Flying Scotsman

[Spamcan81]

http://www.ipswichstar.co.uk/news/f...tators_will_get_too_close_to_tracks_1_4489552

I smell a whole heap of bull manure having read that statement.

 

[ryan125hst]

Afternoon all!

Having finished university for summer, I was looking at going to York over the next couple of weeks to see Flying Scotsman. UK Steam has said that "Because of serious lineside trespass incidents, the times of trains hauled by 60103 Flying Scotsman may not be announced in advance. Please do not trespass on the railway. It is illegal and threatens the future operation of main line steam." Obviously, I appreciate this, but it is a little frustrating when planning a trip to see her given that I'll be standing on the platform at York.

I thought Realtime Trains would come to the rescue, but looking for Tuesday's tour, I can only see the path from London which is terminating at York, and a move to Holgate sidings (presumably the diesel loco?), and nothing onwards to Newcastle. The same is true in reverse for the return working. Obviously, it can be assumed that Flying Scotsman will leave with the tour shortly after it arrives from London and will arrive with the tour shortly before it departs for London later that day. However, I would prefer actual timings of course, and I am hoping to see her steam through Retford on the 19th May and it will be difficult to do this without timings.

Some people have donated money to allow her return to the mainline and we have all looked forward to her return. If my chances of seeing her have been reduced thanks to the trespassing idiots in February, I'm not going to be happy!

 

[NSEFAN]

It's quite common for timings for railtours to appear in TRUST until quite close to the running date. AFAIK the owner of realtimetrains is not censoring any workings.

 

[Bertie the bus]

York’s going to be a fun place on Tuesday then. A Flying Scotsman railtour and the unveiling of 66779 in its special livery.

Those timings aren’t for the Flying Scotsman tour. They are for the UKR tour from London – York.

If the timings aren’t released then you’ll have to do what those of us old enough to remember the pre-internet days did. Look at the tour brochure and try to work out timings from that and hope for the best. A bit of standing around won’t hurt you. RTT is a fantastic tool but we don’t have a right to timings so if they do withhold them it is something you’ll have to deal with.

 

[ryan125hst]

That makes a bit more sense then as I wondered why only the diesel hauled legs were appearing. It sounds like a good day to go if 66779 will be unveiled that day and the UKR tour will by hauled by a 86 or and 87.

As for what you said about the brochure Bertie the bus, that is a fair point. However, the tour brochure on Steam Dreams' website doesn't mention any times. It is an old one though as it's for Autumn 2015. I may have a more recent one back at home as I am still on the mailing list from when I went on a tour a couple of years ago, so maybe that has included approximate timings. It's true that we don't have a right to timings, but when every other railtour and all passenger workings are on there, it would be disappointing if they do censor it. Maybe it won't be the case though and they'll just be added last minute.

 

[Carntyne]

It's the correct decision after the pandemonium last time. Trespassers ruined it for the spotters and caused chaos for the rest of the trains running that day.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Timings aren't available internally either.

Not that I bothered as Im working Liverpool bound anyway....

 

[DarloRich]

I am not sure they are confirmed yet - if you need to be at retford add an hour to the York time and stand about - imagine you are in 1987 - no easy info and begging the local tops office for info

 

[Bertie the bus]

The times are confirmed. This is from Steam Dreams' website:

Timings and platform numbers are confirmed by Network Rail normally 5-7 days before travel. Details have been confirmed and passenger tickets have been issued with the final timings and platform numbers and sent by email and first class post.

Passengers may call the Booking Office on 01483 209888 Monday to Friday between 0900 and 1730 for the final timings if they have not received them from us 2-3 working days before travel.

In order to avoid overcrowding and incidents of trespass we have been advised not to publish recommended viewing points or the timetable of when the train will be passing through specific locations.

Steam Dreams respectfully asks that all people who wish to see Flying Scotsman do so from a permitted location and do not trespass on the railway. While we understand interest in Flying Scotsman will be extremely high, we urge those wishing to view it on its tour dates do so from a safe vantage point. It is vital that spectators do not venture onto the railway, particularly when it is on the mainline as a full timetable of regular services will be running.

 

[DasLunatic]

I am not sure they are confirmed yet - if you need to be at retford add an hour to the York time and stand about - imagine you are in 1987 - no easy info and begging the local tops office for info

Do any stations still have TOPS offices?

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Ask at the customer help desk, or station office.

 

[Comstock]

Was there ever a Flying Scotswoman? If not, why not?

 

[HLE]

Was there ever a Flying Scotswoman? If not, why not?

Because back in those days political correctness and the variety of 'isms' didn't exist.

 

[Train2Win]

Source:http://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/14478019.Flying_Scotsman_to_travel_in_secret/

Details of Flying Scotsman's journeys on the national railway network are being kept secret for safety reasons.

Neither the National Railway Museum, which owns the iconic locomotive on behalf of the nation, and Network Rail, responsible for the railway infrastructure, will say where and when she will be.

British Transport Police have warned they are prepared to prosecute anyone who goes on the railway tracks to get a better view of her.

