Donald Trump and the aftermath of his presidency

[w0033944]

No, I mean from the American Public. They have a right to bear arms. Nuclear Weapons are arms, therefore the 2nd amendment guarantees the right of every Tom, Hick or Billy-Bob to own them.

If it doesn't, then why does it allow them to own M1-Abrams tanks, Surface-Air missiles, 50mm shells, smallpox vials, P90s, M15s, Glocks, etc. Why is there a line?

You've lost me, I'm afraid, as most if not all of the things you list are banned for the American people. The law, as I understand it, already draws a line, hence why they're not allowed tanks, RPGs etc.

 

[miami]

You've lost me, I'm afraid, as most if not all of the things you list are banned for the American people. The law, as I understand it, already draws a line, hence why they're not allowed tanks, RPGs etc.

How can the constitution not allow rpgs, but allow 9mm pistols? I don't see anything in the 2nd amendment about caliber.

 

[Abpj17]

The constitution is a nice idea but is a load of bobbins. For example the second amendment. As an amendment it surely refers to a change to the constitution yet many Americans who love guns do not want it amended because it is in their constitution and it is their right. Surely if the second amendment was an amendment the constitution can be changed?

The problem isn't the constitution - the people who can't see the irony about claiming it's impossible to amend an amendment are.

 

[anme]

Deleted

 

[2392]

Quote:
Originally Posted by fowler9 View Post
Be a racist, send your kids down the mines to work, beat your wife, invade other countries to create an Empire, treat people who work for you however you like with them having no recourse, die because you can't afford treatment. Etc. etc.

Hopefully when we leave the EU we can get back to the good old days.

As for Trump I find it difficult to fathom how your average hard working American voted for him. He is a shining example of too few people having too much of the worlds wealth.
I should pack your bags and head for a Marxist paradise - Oh Wait, there isn't one. There's just people like you scaremongering the rest.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Quote:
Originally Posted by 185 View Post
RIP Planet Earth

1 hour till the big red button is in the hands of a lunatic.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Are you really serious or just quoting the populist liberal belief.

I can see where 185 is coming from. As Now President Chump did remark in the run up to the election: " We've got all these Nuclear Missiles. Why haven't We used any?" Or words to that effect

 

[fowler9]

Thx, but you haven't offended me - to me, it was simply a normal debate! I think it is true that far-right groups often try to (mis)use the banner of patriotism to promote their agenda, which can lead to a misplaced association with 'British values'. That is pretty ironic because generally the agenda of these groups runs completely against what I - and I suspect most people who think about it - would consider to be decent values - especially when it comes to 'tolerance'.

Totally agree.

 

[w0033944]

How can the constitution not allow rpgs, but allow 9mm pistols? I don't see anything in the 2nd amendment about caliber.

That's the point - it was obvious to multiple Congresses and Presidents that, as weapons technology advanced, it would be ridiculous for private citizens to be allowed access to many of them, yet there was (to my knowledge) no outcry in the '20s from American citizens expecting to be able to own the tanks which the US army would have been buying, and moaning that their Second Amendment rights were being infringed as a result of those expectations not being met. I don't think many of the Amendments are taken literally nowadays as the world, and the United States, are almost unrecognisable from how they were in the late 18th century. To me, therefore, the angst at suggestions that semi-automatic weaponry be outlawed is rather ridiculous given that plenty of other new weaponry has been kept out of people's hands without any outcry whatsoever.

 

[Busaholic]

Washington Transit reported three times as many entrances and exits to their Subway in the central area on Saturday (protests day) as against Friday (inauguration day).

 

[jimmyvonk]

, hence why they're not allowed tanks, etc.

Just a quick point, but as far as aware no law to stop private ownership of armour up to and exceeding main battle tanks in either the USA or the UK.
And it would be perfectly legal for them to still have main and secondary armament live subject to correct licences as per law.
In the UK, you need a firearms licence for the main gun on a Sherman, same as a .22 target rifle.

