Edinburgh Gateway - A White Elephant ?

Butts

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Has anyone got any passenger numbers for this location ?

I only ask as on four recent journeys to and from the Airport on the Tram I have seen very few if any passengers alighting or boarding on either side.
 
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najaB

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Has anyone got any passenger numbers for this location ?

I only ask as on four recent journeys to and from the Airport on the Tram I have seen very few if any passengers alighting or boarding on either side.
I think because it opened mid-timetable period in the middle of winter and hasn't had much publicity. If I was Scotrail I would have a big(ish) publicity blitz for the Easter and summer holiday periods.
 

Butts

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I think because it opened mid-timetable period in the middle of winter and hasn't had much publicity. If I was Scotrail I would have a big(ish) publicity blitz for the Easter and summer holiday periods.
I don't know how much it cost but as you could already change onto the Tram at Edinburgh Park I can't really see the point of it !!
 

TheEscapist_

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I got off there in the evening peak and it was reasonably busy more people that I was expecting to be honest. I think najaB is right and SR should advertise this for the holidays.


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NotATrainspott

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Most of the employment growth in Edinburgh is forecast to be in the west at the various new developments and business parks around the Gateway. As such, saying that it's a white elephant is somewhat premature. The combination of the Gateway and Park stations will mean that all commuters from the north and west will be able to get to work without a silly double-back via Haymarket, which would add enough time to the journey to make rail uncompetitive. That's particularly problematic when all of these offices are going to be just off the motorway and trunk road network.
 

Romilly

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I agree with najaB. It also considerably improves transport links to/from destinations in Fife (e.g. St Andrews for international students, tourists & golfers).

There are through train/tram tickets between the Airport and stations in Fife via Gateway (from the Scotrail website or ticket offices), although for railcard users a combination of separate train and tram tickets often seems to work out cheaper.
 

shotts56

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The combination of the Gateway and Park stations will mean that all commuters from the north and west will be able to get to work without a silly double-back via Haymarket
Doesn't save the problem for all. Most of Lanarkshire (ie those coming on the Motherwell/Wishaw/Carstairs or the Bellshill/Shotts lines) go into Edinburgh through Wester Hailes, meaning the first opportunity to get to Edinburgh Park or surrounding areas is to go into Haymarket and then double-back back out.

Did it for 10 years, and it was one of the main reasons I quit Edinburgh Park and got a job back in Glasgow. The double-back was such a colossal waste of time, and added an hour a day to my commute.
 

47271

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I had a bit of a rant about Gateway in another thread the other day. Here it is again.

I found the tram link excellent, it took me all of four minutes or so to reach the station from the airport. No bother buying my ticket from a very pleasant office, and I was on an Inverness train in less than ten minutes.

But it cost me a truly ridiculous £5.50 to go three stops on the tram. Not only that, but all of three other people entered the station with me. The enormous concourse was deserted and noone else was buying tickets, and this was all at about 530pm.

I know that through tickets are available but how do I buy one at the airport? Maybe I walked straight past a rail ticket machine but I don't think so.

It looks to me like nobody knows about the place, and even when they do they get hammered by a tram fare that can only discourage use.

I'm sure they will get a grip, but it certainly felt a bit like a white elephant when I was there the other day.
 
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Blindtraveler

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Nowhere near enough to a Pacer :(
I have also just discovered that if theres 2 or more punters a taxi from gateway to the airport is cheeper. I knew this was the case from the the Edinburgh park area but thought Gateway would not be afflicted by this.
A8 1, Tram, 0! IMO the tran is the elifant in the room here!
 

najaB

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I know that through tickets are available but how do I buy one at the airport? Maybe I walked straight past a rail ticket machine but I don't think so.
You did. It's in the domestic baggage claim area (or at least it used to be).
 

47271

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You did. It's in the domestic baggage claim area (or at least it used to be).
Thanks, well that's a start I suppose but they really need one by the tram ticket machines. That's where you need the ticket!
 

clc

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Sounds like there's plenty of spare capacity but long term employment growth in the area and Glasgow and Dunblane services eventually diverting via Gateway should make a dent in it.
 

najaB

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Thanks, well that's a start I suppose but they really need one by the tram ticket machines. That's where you need the ticket!
They really should move it. It was put where it is before the tram existed and it made sense as it was on the way to the buses.
 

NotATrainspott

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Doesn't save the problem for all. Most of Lanarkshire (ie those coming on the Motherwell/Wishaw/Carstairs or the Bellshill/Shotts lines) go into Edinburgh through Wester Hailes, meaning the first opportunity to get to Edinburgh Park or surrounding areas is to go into Haymarket and then double-back back out.

Did it for 10 years, and it was one of the main reasons I quit Edinburgh Park and got a job back in Glasgow. The double-back was such a colossal waste of time, and added an hour a day to my commute.
I'm aware. It does solve the problem for everyone coming from the Fife direction, which is ideal given the constraints of the M90 and the bridges.

A cheap solution would be to set up a shuttle bus from Curriehill to the airport via the university campus. I'm aware that in some of the original concepts for the tram network a branch down towards Heriott-Watt was considered, and in the long term it may make sense. The justification for running tram lines over the Forth Road Bridge is that there is limited heavy rail capacity available for the short-distance passengers from southern Fife to these western Edinburgh employment sites. While a tram would be a waste of time for getting to Haymarket and beyond, it would be more than competitive on Dunfermline-Gogar runs. Since demand for trams from Fife would drop off completely after this area it would make sense to turn them back just beyond Edinburgh Park. If a branch were built to Heriott-Watt it could act as a terminus for both trams from the city centre and from Fife, thus giving it links to both the central and western Edinburgh employment areas.
 

