Driving train while on a mobile - is this allowed?

[gazthomas]

I've done a search and can't find a previous thread, so here goes!

This afternoon a 66 passed me on a container service. The driver had both hands away from the driving desk (fine I guess) and he was having a conversation on a mobile phone doing around 50-60 Mph.

What does the rule book say?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I am certain it is not allowed under any circumstances on a passenger trains, I assume it is the same for freight drivers too. Are you 100% sure he was on a mobile?

 

[district]

Strictly prohibited on passenger traffic, would imagine same on frieght?

 

[hairyhandedfool]

I'm not certain it is in the rulebook, but certainly when I worked for Thameslink, company policy was that drivers could use their mobiles in the cab in an emergency (to contact the signalman for example) if they were unable to get out of the cab for any reason, but never while actually driving.

 

[gazthomas]

I am certain it is not allowed under any circumstances on a passenger trains, I assume it is the same for freight drivers too. Are you 100% sure he was on a mobile?

Absolutely. I've just zoomed up a photo I took, a bit dark but a phone looks like it is against an ear. I will PM you a link to the photo

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Couldn't be a train radio could it? Maybe he passed a trespasser ½ a mile back and was reporting it?

 

[313103]

All staff carrying out safety Critical duties are forbidden to use Mobile phones EXCEPT in a emergency.

Drivers in my company are told to have their phones on silent or switched off if the phone does not have that facility.

Conductors are not allowed to use phones whilst doing dispatch duties, and if you receive a call whilst doing these duties you are to ignore it.

Any safety Critical member of staff seen using a mobile phone whilst carrying out said duties will be disciplined under the company's own Mobile Phone policy, of which any staff who receives a company phone has to sign for.

Staff in my company who have been caught using a mobile phone have been disciplined.

 

[ANorthernGuard]

All staff carrying out safety Critical duties are forbidden to use Mobile phones EXCEPT in a emergency.

Drivers in my company are told to have their phones on silent or switched off if the phone does not have that facility.

Conductors are not allowed to use phones whilst doing dispatch duties, and if you receive a call whilst doing these duties you are to ignore it.

Any safety Critical member of staff seen using a mobile phone whilst carrying out said duties will be disciplined under the company's own Mobile Phone policy, of which any staff who receives a company phone has to sign for.

Staff in my company who have been caught using a mobile phone have been disciplined.

Pretty much the same for all TOC's its a BIG No No and the person doing it can easily be dismissed.

 

[Harlesden]

Apologies for the mild drift, but I was thinking how far we'd come technology wise. A driving desk? Both hands away from the driving desk and the train is still moving?

 

[GB]

Use of mobile phones is catered for in the company policy and as far as I know all freight companies forbid the use of mobile phones while the train is in motion.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Apologies for the mild drift, but I was thinking how far we'd come technology wise. A driving desk? Both hands away from the driving desk and the train is still moving?

With a class 66 you don't even need to be in the drivers seat providing the secondman hold over DSD button is depressed, though you are limited to 60 seconds.

 

[Rugd1022]

Apologies for the mild drift, but I was thinking how far we'd come technology wise. A driving desk? Both hands away from the driving desk and the train is still moving?

We don't need to have our hands physically on the controls all of the time, we'd end up with cramp or arthritis if we did that! You just adopt driving a position which is the most comfortable for you... it all depends on the layout of the controls but sometimes I'll have one had resting on the auto brake and other on the arm of the chair, anyway they're within easy reach should any emergency action be required.

We are allowed to use mobiles in emergencies if the back to back radios we normally use for shunting are out of action for whatever reason.

 

[Beveridges]

Even as a Depot Driver (5MPH MAX SPEED on sidings) you can not use a mobile. In fact even if you sit in a cab of a train that is not moving,with the Driving key out, and play with your mobile, it is grounds for immediate dismissal!!!!
Now thats a 100-300 tonne empty passenger train, sat on a siding with a key out, that has no chance of moving. I would imagine using one while in control of a moving freight train, that can be up to 3,500 tonnes, and move at over 50mph, is a trillion times more dangerous, so there is no way I can see it being allowed!!

 

[Rugd1022]

See my post #11... occasionally (very occasionally) we have no choice but to use a mobile if the radios pack up, when you need to clear a running line it's the only way to do it if the driver and shunter cannot see each other during the move. The replacement set of radios (and charger) could be many miles away ;o)

 

[E16 Cyclist]

It could for example be the cab secure radio (CSR) , i've in the past had the signaller call me up whilst on the move and you can't exactly ignore it as it may well be important.

And the handset for the CSR could be mistaken for a phone

 

[ralphchadkirk]

CSR/GSMR/NRN must be allowed whilst on the move at the driver's discretion?

 

[DXMachina]

I saw a met line train last weekend at Moor Park* in which the driver was chatting on an iPhone while braking to a halt at the station.