 

[w0033944]

Just a quick point, but as far as aware no law to stop private ownership of armour up to and exceeding main battle tanks in either the USA or the UK.
And it would be perfectly legal for them to still have main and secondary armament live subject to correct licences as per law.
In the UK, you need a firearms licence for the main gun on a Sherman, same as a .22 target rifle.

Fair point; thanks for the clarification. Perhaps the point is that one cannot legally buy live rounds?

 

[furnessvale]

Fair point; thanks for the clarification. Perhaps the point is that one cannot legally buy live rounds?

Yes you can. The difference with the UK is that you have to prove the need for a licence for any section 1 firearm or ammunition, as opposed to the USA which seems to work on proving you are unfit to own such a weapon.

The chances of proving the need to own an army tank with working guns, as opposed to dummies for show, are zero.

Target practice? Pesky rabbits?

 

[DarloRich]

Trump clearly spoke to his supporter base during the inauguration address and made no effort to comply with the convention that these addresses are supposed to bring together the different sides of the political spectrum. It was a grim, angry, populist, nationalistic, isolationist rant that strangely offered several "hostage to fortune" commitments.

My big concern is that he is simply not equipped, intellectually, emotionally or strategically to deal with the job. I do not think he "gets it". If you look at the list of past republican president I think he is the least ready or able to assume the mantle. I also don't think he has advisors around him who will disagree or offer alternative viewpoints when he needs them or will restrain him from his wilder flights of fancy.

I am not sure he understands this isnt a couple of hours, 3 day a week, job. It is 24 hours for 4 years with an almost daily requirement to make decisions following a knock on the door at 3 am as another fan/brown stuff interaction happens somewhere in the world.

How can the constitution not allow rpgs, but allow 9mm pistols? I don't see anything in the 2nd amendment about caliber.

because it is limited and interpreted by statue ( both state and national) and supreme court decisions. An American citizen could, of course, bring a case at the Supreme Court to challenge that interpretation

No he's not, and that kind of statement doesn't help, either the seriousness of mental illness.

Well he is clearly somewhere towards narcissistic personality disorder and egomania, has a very thin skin and an inability to take criticism.

 

[jimmyvonk]

Yes you can. The difference with the UK is that you have to prove the need for a licence for any section 1 firearm or ammunition, as opposed to the USA which seems to work on proving you are unfit to own such a weapon.

The chances of proving the need to own an army tank with working guns, as opposed to dummies for show, are zero.

Target practice? Pesky rabbits?

"Theatrical & Reenactment uses" are valid reasons in the UK, and the reason used for most live private armor, though usually limited to blank rounds due to a limited number of ranges in the UK cleared for larger rounds.... same for artillery & anti-tank guns. (Unless you convert to smooth bore and it's sub 2", then stick as many as you like on a shotgun ticket)

 

[najaB]

How can the constitution not allow rpgs, but allow 9mm pistols? I don't see anything in the 2nd amendment about caliber.

Forgive me jumping into the discussion half-way but I thought I'd raise a couple of points.

First off, you are correct that the 2nd Amendment to the constitution doesn't discriminate the type of armament - so an RPG is a equally covered as a handgun. NBC weapons are prohibited because their constituent parts are prohibited (i.e. you can have a nuclear bomb, but you can't have the plutonium or uranium that makes it go 'bang').

The second point is that, interestingly, the 2nd Amendment isn't about unconstrained gun ownership at all. It says:

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed

Note it is 'keep and bear' not own. And in the context of a well-regulated militia. It seems clear to me that the framers of the Amendment were in favor of gun control.

 

[w0033944]

Yes you can. The difference with the UK is that you have to prove the need for a licence for any section 1 firearm or ammunition, as opposed to the USA which seems to work on proving you are unfit to own such a weapon.

The chances of proving the need to own an army tank with working guns, as opposed to dummies for show, are zero.

