Difficulty Taking Photos at Southend Victoria

[Darandio]

Obviously using the 'flash rule' as an excuse to be a jobsworth!

No excuse, you aren't allowed.

Don't let that influence your crusade though.

 

[JaJaWa]

He did not make it up!
Mentioned in this official help guide:

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/777.aspx

Yes, important enough to be the only thing mentioned twice:

Before you go on the platform
When you arrive at a station, please let the staff at the Network Rail Reception Desk know that you are on the station. This will help keep station staff informed so that they can go about their duties without concern as to your reasons for being there.

You may require a platform ticket to allow access to platforms.

On the platform
You need to act safely and sensibly at all times.

Stay clear of the platform edge and stay behind the yellow lines where they are provided
Be aware of your surroundings.
Please do not:

• Trespass on to the tracks or any other part of the railway that is not available to passengers
• Use flash photography because it can distract train drivers and train despatch staff and so is potentially very dangerous
  [*]Climb on any structure or interfere with platform equipment
• Obstruct any signalling equipment or signs which are vital to the safe running of the railway
• Wear anything which is similar in colour to safety clothing, such as high-visibility jackets, as this could cause confusion to drivers and other railway employees
• Gather together in groups at busy areas of the platform (e.g. customer information points, departure screens, waiting a

reas, seating etc.) or where this may interfere with the duties of station staff.
If possible, please try to avoid peak hours which are Monday to Friday 6:00am – 10:30am and 3:30pm – 7:30pm.

Report anything suspicious
If you see anything suspicious or notice any unusual behaviour or activities, please tell a member of staff immediately.

For emergencies and serious incidents, either call:

• The British Transport Police on 0800 40 50 40
• The Police on 999.

Your presence at a station can be very helpful to us as extra "eyes and ears" and can have a positive security benefit.

Photography
You can take photographs at stations provided you do not sell them. However, you are not allowed to take photographs of security related equipment, such as CCTV cameras.

Flash photography on platforms is not allowed at any time. It can distract train drivers and train despatch staff and so is potentially very dangerous.

Tripod legs must be kept away from platform edges and behind the yellow lines. On busy stations, you may not be allowed to use a tripod because it could be a dangerous obstruction to passengers.

Railway byelaws
For safety and ease of travel on the railway system (which includes passengers, staff, property and equipment), the byelaws must be observed by everyone. You can download the railway byelaws at Gov.uk.

General
Train companies must put the safety of their passengers and staff first.

You may occasionally be asked by station staff to move to another part of the station or to leave the station altogether. Station staff should be happy to explain why this is necessary.

If you are travelling by train, they may ask you to remain in the normal waiting areas with other passengers. If this occurs, please follow their instructions with goodwill as staff have many things to consider, including the safety and security of all passengers, and are authorised to use judgement in this regard.

Please print out a copy of these guidelines and take them with you when you are on the railway.

Thank you for reading and following these guidelines.

 

[colchesterken]

My I take this chance to say the people at Colchester main line could not be more helpful
If you say you want to go to customer services they let you through the barrier.only once in 20 yrs here was I asked to buy a platform ticket ( happy to do so )
Customer services clock you in and out and give you a " visitor " badge to wear
They will always help with enquiries , When the 70 s started I asked what the chance of seeing one was the person looked on the computer and said one will be along in xxx mins

Colchester is a train spotter friendly station !!

 

[simple simon]

At Blackpool North I asked and one member of staff said no (usuall BS about being illegal, security risk etc) whilst another (more senior) member of staff said yes, go ahead.

Whilst I was happily photographing they had an arguement!

I had a similar scenario at Farringdon on the day a railtour train was running, although here the person who said no found a new excuse - it was only permitted to film the railtour train, nothing else!

Both arguements included the superior member of staff pulling rank and reminding their subordinate who is in charge.

As an aside, at both stations when I had finished filming I made a point of thanking the people who had said 'yes'.

Simon

 

[306024]

Oh the irony, you accuse somebody of a sweeping generalisation whilst making one yourself, I'm not sure how the DM is relevant to this thread anyway:roll:

Err......that was part of the joke, but thanks for explaining. :roll: and

.......Colchester is a train spotter friendly station !!

See, not all bad

 

[MK Tom]

Thanks everyone for all the replies. I thanked and shook hands with the staff member who tried to be helpful, even despite thinking it was wrong until overruled by the manager. The original gateline guy gave me a smile and asked if I was ok towards the end of my photoing spree, having been so obnoxious and obstructive at the start he obviously felt like a bit of a wally.

My motivation for emailing in is not to get any staff in trouble, and I will single out the helpful guy in my message. It's more to stress the importance of staff knowing the rules and knowing how to handle enthusiasts. The fact that multiple staff members "had been told photography was not permitted without written permission" is very troubling and goes against Network Rail and ATOC guidance. Abellio's own policy is unclear to me and this is also disheartening: https://twitter.com/greateranglia/status/674617741869981696

To the guy who suggested I use a phone, remotely serious photographers do not find the quality of photos phones produce acceptable. I couldn't put a phone photo on my Flickr or Smugmug pages unless it was an exceptionally unique subject.