The decision to withhold her timetable from the public follows scenes on her return to the main line in February after a ten-year refit when people including young children risked their lives by standing on the railway line to get a better view.


Every train on the East Coast Main Line, including Flying Scotsman's, had to be stopped while the tracks were cleared, leading to 59 trains suffering more than eight hours of delays and passengers receiving nearly £60,000 in compensation from the taxpayer.

Flying Scotsman has a busy schedule of visits to different steam railways across the country and will need to use the national network to reach them as well as pulling her own services.

Jim Lowe, head of operations at the National Railway Museum, said: "It is vital that spectators do not venture onto the railway, particularly when it is on the mainline as a full timetable of regular services will be running. In order to avoid overcrowding and incidents of trespass neither ourselves nor our partners will be publishing recommended viewing points or the timetable of when the train will be passing through specific locations – this includes positioning moves.

“We wish those who are taking journeys on trains hauled by the steam icon or going to see it at an event over the coming months an enjoyable experience.”

Phil Hufton, Network Rail managing director England and Wales, said: “I cannot stress enough how dangerous it is to go onto the railway without any formal training and without permission, as well as being illegal.


"I am urging those who plan to enjoy seeing Flying Scotsman in the coming days to do so from a safe position and do not go onto the railway under any circumstances. I’d like to thank those who have observed safe practices during the Scotsman’s runs so far and ask others to follow that example.”

The only details released about Flying Scotsman's next journeys are that she will travel from York and Newcastle and back sometime on Tuesday and from York to Edinburgh sometime on Saturday.

Does anybody think this is a little extreme or the right to do for everyone's own safety ?

 

[Carntyne]

I've said in another post on here that it's absolutely the correct decision after the chaos caused on the inaugural run and the outrageous amount of trespass.

The people who need to know have the timings and that's all that matters.

 

[Desiro Boy]

Does anybody think this is a little extreme or the right to do for everyone's own safety ?

Correct decision.If people are going to behave stupidly then obviously they cannot be trusted.

 

[AM9]

But surely many of those trespassing would be spotters who would know how to deduce passing times anyway.

 

[Harbornite]

It's a pity that the BTP didn't prosecute anyone last time, despite the photographic evidence of trespass.

 

[Y961 XBU]

Will the Paths still appear on Real Time Trains?

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Just because they are spotters doesn't make it any less an offence or indeed a personal risk. Quite frankly spotters really SHOULD know better. The fact is some of the use this attitude to justify their behaviour and put themselves in a position where they know they shouldn't be.

However in spotters defence, many of the people who were on the lines that day were casual gazers, far more dangerous as they DON'T know how the railway runs and don't understand what is right and wrong in the same way a spotter does

 

[causton]

Will the Paths still appear on Real Time Trains?

If they do then that will be a massive waste of everyone's time as I'm sure they know a lot of the people will have been using that website to find out!

With any luck it will be the same as the Royal Train, which does not show up on Real Time Trains and details are passed securely to only those who need to know AFAIK.

 

[driver_m]

Absolutely the correct action, and if steam gets banned because it still got flouted by idiots who just have to get that slightly better photo/video, then don't expect sympathy when you come crying on here that big bad Network Rail have took away your toy.

 

[NSE]

It's a shame, but it's the right thing to do. It's always the small minority that ruin it for the majority.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

It wasn't a small minority that brought the ECML to a stand tho. There were significant crowds, as was the overcrowding at York which delayed trains there. Colleagues of mine from TPE and VTEC couldn't despatch trains away while others were sworn at and verbally abused because their trains were in the way!

 

[LLivery]

I don't know what happened, though I can guess *sigh* However, aren't passengers going to need to know when? So how on earth will they be able keep it under raps?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Well, I can see the full timings on RTT for something later this month that is openly advertised as being for Scotsman...

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Well, I can see the full timings on RTT for something later this month that is openly advertised as being for Scotsman...

 

[NSEFAN]

I'm curious as to how the train will be logged on TRUST. Will it be a case of VSTP paths entered at the very last possible opportunity, or will moves of Flying Scotsman be treated in the same way as the Royal Train?

The biggest problem I've noticed with steam hauled tours in general is "normals" wanting to get up close and personal with the locomotive, not realising that this isn't Thomas the Tank Engine and getting too close can easily result in death. With Flying Scotsman being well known with the general public, more of these kinds of people make an effort to go and see the locomotive, creating dangerous levels of overcrowding on platforms and people straying onto the railway line.

 

[MarkyT]

I don't know what happened, though I can guess *sigh* However, aren't passengers going to need to know when? So how on earth will they be able keep it under raps?

The Steam Dreams website is hiding the booking page which is the only place the times are shown once each tour is fully booked. A tiny stupid selfish minority has spoiled a lot of enjoyment for sensible enthusiasts linesiding these tours who would never dream of trespassing and would probably want to avoid the most crowded locations to get the best photos as well. I expect there will be fewer pictures and articles appearing in the railway and general press as a result of this decision. Sad but necessary I have to conclude.

 

[Llanigraham]

Source:
Does anybody think this is a little extreme or the right to do for everyone's own safety ?

Not at all! Totally agree with it.