Target practice? Pesky rabbits?

Interesting, thanks.

 

[Busaholic]

Listening to a Radio 4 programme tonight on the Hungerford Massacre, which was thirty years ago and the first mass, random shooting in this country, it reminded me that the perpetrator had legal possession of semi-automatic rifles. As a direct result of this tragedy the law was changed in 1988 banning private ownership of such weapons. Happily, the lone wolf gunman with a grudge is still a fairly rare event in the UK, and I am sure our sensible laws (as against the nonsensical American ones) play their part.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

It is interesting to talk to Americans. A lot of gun owners do so, purely because they want to be able to defend themselves and others against the gun toting maniacs.

Because others have easy access to firearms, they need to have one themselves to protect themself. But of course then when one of these people snaps and has a mental breakdown, they have access to firearms and become the maniac themselves.

This is why there is so much resistance to gun law restrictions aside from just the hardcore gun enthusiasts, conspiracy nuts and constitution protectors. People worry that any law will be forced on the law abiding leaving only the criminals with guns.

The only way to really get a change in gun ownership America is by a cultural sea change, not a legal change.

 

[EM2]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...of-patriotic-devotion/?utm_term=.65316aa065b6


Trump names his Inauguration Day a ‘National Day of Patriotic Devotion’

President Trump has officially declared the day of his inauguration a national day of patriotism.

Trump's inaugural address on Friday frequently referred to patriotism as the salve that would heal the country's divisions. “When you open your heart to patriotism, there is no room for prejudice,” Trump said from the steps of the Capitol after being sworn in as president.

Later that day, Trump's press secretary, Sean Spicer, said that naming a national day of patriotism was among the executive actions that Trump took in his first few hours as president.

On Monday, the paperwork was filed with the federal government declaring officially that Jan. 20, 2017 — the day of Trump's inauguration — would officially be known as the “National Day of Patriotic Devotion.”

“Now, therefore, I, Donald J. Trump, president of the United States of America, by virtue of the authority vested in me by the Constitution and the laws of the United States, do hereby proclaim Jan. 20, 2017, as National Day of Patriotic Devotion, in order to strengthen our bonds to each other and to our country — and to renew the duties of government to the people,” the order says.

“Our Constitution is written on parchment, but it lives in the hearts of the American people,” the order continues. “There is no freedom where the people do not believe in it; no law where the people do not follow it; and no peace where the people do not pray for it.”

And people think he's not narcissistic?!

 

[fowler9]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...of-patriotic-devotion/?utm_term=.65316aa065b6


Trump names his Inauguration Day a ‘National Day of Patriotic Devotion’



And people think he's not narcissistic?!

He is nuts.

 

[EM2]

He is nuts.

Kim Jong-Two

 

[miami]

Oh it's sad, it really is

https://twitter.com/obewon2/status/824129716844187648

@realDonaldTrump I voted for you and I am on Obama care as I have no job and the sub I get keeps me with insurance. Will I lose the help?

Democracy really is overrated.

 

[kermit]

BBC News;

President Donald Trump has promised a "major investigation into voter fraud", after making claims about millions of illegal ballots.
The new president said the inquiry would include "those registered to vote in two states, those who are illegal".
Mr Trump also said the probe would focus on "those registered to vote who are dead (and many for a long time)".
He has alleged that up to five million illegal votes were cast for Hillary Clinton, but has offered no proof.
Mrs Clinton, the Democratic candidate, received nearly three million votes more than Mr Trump, who won the presidency by prevailing in so-called swing states.

This is just getting so, so scary.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Also scary:

The rate at which Executive Orders are being issued is rather high for what is supposed to be an urgent last resort emergency procedure isn't it?

