on the first Knutsford bound bus in the morning it seems to be commonplace for the drivers to think no-one will be waiting for a bus at Wilmslow station at around 6:30am, so they can skip the stop.

Vehicles – 88 - Altrincham - Macclesfield – bustimes.org

If that's really the case, maybe D&G could agree with the council to miss out the stop on that journey, rather than the drivers doing it unofficially?

 

[Danfilm007]

Do both Aimees and Mikro accept contactless? I know Belle Vue have only recently started accepting contactless.

D&G operated the 17:27 Birmingham to Four Oaks Rail Replacement Bus this evening (Thursday).

Regarding drivers missing out parts of journeys. I've also noticed on the first Knutsford bound bus in the morning it seems to be commonplace for the drivers to think no-one will be waiting for a bus at Wilmslow station at around 6:30am, so they can skip the stop.

Vehicles – 88 - Altrincham - Macclesfield – bustimes.org

If that's really the case, maybe D&G could agree with the council to miss out the stop on that journey, rather than the drivers doing it unofficially?

I'm fairly sure ignoring booked stops is a big no-no for the Traffic Commissioner? I've heard reports that several other services miss out stops or ignore people walking to stops, I'm sure D&G don't intend to do it though!

 

[markymark2000]

I'm fairly sure ignoring booked stops is a big no-no for the Traffic Commissioner? I've heard reports that several other services miss out stops or ignore people walking to stops, I'm sure D&G don't intend to do it though!

Just to give an idea. Saturday and yesterday the 88 a number of issue trips where the bus has missed out an area (or the bus has conveniently tracked consistently off route). This is data from bustimes.org and I am only including instances where it is clear that a service has missed areas as a number of trips has issues with tracking around Wilmslow Rail Station whereby the trip possibly served the station, possibly didn't. What I will say though is that there are a number of instances of buses tracking just before at Bank Square or just after at the traffic lights, then appearing only a minute or 2 later down Alderley Road which to me is suspicious as it can take time to get through the lights at the crossroads and loop through the station.

Saturday 6th April:
07:30 Knutsford - Altrincham missed Wilmslow Station
14:45 Altrincham - Macclesfield missed Ollerton
16:45 Macclesfield - Altrincham missed Ollerton and Wilmslow Station

Monday 8th April:
08:20 Macclesfield - Altrincham didn't go via Morley Green
12:45 Altrincham - Macclesfield missed Ollerton
18:15 Macclesfield - Wilmslow missed out Wilmslow Cumber Lane & Moor Lane (running direct along Knutsford Road)


Looking back over the past week as well, there seems to be consistent issues with buses missing out Ollerton and the 18:50 from Altrincham conveniently generally stopping tracking before Longridge.

 

[Danfilm007]

Just to give an idea. Saturday and yesterday the 88 a number of issue trips where the bus has missed out an area (or the bus has conveniently tracked consistently off route). This is data from bustimes.org and I am only including instances where it is clear that a service has missed areas as a number of trips has issues with tracking around Wilmslow Rail Station whereby the trip possibly served the station, possibly didn't. What I will say though is that there are a number of instances of buses tracking just before at Bank Square or just after at the traffic lights, then appearing only a minute or 2 later down Alderley Road which to me is suspicious as it can take time to get through the lights at the crossroads and loop through the station.

Saturday 6th April:
07:30 Knutsford - Altrincham missed Wilmslow Station
14:45 Altrincham - Macclesfield missed Ollerton
16:45 Macclesfield - Altrincham missed Ollerton and Wilmslow Station

Monday 8th April:
08:20 Macclesfield - Altrincham didn't go via Morley Green
12:45 Altrincham - Macclesfield missed Ollerton
18:15 Macclesfield - Wilmslow missed out Wilmslow Cumber Lane & Moor Lane (running direct along Knutsford Road)


Looking back over the past week as well, there seems to be consistent issues with buses missing out Ollerton and the 18:50 from Altrincham conveniently generally stopping tracking before Longridge.

In fairness, certainly back when I was commuting, a lot of patches on the 88 had poor 3G/4G signal and that could be impacting the tracking? In all cases, I would hope people would be reporting it to D&G so they could check more thoroughly!

 

[markymark2000]

In fairness, certainly back when I was commuting, a lot of patches on the 88 had poor 3G/4G signal and that could be impacting the tracking? In all cases, I would hope people would be reporting it to D&G so they could check more thoroughly!

I agree with you, that is why I was cautious with my comments and I have deliberately given a lot of slack with the likes of Wilmslow station where the tracking almost never tracks the bus going around the station, my reports are only where I am 99% certain there was areas missed.

 

[SeanM1997]

6 Hanley - Longton

From 29th April a new journey on service 6 will commence running from Hanley to Longton at 0715 Monday to Friday. This is funded by Stoke-on-Trent City Council through the Bus Service Improvement Plan.

