GBRf order another 5 66 locos

[SkinnyDave]

GBRf have posted on their Facebook page that they have ordered another 5 locos (power packs already in UK, crafty)

They must be gearing up for new contract wins with amount of new locos they have in the company

 

[XCTurbostar]

More great news, we've just agreed the build of a further 5 Class 66s. We've already purchased the power units for these and now the body shells will be constructed.
66773-777 will be delivered late 2015.

Sounds to me like GBRF are taking advantage of a little regulation loophole!

The powerunits were delivered to the docks before Christmas so it avoids the European Regulations.

Smart.

Thanks,
Ross

 

[fgwrich]

Indeed. I has been mentioned on here before, the loophole being that the emissions regulations apply to the engines (power units) themselves, and not the locos. Therefore, engines which were bought as spares, will now be shipped back to EMDs new facility to be fitted to the final 5. This is expected to include the former 66734 engine as well.

 

[alexl92]

Will these finally be the last?

 

[CosherB]

Three trips across the Atlantic for the engines before the 'complete' loco finally lands in the UK ...... all in the name of emissions regulations. The world has gone truly mad ..... but fair play to GBRf for the lateral thinking!

 

[Emblematic]

All in the name of circumventing emissions regulations, to be accurate. Talking of which, I assume that the second batch of 68s that DRS have on order will have to be Stage IIIB compliant? Or have more engines been shipped in before the deadline without us noticing?

 

[AM9]

With all this exploiting a loophole, we can expect that it will have been noted and it will be closed before the next deadline for compliance.

 

[fgwrich]

With all this exploiting a loophole, we can expect that it will have been noted and it will be closed before the next deadline for compliance.

Quite probably. I almost wonder who owns the power unit from the DB Stobart 66 which is expected to be scrapped, and whether GB could get a new engine out of that.

It certainly is one very clever way around the loophole and fair play to GBRf for being able to exploit it.

 

[cj_1985]

Indeed. I has been mentioned on here before, the loophole being that the emissions regulations apply to the engines (power units) themselves, and not the locos. Therefore, engines which were bought as spares, will now be shipped back to EMDs new facility to be fitted to the final 5. This is expected to include the former 66734 engine as well.

I thought that the engine from 66734 and the engine from the written off ERS/MRCE 66 were separate from the purchase of the last 5x 710 engines that should be used in the latest/new batch of 66s

 

[Techniquest]

More 66s?! When will it end? The way they're going GBRf will have more than DBS!

 

[37038]

It ends now on the new build front. No possible way of getting any more new build locos seeing as they could only squeeze in 3 new build PUs before the end of 2014.

As stated, the other two PUs are from 66734 and a European crash victim. Of course they can still pinch Euro locos if needs be.

Somehow with 76 locos, they're still a way off 250...

 

[CosherB]

It ends now on the new build front. No possible way of getting any more new build locos seeing as they could only squeeze in 3 new build PUs before the end of 2014.

As stated, the other two PUs are from 66734 and a European crash victim. Of course they can still pinch Euro locos if needs be.

Somehow with 76 locos, they're still a way of 250...

and the 130 of Freightliner .....

 

[Techniquest]

I know they're actually nowhere near DBS' numbers of 66s, that comment wasn't meant to be taken seriously!

Wouldn't surprise me if Europe's 66s get raided again soon enough, although I do recognise it's a good sign for GBRf if they need to keep expanding their fleet!

 

[fishquinn]

Oh not more! They already have 72 of the darn things.

 

[sprinterguy]

Somehow with 76 locos, they're still a way of 250...

As a new entrant railfreight operator that I can recall having a fleet totalling 14 locomotives, they have certainly come on leaps and bounds to now operate 72 (soon to be 77) class 66s, the 73s and 92s, and various bits of hired traction.

 

[alexl92]

I'm completely fed up of seeing 66s everywhere (though I do realise the part they've played in helping maintain and expand the railfreight market in the UK) and do not want to see any more of these rail cockroaches but at the same time I kinda do want to see if we can get one numbered 66666

 

[themiller]

All in the name of circumventing emissions regulations, to be accurate. Talking of which, I assume that the second batch of 68s that DRS have on order will have to be Stage IIIB compliant? Or have more engines been shipped in before the deadline without us noticing?

Since these are EU regulations, the power unit should only need to be within the EU therefore, as long as they are within the EU, they should be in compliance.

 

[HSTfan!!!]

There was rumour that EMD were going to trial a CAT powerplant if any further interest came about in the future.

 

[SkinnyDave]

Do GBRf New locos have different cab designs based on previous complaints from drivers and Aslef

 

[HSTfan!!!]

Do GBRf New locos have different cab designs based on previous complaints from drivers and Aslef

if you mean are they different to the original cab then yes, they have a wrap around cab similar to the european loco's. They also have improved sound proofing.