 

[Busaholic]

BBC News;

President Donald Trump has promised a "major investigation into voter fraud", after making claims about millions of illegal ballots.
The new president said the inquiry would include "those registered to vote in two states, those who are illegal".
Mr Trump also said the probe would focus on "those registered to vote who are dead (and many for a long time)".
He has alleged that up to five million illegal votes were cast for Hillary Clinton, but has offered no proof.
Mrs Clinton, the Democratic candidate, received nearly three million votes more than Mr Trump, who won the presidency by prevailing in so-called swing states.

This is just getting so, so scary.

A second North Korea being created in front of our eyes. The two dictators even share the same dodgy haircut habit.
'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men sit back and do nothing.' I apologise if that is not a word-perfect quote, I remember it from schooldays fifty years ago and History exams. De Tocqueville?

 

[dgl]

Trump will hopefully soon realise that America is not the world power it thinks it is and that china rules the world now and that countries can go bankrupt just like his businesses.

He will end up annoying a lot of people who shoot first and ask questions later, we just have to hope that we distance ourselves as far away from him as possible.

If I was Angela Merkel or the leader of the EU at the moment I would want a private meeting with trump and set out quite plainly to him that he is an unqualified fool whose values/crazy ideals do not match ours and that if he tries to mess with us or thinks he can get a special trade deal then he is most certainly a deluded fool and that he is now banned indefinitely from all EU countries.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

BBC News;

President Donald Trump has promised a "major investigation into voter fraud", after making claims about millions of illegal ballots.
The new president said the inquiry would include "those registered to vote in two states, those who are illegal".
Mr Trump also said the probe would focus on "those registered to vote who are dead (and many for a long time)".
He has alleged that up to five million illegal votes were cast for Hillary Clinton, but has offered no proof.
Mrs Clinton, the Democratic candidate, received nearly three million votes more than Mr Trump, who won the presidency by prevailing in so-called swing states.

This is just getting so, so scary.

This is the weirdest yet. He won the election legally by America's process and no-one is really arguing that. After all, both sides had the same goals to play to. But he seems so distraught at the fact he lost the "popular vote" he is desperate to try and counter these accusations.

He seems completely unaware that by suggesting the election was completely rigged, he is completely undermining his own victory - afterall if the democrats can rig votes, why not the Republicans?

I would like to say that when he is proven wrong here it could undermine his position and make it untenable, but he seems to be made of Teflon and nothing he says or does will dampen the love of his followers - indeed the worse things he does, the more they seem to love him.

 

[Busaholic]

He seems completely unaware that by suggesting the election was completely rigged, he is completely undermining his own victory - afterall if the democrats can rig votes, why not the Republicans?

Or the Russians, by proxy.

 

[EM2]

This is the weirdest yet. He won the election legally by America's process and no-one is really arguing that. After all, both sides had the same goals to play to. But he seems so distraught at the fact he lost the "popular vote" he is desperate to try and counter these accusations.

He's all about ratings. He can't bear the fact that he might not have got the biggest number. He's already tweeted about how 'massive' the audience for his inauguration was (although it wasn't).
It'll be interesting to see his approval ratings in a couple of months and how he spins that.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

Oh it's sad, it really is


https://twitter.com/obewon2/status/824129716844187648

Democracy really is overrated.

There was a great one where someone was arrogantly saying how glad they were to be free of Obamacare thanks to Trump, to which someone said it was nice to be well off enough to afford their own insurance and they replied that they were not rich, their insurance was under the ACA.

(The Affordable Care Act - or what many dub Obamacare)

They were so hyped up by Trump's propaganda that they voted him in, to remove the act that actually provides their affordable insurance...

 

[Tim R-T-C]

He's all about ratings. He can't bear the fact that he might not have got the biggest number. He's already tweeted about how 'massive' the audience for his inauguration was (although it wasn't).
It'll be interesting to see his approval ratings in a couple of months and how he spins that.

Actually released by the White House today:

Description - a press release containing a list of approving quotes from the media about the first days of Trumps regime, like you might find promoting a film or stage play.