All other journeys on service 6 continue to be operated by First Potteries.

https://dgbus.co.uk/assets/6_2024-04-29.pdf

 

[northwichcat]

07:30 Knutsford - Altrincham missed Wilmslow Station

In fairness, certainly back when I was commuting, a lot of patches on the 88 had poor 3G/4G signal and that could be impacting the tracking? In all cases, I would hope people would be reporting it to D&G so they could check more thoroughly!

It's very unlikely that the mobile data signal prevents the first service from tracking around Wilmslow station but allows every other service. The isn't a good network signal between Knolls Green and Mobberley but that's not where buses are seen not tracking on sections.

Looking back over the past week as well, there seems to be consistent issues with buses missing out Ollerton and the 18:50 from Altrincham conveniently generally stopping tracking before Longridge.

Someone who lives on the route has told me the driver of the last bus effectively thinks it's set down only. If there's no one on board it misses Longridge, if there's people on board it serves Longridge. The tracking seems to be turned off whichever way the bus goes. One Saturday they saw the bus with Out of Service on the destination display, heading down Mobberley Road in Knutsford over 10 minutes before it should have arrived in Mobberley.

I agree with you, that is why I was cautious with my comments and I have deliberately given a lot of slack with the likes of Wilmslow station where the tracking almost never tracks the bus going around the station, my reports are only where I am 99% certain there was areas missed.

With the careful manoeuvre needed around the station car park and the traffic lights it's very unlikely a bus can get from the junction into the station and back, without noticably being late

 

[47550]

With the careful manoeuvre needed around the station car park and the traffic lights it's very unlikely a bus can get from the junction into the station and back, without noticably being late

Hasn’t it been one way on Station Road recently due to roadworks so wouldn’t be able to serve the station anyway ?

 

[northwichcat]

Hasn’t it been one way on Station Road recently due to roadworks so wouldn’t be able to serve the station anyway ?

I wasn't aware of any roadworks and if that's the reason for buses not serving a stop, why are neither D&G or Cheshire East listing it as an amended timetable is in operation?

 

[Djb1]

Hasn’t it been one way on Station Road recently due to roadworks so wouldn’t be able to serve the station anyway ?

Yes. Certainly for the last week, unsure about the week immediately after Easter.

 

[SeanM1997]

D&G are proposing to vary route no. 31 (Crewe - Winsford - Northwich) from 3 June 2024. Unclear at this stage what the variation is:

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Registration numberPC1090231/162
Licence NumberPC1090231
Variation number3
StatusVariation
Service number.31
Service typeNormal Stopping
Start pointCrewe Bus Station
Finish pointWatling Street, Northwich
ViaLeighton Hospital, Winsford
Date received10 Apr 2024
Effective date03 Jun 2024

 

[SeanM1997]

D&G are proposing to vary routes no. 37 (Crewe - Sandbach - Winsford - Northwich) and 38 (Crewe - Sandbach - Congleton - Macclesfield) from 3 June 2024. Unclear at this stage what the variation is:

Pardon Our Interruption

• Registration numberPC1090231/161
• Licence NumberPC1090231

• Variation number4
• StatusVariation
• Service number.37
• Service typeNormal Stopping
• Start pointCrewe Bus Station
• Finish pointWatling Street, Northwich
• ViaSandbach, Middlewich, Winsford
• Date received12 Apr 2024
• Effective date03 Jun 2024
• End date
• Supported by subsidies?In Part
• Local authorities covered by routeCheshire West and Chester Council
• Cheshire East Council
• TAOs covered by routeNorth West of England

Pardon Our Interruption

• Registration numberPC1090231/129
• Licence NumberPC1090231

• Variation number13
• StatusVariation
• Service number.38
• Service typeNormal Stopping
• Start pointCrewe Bus Station
• Finish pointMacclesfield Bus Station
• ViaSandbach, Congleton
• Date received12 Apr 2024
• Effective date03 Jun 2024
• End date
• Supported by subsidies?In Part
• Local authorities covered by routeCheshire East Council
• TAOs covered by routeNorth West of England

D&G also to cancel the X31 (Winsford - Northwich) service from 3 June 2024 (likely means 31 or 37 becoming an evening service Monday-Saturday between Northwich and Winsford):

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• Registration numberPC1090231/163
• Licence NumberPC1090231

• Variation number1
• StatusCancelled
• Service number.X31
• Service typeNormal Stopping
• Hail & Ride
• Start pointDENE DRIVE, WINSFORD, CHESHIRE
• Finish pointWATLING STREET, NORTHWICH
• ViaWINSFORD TOWN CENTRE
• Date received10 Apr 2024
• Effective date03 Jun 2024
• End date
• Supported by subsidies?Yes
• Local authorities covered by routeCheshire West and Chester Council
• TAOs covered by routeNorth West of England

 

[Martin2012]

Today marks 1 year since Arriva pulled out of the Cheshire East area with D&G taking over the bulk of the routes.
For those who have been regular users, how do you think D&G have fared in that time? An improvement on Arriva or are there improvements you think could be made?