Oddly it never occurred to me not to get into his train. I see why its banned but the thing is scarcely going to derail or crash into another if the driver's a bit distracted.

*not saying what time or day so nothing can come of this

 

[hairyhandedfool]

If you want to know what *could* happen if a driver was sufficiantly distracted, look up the accident at Purley (1989 I think).

The accident wasn't related to a distraction but it does show what can happen in a short amount of time.

 

[ANorthernGuard]

I saw a met line train last weekend at Moor Park* in which the driver was chatting on an iPhone while braking to a halt at the station.

Oddly it never occurred to me not to get into his train. I see why its banned but the thing is scarcely going to derail or crash into another if the driver's a bit distracted.

*not saying what time or day so nothing can come of this

like anything, distraction can be Fatal what if the driver was on the phone and misjudged his braking, what if he went through a red at a major junction? so many things can happen thats why they get paid the big bucks (and a good bit of negotiation from ASLE&F)

 

[Tav77]

Absolutely. I've just zoomed up a photo I took, a bit dark but a phone looks like it is against an ear. I will PM you a link to the photo

Stick it on You Tube, lets have a 54 page discussion on the rights and wrongs, all disagree with each other, then watch the driver lose their job

I'll get me coat

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Stick it on You Tube, lets have a 54 page discussion on the rights and wrongs, all disagree with each other, then watch the driver lose their job

I'll get me coat

I'll hand it to you

 

[150222]

I saw a virgin crosscountry driver zoom through Canley station while on a mobile. I never gave it a second thought as I assumed he was talking to control. Have also seen a driver send a text while waiting to depart a station. (Won't say which one).

 

[eMeS]

...and I've been driven across London from Euston to the Tower Bridge area in a Hackney Cab with the driver reading the newspaper on his lap.

 

[GB]

If you want to know what *could* happen if a driver was sufficiantly distracted, look up the accident at Purley (1989 I think).

The accident wasn't related to a distraction but it does show what can happen in a short amount of time.

Or even better look up the Chatsworth CA accident which is the actual reason why we now have a mobile phone policy.

 

[TDK]

Even as a Depot Driver (5MPH MAX SPEED on sidings) you can not use a mobile. In fact even if you sit in a cab of a train that is not moving,with the Driving key out, and play with your mobile, it is grounds for immediate dismissal!!!!
!

Where did you get that from? If you are in a driving cab and the train is not moving you will not be dismissed!! Unless of course it is within your company policy - if it is I am certainly glad I don't work for them.

For the rest of you for a driver to be dismissed for mobile phone use you will need solid evidence and that can be obtained from phone records. If I saw something dangerous that needed immediate reporting to the signaller I would certainly use my mobile phone if the NRN was not working after I had brought my train to a stand and I certainly wouldn't get out the cab to do it either as these seconds could mean the difference between life and death

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Where did you get that from? If you are in a driving cab and the train is not moving you will not be dismissed!! Unless of course it is within your company policy - if it is I am certainly glad I don't work for them

If the key is in (afaik) you can, like what said previously every TOC is different

 

[TDK]

If the key is in (afaik) you can, like what said previously every TOC is different

I still feel that dismissal is harsh - if a truck driver or a bus driver is caught on the mobile it's a fine and 3 points isn't it?

 

[ANorthernGuard]

I still feel that dismissal is harsh - if a truck driver or a bus driver is caught on the mobile it's a fine and 3 points isn't it?

but a truck or bus worse case (within reason can wipe out maybe 20 people, a train how many hundred?)

 

[TDK]

CSR/GSMR/NRN must be allowed whilst on the move at the driver's discretion?

Yes, I think the policy is only use said equipment if you are sure it will not affect the safety of the train

 

[Schnellzug]

Even as a Depot Driver (5MPH MAX SPEED on sidings) you can not use a mobile. In fact even if you sit in a cab of a train that is not moving,with the Driving key out, and play with your mobile, it is grounds for immediate dismissal!!!!

That seems wildly disproportionate. Have the Unions been emasculated to that extent that they'd tolerate that?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If you want to know what *could* happen if a driver was sufficiantly distracted, look up the accident at Purley (1989 I think).

The accident wasn't related to a distraction but it does show what can happen in a short amount of time.

Or what about this one? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Chatsworth_train_collision

 

[spacehopper]

Well most TOCs have a "personal / mobile communications device" policy which you read, sign and abide by. Even if you slip up briefly the once you will be out the door.

Banned for not only dispatching or doing the doors but you shouldn't be using your phone full stop once you are on the platform / station environment and TRTS has been pressed.

Drivers- once out of messroom it must be switched off, can't text / call sat in the cab or walking to your train. Signallers often ask the driver for a mobile number. Big no on our TOC if you give out a mobile number to signaller.

When we get called up the caller is supposed to say "is it safe to talk".