 

[ComUtoR]

Abellio's own policy is unclear to me and this is also disheartening: https://twitter.com/greateranglia/status/674617741869981696

Amazing how rude people can sound in 140 characters or less.

 

[rossco156433]

A friend and i had similar troubles at Glasgow Central Low Level last week. We were approached by a member of staff enquiring what we were up to, as soon as we said photography he ordered us to stop and out came the usual lines "illegal" "need permission from the manager" and lastly "the terrorism act"

Needless to say he was not amused when we asked which part of the terrorism act prohibites photography on railway stations, his response was to threaten us with the btp. Mentioning that the scotrail website even states personal photography is permitted only made the situation worse.

After that he decided to leave and get the btp shouting "this is F***ing rediculous" as he made his merry way back back down the platform. As we were coming to the end of our day anyway we packed up as we really couldn't be ar*ed with the hastle.

This is not the first time we have came across negativity towards enthusiasts on the Scotrail network, however it does only appear to be a minority of staff.

 

[PaxVobiscum]

To the guy who suggested I use a phone, remotely serious photographers do not find the quality of photos phones produce acceptable. I couldn't put a phone photo on my Flickr or Smugmug pages unless it was an exceptionally unique subject.

Like this one from an iPhone 5S

The way this site compresses images it doesn't look much different from the photos I shot on a Canon DSLR a few minutes later.

But you are right of course, normally that would be a last resort.

 

[TheEdge]

This one is aimed at Essexman and bramling as the case for and against personal photography on stations should be fairly clear cut and I'm not debating that.

But Sellafield, its not exactly a station. Given what it handles and the fact it isn't actually a power plant and handles everything from low grade waste to military grade material in various manners to me it seems perfectly acceptable that a member of the CNC would ask you to stop, delete and leave. By your own admission you say the trains are visible on the public network so from their point of view why would you be taking pictures of them through a fence at a nuclear installation. Would you stick your camera through the fence at Devonport to try and get a picture of the trains which you could also see on the network?

Being asked by police protecting a nuclear site to not take photos through a fence (and I'm guessing with something looking like or amounting to a long tom lens) is not exactly a deeply disturbing attack on your personal liberty. I definitely would not start saying they are abusing tiny amounts of power and implying they are jobsworths.

 

[ComUtoR]

To the guy who suggested I use a phone, remotely serious photographers do not find the quality of photos phones produce acceptable. I couldn't put a phone photo on my Flickr or Smugmug pages unless it was an exceptionally unique subject.

Isn't that a little pretentious ?

So raise your iPhones up high and snap away—unless you need to spend a lot on a camera, you’re almost certainly fine. Step away from automatic shooting and learn the camera’s settings a bit, maybe, but don’t feel like you need to spend thousands to take better pictures. Instead, remember this photography aphorism: "Amateurs worry about gear; professionals worry about money; masters worry about light."

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

Personally I'd regard taking a picture of a pacer as conclusive evidence of suspicious behaviour, but we're all different...

I find that remark insulting

 

[185]

Mr Farage is right. We should be rounding up these fundamentalist and extremist enthusiasts and deporting them all to the Isle of Sodor.

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

Mr Farage is right. We should be rounding up these fundamentalist and extremist enthusiasts and deporting them all to the Isle of Sodor.

I would not mind that at all... Maybe rescue a few pacers

 

[Y961 XBU]

I am yet to have any issues taking photos of Trains at any Station, i am a regular at Liverpool Lime Street and have been asked by Security there twice what i was doing, Once i said i was just taking photos of Train as am an Enthusiast they said *oh right, ok then mate* and they leave me alone, I dont see the fuss over a photo of a Train anyway in am honest, No ones looking at whos driving or who just happens to be in the background, We are just interested in the Train itself.

 

[sekimoke]

One time I was taking photos of 507s/508s at the Liverpool end of Rock Ferry station platform 2. Suddenly I heard some rustling behind when a train was entering the platform 1 and to my surprise two police officers had ran from the station office to talk to me.

It turns out the station staff thought I was considering jumping in front of a train and despatched two officers. They told me that I can't stand there as it will cause the drivers concern but they looked more relieved than anything else. I obliged and returned to the main platform area and no more was said about the incident.

I was brandishing my camera fairly obviously but I can understand seeing a lone person at the end of the platform would be cause for concern.

 

[Antman]

No excuse, you aren't allowed.

Don't let that influence your crusade though.

Err.................but if you read the posting he wasn't using a flash but don't let that minor detail influence your crusade eh?

 

[HH]

Usage of tripods is OK, provided they are not used in busy areas and are kept away from the platform edge. Flash photography is not permitted though.

It's not permitted on platforms. Nothing in the rules about ticket offices...

