Flailing and horns - what gives?

[Temple Meads]

Some young spotters at Northallerton doing this were kicked off the station a few years back, mainly due to the fact they were standing right on the edge of the platform when trains travelling at high speed were passing through. IIRC one GC HST had to slam on the brakes as it was getting far too dangerous.

I think I know the ones, total prats.

Could be worse, as I pulled out of London Bridge last night, of the 4 spotters, two were liying prone on the floor. Bizzare

The only reasonable suggestion I can make is that they were trying to get a picture of both the train and the Shard?

 

[rmt4ever]

Lmao I just googled flailing train on youtube, the world has gone mad!!!!!!

 

[TDK]

There is no law against wearing a high vis jacket.

Maybe there should be when the railway is concerned as there is so much cable theft these days, I feel that only railway personnel should wear HV when required in their duties and not train spotters trying to get a video of a train soundingg the horn

 

[Monty]

Maybe there should be when the railway is concerned as there is so much cable theft these days, I feel that only railway personnel should wear HV when required in their duties and not train spotters trying to get a video of a train soundingg the horn

Quite, people have no business wearing safety clothing on the railway unless they have legitimate reason for doing so, and I'm sorry 'photting' is not one of them.

 

[Harbon 1]

While filming if I get a tone I do, if I don't I don't. It doesn't bother me either way. Some drivers pulling away from a station have done because they can see I'm filming them. If they don't want to there's no love lost. I wouldn't make myself look a prat for a horn.

Photting on the other hand, que numerous confused faces as I leg it down the platform to get a good picture

 

[Crundles]

Well, I suppose if you're really desperate you could try giving a driver the fingers; you might at least get a honk of anger.

 

[Trog]

Just a thought for our driving friends, these people are your fan club.

What does such a fan club say about you?

 

[Goatboy]

Quite, people have no business wearing safety clothing on the railway unless they have legitimate reason for doing so, and I'm sorry 'photting' is not one of them.

People can, unfortunately, wear whatever they chose (Unless it is covered by existing legislation, ie they cannot wear nothing nor can they wear a police officers uniform). There are many 'legitimate' reasons (not that one is required) for wearing high vis clothing - from people who cycle down to people returning home from work on a site who havn't bothered to take it off.

You do not have some sort of exclusive rights on the wearing of high vis clothing, so saying they have 'no business' wearing it is completely wrong and is not really any different to saying people have 'no business' wearing a type of hat you dislike or perhaps a hoody.

 

[TDK]

People can, unfortunately, wear whatever they chose (Unless it is covered by existing legislation, ie they cannot wear nothing nor can they wear a police officers uniform). There are many 'legitimate' reasons (not that one is required) for wearing high vis clothing - from people who cycle down to people returning home from work on a site who havn't bothered to take it off.

You do not have some sort of exclusive rights on the wearing of high vis clothing, so saying they have 'no business' wearing it is completely wrong and is not really any different to saying people have 'no business' wearing a type of hat you dislike or perhaps a hoody.

However but what you describe has a valid reason, train spotting doesn't

 

[DarloRich]

People can, unfortunately, wear whatever they chose (Unless it is covered by existing legislation, ie they cannot wear nothing nor can they wear a police officers uniform). There are many 'legitimate' reasons (not that one is required) for wearing high vis clothing - from people who cycle down to people returning home from work on a site who havn't bothered to take it off.

You do not have some sort of exclusive rights on the wearing of high vis clothing, so saying they have 'no business' wearing it is completely wrong and is not really any different to saying people have 'no business' wearing a type of hat you dislike or perhaps a hoody.

There is no business wearing hi visibility clothing, particularly orange high visibility clothing, in a railway environment unless there is a legitimate employment based reason for doing so.

If you do not have a legitimate employment based reason then you must remove it. It is quite simple really, yet the spotters, especially those who consider themselves to be the uber spotter, can't mange this simple rule.

 

[TDK]

It is quite simple really, yet the spotters, especially those who consider themselves to be the uber spotter, can't mange this simple rule.