 

[paulclass43]

All in the name of circumventing emissions regulations, to be accurate. Talking of which, I assume that the second batch of 68s that DRS have on order will have to be Stage IIIB compliant? Or have more engines been shipped in before the deadline without us noticing?

Unfortunately this issue has already been resolved. Vossloh have already said that in order to fit a compliant engine (which CAT expects to have within a year), would require a full redesign internally and externally in order to fit the new filter equipment. It's been deemed cost prohibitive to do it. And the Class 68 design is basically defunct before its really started. All thanks to the EU. Bring on the referendum and let's get the hell out.

If anyone knows if these are already spare engines in Valencia to allow a similar tactic to gbrf then let me know as I love the 68's (Milkfloats).

PS second batch are Stage 3a only so their engines must already be in the EU.

 

[Techniquest]

Why on Earth do you call 68s 'Milkfloats'?!

 

[SkinnyDave]

Why on Earth do you call 68s 'Milkfloats'?!

I have heard drivers call them turtles lol and weirdly I can see that

 

[Techniquest]

Why on Earth do you call 68s 'Milkfloats'?!

I have heard drivers call them turtles lol and weirdly I can see that

I can't yet see either nickname becoming widely used personally, I guess we'll find out soon what everyone uses!

 

[159220]

Unfortunately this issue has already been resolved. Vossloh have already said that in order to fit a compliant engine (which CAT expects to have within a year), would require a full redesign internally and externally in order to fit the new filter equipment. It's been deemed cost prohibitive to do it. And the Class 68 design is basically defunct before its really started. All thanks to the EU. Bring on the referendum and let's get the hell out.

If anyone knows if these are already spare engines in Valencia to allow a similar tactic to gbrf then let me know as I love the 68's (Milkfloats).

PS second batch are Stage 3a only so their engines must already be in the EU.

That's odd. I heard from reports made by Vossloh and Beacon Rail during Innotrans 2014 that if a buyer/operator wanted more 68's, it would be possible to fit IIIb engines too and the relevant CAT engine is already available.

There was also a very interesting two part feature in Rail Magazine last year about IIIb compliance, quoting many figures that it is more to with the industries "why change" attitude rather than the actual engineering possibilities.

But lets be honest here, with electrification planned during CP5 and I would suspect a lot more in CP6 onwards, why buy more diesel only locos. This is where DRS have been highly innovative in ordering the Class 88 with IIIb compliance, which can also accommodate stage IV if needed, but either way take advantage of the ever increasing - highly efficient and environmental sound - electric traction option.

 

[DownSouth]

There was rumour that EMD were going to trial a CAT powerplant if any further interest came about in the future.

FYI, EMD is Caterpillar these days, having been purchased in 2010 by Progress Rail which is a division of Caterpillar.

There is no possibility of any older EMD two-stroke designs being updated to meet Tier IV emissions standards, and so future Progress Rail locomotives will need to use Caterpillar four-stroke engines instead. Unfortunately the flat-footedness of Progress Rail could completely kill them as a locomotive manufacturer, because GE are well ahead of them and now have a Tier IV version of the GE Evolution Series loco.

Lots of the old EMD-designed 645 and 710 engines are still being built, for export markets where the EPA/EU emissions standards do not apply. The same applies to GE, which still sells plenty of 7FDL engines to companies like United-Goninan Rail in Australia which cannot use the GEVO engine in new mainline locos because of height restrictions.

 

[HSTEd]

The 645 and 710 engines are bulletproof - CAT still has a long way to go to gain that kind of reputation, and GE will likely have crushed them before then.

 

[D6975]

GBRf have posted on their Facebook page that they have ordered another 5 locos (power packs already in UK, crafty)

They must be gearing up for new contract wins with amount of new locos they have in the company

Try to keep up that man...
This isn't news, I posted it way back in December.



http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=102759&page=3


The 2 european ones I mention at the end have turned out to be the block from 734 and a demic one on the continent.

 

[fgwrich]

Try to keep up that man...
This isn't news, I posted it way back in December.



http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=102759&page=3


The 2 european ones I mention at the end have turned out to be the block from 734 and a demic one on the continent.

That's the link to the thread I was talking about - Thanks. Remember it being talked about and happening in December, but this week seems to have been the week when it was all publically announced.

 

[DownSouth]

The 645 and 710 engines are bulletproof - CAT still has a long way to go to gain that kind of reputation, and GE will likely have crushed them before then.

Caterpillar has been building diesel engines (including for use in rail) for many decades, they already have a good reputation in the field.

Their problems with the North American rail market are that they need their Progress Rail division to build new locos, without which their good reputation is useless! North American industry doesn't like a monopoly, so second place behind GE is still well and truly open for someone else (the new Siemens locos with Cummins engines?) to take from CAT/Progress, just as it was in the early 1980s when the GE Dash-7 line took that second place at the expense of AlCo.