EC First Class Mark 3 (125) v Mark 4 (225) carriage

[errata]

Hi all,

I shall shortly be moving to Scotland and travelling to London every other weekend.

I am about to book my first few sets of tickets with East Coast for first class travel. Does anyone know what the difference is between first class carriage in the Mark 3 carriages on the Intercity 125s versus the Mark 4 carriages on the 225s?

I am a great fan of the Mark 3s and love the oversized seating in first class; but have never travelled on a Mark 4 service. I know that on some East Coast services, particularly the ones to Aberdeen, I am guaranteed a Mark 3. Is there much between them?

Thanks in advance for your responses.

 

[ainsworth74]

There is almost literally no difference between them. There is a slightly different layout on the Mark 4 as there is a large area in the middle of the carriage for trolleys and people to pass each other, but in terms of seating style they are identical.

To get an idea of the different layouts you can find the Mark 4 seating plan here and the Mark 3 plan here.

 

[Max]

In First Class, from experience, there is very little difference internally. The only thing I can think of off-hand is that the MK4 carriages are likely to feel a little bit more 'worn' as they were refurbished a while ago now.

 

[errata]

Thanks, so would you say EC first class is in general better than Virgin? I will be travelling from Stirling so there is not much difference in travelling to GLC or EDB.

 

[ainsworth74]

Interior wise I prefer the both the EC trains layouts over the VT layouts so would pick EC in that regard. In terms of catering it depends what time you're travelling. Both are complementary now so nothing in it there. Both breakfast offerings are good though if your getting a Voyager (VT to Birmingham) then EC's is better. During the day I would also say they're about the same with EC probably edging it in my opinion. However on an evening VT's services to London will offer a far better meal than is offered on EC (but again Voyager's to Birmingham won't be as good).

So on the whole probably best bet is EC but if your travelling south on an evening pick VT as they offer a proper evening meal which EC don't (though they do offer evening meals northbound from Kings Cross).

 

[route:oxford]

Thanks, so would you say EC first class is in general better than Virgin? I will be travelling from Stirling so there is not much difference in travelling to GLC or EDB.

There is one major difference...

There are usually 3 trains an hour between Glasgow & Stirling and only 2 trains an hour between Edinburgh & Stirling.

More importantly, there are still 2 trains an hour until the last servce at 23:48 from Glasgow whereas Edinburgh-Stirling goes hourly at 20:30.

It's also a step-free walk between Queen Street & Central - which means it's easier to negotiate a wheeled case between the two stations instead of up and down the busy & narrow stairs at Waverley

Don't forget, Stirling enjoys 2 direct services to London per day. The Highland Chieftan at 10:30(ish) and the Sleeper.

 

[jopsuk]

You don't always have to go over the bridge at Waverly, and there are lifts. Changing at Waverly is a damn sight less hassle than walking between Queen Street and Central, suggesting otherwise is preposterous.

 

[route:oxford]

You don't always have to go over the bridge at Waverly, and there are lifts. Changing at Waverly is a damn sight less hassle than walking between Queen Street and Central, suggesting otherwise is preposterous.

It's no hassle changing at Weegieland. A brisk 4 minute walk between the stations.

And you are right, you don't *always* have to use the overbridge. Just usually.

I suppose it all depends on what the OP wants when he arrives at the Scottish Terminus...

Just miss the Dunblane at Edinburgh? Thats a 59 minute wait until the next one then 55 minutes until back at Stirling.

Just miss the Aberdeen/Inverness/Perth/Dunblane/Alloa at Glasgow, then just around half an hour to the next one and between 25&40 minutes until back in Stirling.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I must say that I find the comfort and peace in 1st on EC more enjoyable due to the physical space that they provide. Yes, ainsworth74 is correct in identifying the wide 'dance floor' space in the middle of the MkIV's but due to the fact that loadings in 1st are generally light, then I always choose to sit a t a table for 4 knowing that I'll be the only occupant for the entire journey. (Actually, I'm usually the only occupant of the 4 plus the 2 on the other side!).

But be warned, the booking system on EC puts all/most pax on ADV in coach M. There's usually lots of people cramed in there, far from the kitchen. My advice is to sit in K next to the kitchen. Usually with about 3 other passengers and first served from the kitchen!

 

[ainsworth74]

Yes, ainsworth74 is correct in identifying the wide 'dance floor' space in the middle of the MkIV's

Never heard to it referred to as a 'dance floor' brilliant name for it

But be warned, the booking system on EC puts all/most pax on ADV in coach M.

I've fallen foul of that a few times myself in the past, however the new manual seat selection of EC seems to up and working now (at first it didn't actually change your seat even if you selected a different one!) so it should be possible to avoid M altogether as you can specify a seat wherever you like now.

 

[sprinterguy]

I've fallen foul of that a few times myself in the past, however the new manual seat selection of EC seems to up and working now (at first it didn't actually change your seat even if you selected a different one!) so it should be possible to avoid M altogether as you can specify a seat wherever you like now.

The EC seat selection system wasn't working for me about a fortnight ago when I booked a first class ticket for travel later this month, I had exactly the same problem as you have had.

 

[ainsworth74]

Hmm interesting, it worked for me four or five weeks ago for a journey I'm undertaking next week.

 

[sprinterguy]

Hmm interesting, it worked for me four or five weeks ago for a journey I'm undertaking next week.

I must have picked one of its' off days!