Amongst many other rules such as trespassing, hanging out of windows. To be fair most of them are responsible people however most of the UK population are sensible and nobody hears about them but get someone who commits a bad crime and everybody knows them, from a drivers point of view and I can only vouch for myself, when I see spotters doing wrong I just think get the lot of them off the premises. It's down to you guys, enthusiasts to turn this round not the staff.

 

[Goatboy]

There is no business wearing hi visibility clothing, particularly orange high visibility clothing, in a railway environment unless there is a legitimate employment based reason for doing so.

If you do not have a legitimate employment based reason then you must remove it. It is quite simple really, yet the spotters, especially those who consider themselves to be the uber spotter, can't mange this simple rule.

Which law does wearing an orange vest spotting trains contravene?

I agree with you that such people are tiresome and irritating however they are breaking no law doing it. Being annoying is not illegal.

An orange vest does not enjoy the legal protection a police officers uniform does.

 

[D1009]

There is no business wearing hi visibility clothing, particularly orange high visibility clothing, in a railway environment unless there is a legitimate employment based reason for doing so.

If you do not have a legitimate employment based reason then you must remove it. It is quite simple really, yet the spotters, especially those who consider themselves to be the uber spotter, can't mange this simple rule.

Except that it isn't a rule, even if you think it should be. I think many people who wear hi-vis clothing imagine it gives them a sense of authority, I'm thinking security guards etc, and they don't like it when they see people who they consider not entitled to wear it. Pathetic if you ask me.

 

[Oswyntail]

There is no business wearing hi visibility clothing, particularly orange high visibility clothing, in a railway environment unless there is a legitimate employment based reason for doing so.....

The purpose of HV clothing is to be seen - it is not a uniform of a particular type of employment. If you are in a position where people might not be expecting to see you, and there is a safety implication, it is reasonable to wear HV clothing. Being on a platform end might conceivably be such a situation, so HV clothing is reasonable.
What HV clothing does not do is give anyone the right to breach safety regulations, be anywhere they are not entitled to be, or pretend they have authority or expertise they do not have..

 

[Tomnick]

I don't buy that argument at all. Anyone acting sensibly in a public area on a station shouldn't need to be seen by approaching trains. Indeed, it might just introduce confusion as a driver could, justifiably, then expect a proper acknowledgment if he sounds his horn.

 

[Morden Via CHX]

I'd certainly agree that wearing a Hi-Vis is completely inappropriate for the sole purpose of trainspotting. At best it is childish attention seeking, at worst it could prove a distraction to the driver if the person is situated in a position where the driver may feel he is there for a reason.

The problem is, if you decide you want to ban people wearing Hi-Vis whilst on railway property, how can you police it? I can't see many conductors willing to ask people maybe returning from work to remove their HV clothing without being told to get lost or most likely something slightly ruder. Similarly, station staff have probably got better things to do than to ask people to remove the offending items.

 

[Gwenllian2001]

The problem is, if you decide you want to ban people wearing Hi-Vis whilst on railway property, how can you police it? I can't see many conductors willing to ask people maybe returning from work to remove their HV clothing without being told to get lost or most likely something slightly ruder. Similarly, station staff have probably got better things to do than to ask people to remove the offending items.

I regularly see council staff wearing what appears, at first glance, to be NR Hi-Vis clothing travelling on my local trains. No one gives them a second glance, so where is the problem?

 

[Morden Via CHX]

I regularly see council staff wearing what appears, at first glance, to be NR Hi-Vis clothing travelling on my local trains. No one gives them a second glance, so where is the problem?

There isn't a problem with that, that's the point; suggestions of "HV should be banned" aren't really practical.

 

[FGW_DID]

It may not be a law but it is in the ATOC / BTP guidelines for enthusiasts:

Avoid wearing anything which is similar in colour to safety clothing, such as high -visibility jackets, as this could cause confusion to drivers or other railway employees.

This thread is concerned with the idiots who stand on the platform edge or wander down to the bottom of the ramp to get a better shot not those who might be catching the train home or to work and wearing a HV jacket but as usual there are some who have to take the arguement to the extreme.

 

[Lockwood]

My mind has just leapt to postmen who are spotters.
They have a "legitimate" reason for having an orange hivis, muddying the waters nicely.