 

[Antman]

It's not permitted on platforms. Nothing in the rules about ticket offices...

Well I was told by a member of south eastern staff that tripods are ok on platforms so long as they are not in the way, not that I have ever used one. I suspect that in practice a bit of common sense is applied?

 

[Llanigraham]

Well I was told by a member of south eastern staff that tripods are ok on platforms so long as they are not in the way, not that I have ever used one. I suspect that in practice a bit of common sense is applied?

I suggest that you and all other photographers read and then print a copy of the Network Rail rules that I linked to earlier. You might even like to laminate a copy to keep in your camera bag.
It might help to stop a lot of these arguments.

 

[Antman]

I suggest that you and all other photographers read and then print a copy of the Network Rail rules that I linked to earlier. You might even like to laminate a copy to keep in your camera bag.
It might help to stop a lot of these arguments.

I've never had a problem taking photo's and I don't have a camera bag, I normally use my phone

 

[Essexman]

This one is aimed at Essexman and bramling as the case for and against personal photography on stations should be fairly clear cut and I'm not debating that.

But Sellafield, its not exactly a station. Given what it handles and the fact it isn't actually a power plant and handles everything from low grade waste to military grade material in various manners to me it seems perfectly acceptable that a member of the CNC would ask you to stop, delete and leave. By your own admission you say the trains are visible on the public network so from their point of view why would you be taking pictures of them through a fence at a nuclear installation. Would you stick your camera through the fence at Devonport to try and get a picture of the trains which you could also see on the network?

Being asked by police protecting a nuclear site to not take photos through a fence (and I'm guessing with something looking like or amounting to a long tom lens) is not exactly a deeply disturbing attack on your personal liberty. I definitely would not start saying they are abusing tiny amounts of power and implying they are jobsworths.

I would have had no complaint if there had been a sign prohibiting photography, or if the police officers had simply asked me to stop or delete. What I wasn't happy with was being asked for my name and the hardly credible suggestion that by taking photos (on my phone) through a temporary fence in full view of police officers, I was potentially a terrorist.

 

[colchesterken]

mmmm Yes I think taking photos at Sellafield is likely to attract attention
Nothing wrong of course but I would expect to be spoken to there

 

[341o2]

It's not permitted on platforms. Nothing in the rules about ticket offices...

The issue is that flash can distract/dazzle anyone on the lineside and involved in the running of trains so it is not just "not on the platform"

I once let of flassh (some time back), was observed and asked not to do it again, at the same time another individual had a tripod over the yellow line, and on refusal to move it, the police were called

 

[GB]

Isn't that a little pretentious ?

Not at all. Some phones are capable of producing good images but with a tiny sensor and small lens usually just doesn't cut it. Theres are a reason why proper camera equipment can range in the high £100s to £1000s and its not just to make the photographer feel better.

 

[455driver]

Obviously using the 'flash rule' as an excuse to be a jobsworth!

Really!
Try taking a picture (using flash) of the train I am driving as it enters a platform and the next thing your camera will be taking a picture of is your colon!

Flash photography is very distracting when you are not expecting it!

 

[TheEdge]

Not at all. Some phones are capable of producing good images but with a tiny sensor and small lens usually just doesn't cut it. Theres are a reason why proper camera equipment can range in the high £100s to £1000s and its not just to make the photographer feel better.

Give a professional an iPhone and some peripherals and they will produce professional photos meanwhile me and my DSLR produce amateur quality photos.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I would have had no complaint if there had been a sign prohibiting photography, or if the police officers had simply asked me to stop or delete. What I wasn't happy with was being asked for my name and the hardly credible suggestion that by taking photos (on my phone) through a temporary fence in full view of police officers, I was potentially a terrorist.

Just because there isn't a sign doesn't mean a little bit of common sense applied to the situation would tell you its probably not the cleverest thing in the world to do.

We've also got the hiding in plain sight angle to look at. Someone acting so obviously not suspiciously is a good way to do suspicious things. Honestly, I'd rather have the likes of the CNC hassling people who may be doing nothing wrong just to make sure they do find the people who are up to no good.

 

[alexdodds]

At Blackpool North I asked and one member of staff said no (usuall BS about being illegal, security risk etc) whilst another (more senior) member of staff said yes, go ahead.

Whilst I was happily photographing they had an arguement!

That station has had about 12 visits off me in the last 5 years most staff are good but there is the odd one whos not

 

[Islineclear3_1]

To be honest, we don't get a lot of photographers at the Vic (can see why now) so the amount of enthusiast care based knowledge is probably a bit limited. Fair point to raise the issue with the powers that be, however difficult that might have been, as it has been pointed out other AGA stations are photo friendly, so why not there.

If I had realised someone was taking photos, I'd have brushed me hair.

I used to photograph at Vic in the mid 1990's along with Clacton and some stops along the main line when I lived near Ilford. Never had a problem with "Essex".

But often a platform ticket and a polite heads-up to platform staff suffices if you're not intending to travel