Butts

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I'm aware. It does solve the problem for everyone coming from the Fife direction, which is ideal given the constraints of the M90 and the bridges.

A cheap solution would be to set up a shuttle bus from Curriehill to the airport via the university campus. I'm aware that in some of the original concepts for the tram network a branch down towards Heriott-Watt was considered, and in the long term it may make sense. The justification for running tram lines over the Forth Road Bridge is that there is limited heavy rail capacity available for the short-distance passengers from southern Fife to these western Edinburgh employment sites. While a tram would be a waste of time for getting to Haymarket and beyond, it would be more than competitive on Dunfermline-Gogar runs. Since demand for trams from Fife would drop off completely after this area it would make sense to turn them back just beyond Edinburgh Park. If a branch were built to Heriott-Watt it could act as a terminus for both trams from the city centre and from Fife, thus giving it links to both the central and western Edinburgh employment areas.
When I lived in Fife I used to get the 747 Direct from Ferrytoll far easier than farting about at Gateway. Also free Parking. It also went from Inverkeithing Station for Train users and now Halbeath is another option as well.
 

railjock

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If the chord to allow some trains from the west to use it is ever built then it will become much more viable. At present it is overengineered and underused though.
 

najaB

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When I lived in Fife I used to get the 747 Direct from Ferrytoll far easier than farting about at Gateway. Also free Parking. It also went from Inverkeithing Station for Train users and now Halbeath is another option as well.
The issue with the 747 is the variability of the bridge traffic. Plus a lot of the Aberdeen trains don't call at Inverkeithing any more.
 

R4_GRN

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Inverkeithing only allow parking for a week, it is unlimited at Halbeath. Open 24 hours although not manned between about 01:00 til 05:00 use it all the time, car is safe monitored by cameras.

Bus pass if you are eligible to station otherwise a fiver single, service every 20 minutes Fife Council really got this right, good service hardly worth considering parking at airport due to cost.
 

Agent_c

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I know that through tickets are available but how do I buy one at the airport? Maybe I walked straight past a rail ticket machine but I don't think so..
I saw one today in the baggage claim area, offering combined train and tram/bus tickets.

Edit: I see i wasn't the only one.
 

kylemore

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If they, meaning Scotrail, Lothian Buses/Trams/Transport for Edinburgh, Citylink and Stagecoach cared we'd have a travel desk including full rail booking functionality, bus and coach tickets, smart cards and journey planning.
So an infrastructure investment of 10s of £Millions is spoiled by lack of attention to detail ie. somewhere to buy a bloody ticket at the airport!

It is the Scottish way after all:lol:
 

najaB

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So an infrastructure investment of 10s of £Millions is spoiled by lack of attention to detail ie. somewhere to buy a bloody ticket at the airport!
As has been posted twice now in this thread, there *is* somewhere to buy your ticket, it's just not the most obvious location.
 

kylemore

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As has been posted twice now in this thread, there *is* somewhere to buy your ticket, it's just not the most obvious location.
Yes I did read that - however the point is if it's missed by Rail "savvy" people, the type of people who post on here, it might as well not be there!
 

Starmill

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Its funny St Andrews was mentioned - there is no fare from Edinburgh Airport (Bus/Tram) to St Andrews (Bus).

There is a fare to Leuchars, which is a touch pricey at £26.10 for the cheapest return (more than from Edinburgh Waverley) and then bus fare would have to be paid on top of that. I'm not sensing how this is particularly competitive or attractive. And this is after you've found the ticket machine in the Airport.

From the Airport to Dundee it's very amusing that the Via Inverkeithing fare is £3 cheaper than the Any Permitted. Going via Edinburgh Gateway is still going via Inverkeithing...

And nobody with a railcard, it seems, is judged worthy of a through fare. Even though its perfectly possible to just discount the rail part of the journey and add the tram supplement at full price.
 
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Blindtraveler

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Nowhere near enough to a Pacer :(
Its not, given you can get onto the 747 bus, change at Halbeath onto a modern coach with leather seats, charge points and I think pay only once. If wishing to use rail you have to get on the tram, megociate lifts/escalaters and barriers to change and bord a 170 at Gateway and remember to have change for the bus when you reach Loochers. No brainer to me.

On the ticketing machine vs anything else debate I agree with Kylemore that it s not ideal and if your newly arrived, not confident or sure of what your doing and maybe dont speek much English what use is a machine?
 

Butts

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Its funny St Andrews was mentioned - there is no fare from Edinburgh Airport (Bus/Tram) to St Andrews (Bus).

There is a fare to Leuchars, which is a touch pricey at £26.10 for the cheapest return (more than from Edinburgh Waverley) and then bus fare would have to be paid on top of that. I'm not sensing how this is particularly competitive or attractive. And this is after you've found the ticket machine in the Airport.
Before Gateway opened there used to be a thru fare from Falkirk Stations to Edinburgh Airport via EDP/ Tram/Airlink which was roughly the two single fares with a little bit deducted.

However on enquiring recently this has crazily disappeared and been replaced by some £15 odd ticket via Haymarket which costs more than the two single tickets. :idea:
 

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