 

[Bullfield WEst]

Hadn't seen that before, absolutely hilarious

Comments are disabled for this video. Not surprised

 

[315804]

It may not be a law but it is in the ATOC / BTP guidelines for enthusiasts:



This thread is concerned with the idiots who stand on the platform edge or wander down to the bottom of the ramp to get a better shot not those who might be catching the train home or to work and wearing a HV jacket but as usual there are some who have to take the arguement to the extreme.

I'm not a spotter (or flailer) though for some stations, I am required to wear my HV jacket (even just to fix a Swecoin machine :roll

I rarely see any spotters (I guess the Facebook generation has no time for this) when I'm out and about on my duties...

 

[BestWestern]

What this illustrates nicely is how an orange hi viz has become essentially a 'go anywhere' pass on the railway. Even with Transec and the endless reminders about security from just about every source possible, the reality is that most of us don't take a second look at an orange vest, unless there is something obviously dodgy about it. Even the standing rule that anybody working lineside must have NR or their contractor's logo on seems to be disregared at times; only the other day I saw a fella on a big project site with his employer's name (I'd never heard of them incidentally) written on the back with a marker pen! Perhaps it's time the railway looked at issuing something more distinctive so that legitimate bodies are instantly identifiable?!

 

[Beveridges]

This arm gesturing and spotters wearing HiVi or even viz orange jackets just to get a blow of a train horn really need to get a life. Most railway staff look on them as planks and idiots

Most railway staff look at spotters as planks and idiots even when they aren't doing anything stupid. But the 'extreme' types don't help the overall image of spotters and the more normal ones end up getting tarred with the same brush as the idiots.

 

[GatwickDepress]

I don't even understand what's so special about videoing a horn. Is it the trainspotting equivalent of the money shot?

Give me a Platform 5 book and a biro anyday. At least with the traditional means, the emphasis is on sad, not t***!

 

[TDK]

Except that it isn't a rule, even if you think it should be. I think many people who wear hi-vis clothing imagine it gives them a sense of authority, I'm thinking security guards etc, and they don't like it when they see people who they consider not entitled to wear it. Pathetic if you ask me.

You are missing the point here completely. Hi-Viz clothing from a drivers point of view is someone working on the track and as soon as a driver sees orange they will sound the horn. There have been many rule changes regarding the usage of the train horn over the last 10 years down to noise pollution, I do not agree with the new policies but that is not the issue. Train spotters will wear hi-viz to either get the driver to sound the horn on approach or to pretend they work for the railway and relish people thinking so, both reasons are not valid and in my eyes pathetic, if anyone wearing hi-viz for these reasons when they wave at a driver the driver will most likely be thinking t055er
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I regularly see council staff wearing what appears, at first glance, to be NR Hi-Vis clothing travelling on my local trains. No one gives them a second glance, so where is the problem?

They are not standing in a train drivers view - it isn't the wearing of the hi-viz it is the location that they are wearing it.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Most railway staff look at spotters as planks and idiots even when they aren't doing anything stupid. But the 'extreme' types don't help the overall image of spotters and the more normal ones end up getting tarred with the same brush as the idiots.

Exactly - it's the same as all walks of life Bev, take football fans for instance. It is down to the genuine enthusiasts to police the idiots.

 

[Antman]

This arm gesturing and spotters wearing HiVi or even viz orange jackets just to get a blow of a train horn really need to get a life. Most railway staff look on them as planks and idiots[/QUOTE]





Well some of them might actually be railway staff!

Regardless of whether they look stupid or not I fail to see what harm they are doing engaging in a worthwhile hobby, would you rather they were spraying graffiti all over the place?

I just fail to understand this negative attitude.

 

[breadfan]

Exactly - it's the same as all walks of life Bev, take football fans for instance. It is down to the genuine enthusiasts to police the idiots.

Vigilante style? Will the enthusiasts with higher authority, i.e. the ones who are allowed to police the idiots, be allowed to wear hi-viz vests?

Seriously though, if these people are causing such a problem (and it would seem so by this thread) then surely it is better to have the BTP police the problem than having enthusiasts making even bigger fools of themselves by having shouting matches, or worse, on the platform end.

 

[starrymarkb]

Well some of them might actually be railway staff!

Deltic Matt?