GN Class 717

[OwenB]

No Chocolates at HAT.

None at Finsbury Park at 5.41 either...

 

[Failed Unit]

None at WGC. I managed to get the 0841 Gordon Hill - Moorgate at Finsbury Park.

Very overcrowded. Much worse than I can recall it in the past. Not sure if that is down to passengers looking it out specifically.

None of the CIS working.

Struggling with signal problems. Not sure if this was 313 operated if it would be leaving behind. Be interesting if they can keep the diagrams running now.

 

[sprunt]

I got on 2J30 when it got to Hornsey - it seemed more crowded than usual but I guess that was down to people seeking it out, like I had - I got a seat at Finsbury Park anyway.

Can anyone explain the rear doors not opening at Hornsey? I assumed the SDO was going to be for doors not on platforms because the signal sighting issues meant trains had to stop before or after platform ends, but the area the staff member was directing passengers away from had doors level with it this morning.

 

[BowesRanger]

Got the 08.12 at Bowes Park.

Busy!

Think it easlily accommodated people who normally get left behind at harringay and hornsey. I got a seat at Finsbury Park, same as usual and overall very impressed

 

[Failed Unit]

I got on 2J30 when it got to Hornsey - it seemed more crowded than usual but I guess that was down to people seeking it out, like I had - I got a seat at Finsbury Park anyway.

Can anyone explain the rear doors not opening at Hornsey? I assumed the SDO was going to be for doors not on platforms because the signal sighting issues meant trains had to stop before or after platform ends, but the area the staff member was directing passengers away from had doors level with it this morning.

In normal times. I find when arriving at Finsbury Park. Ex Stevenage trains often leave people behind. ex Gordon hill trains are normally bearable. Standing but comfortable. This was really like an ex-Stevenage train level of overcrowding.

The door open buttons are a pain in the core. But passengers will get used to them.

Overall. First impression- if it was a 313 my trip in would be no worse.

 

[Mouse]

This was really like an ex-Stevenage train level of overcrowding.

Did you happen to notice the way people were standing between the seat's? I had a look down the 7:11 train this morning and noticed there was just one line of people when the train was designed to have 2 people side by side in the aisle . However my train wasn't super crowded like the later ones would have been, so curious to know of people grouped up more in the aisle as it got more crowded .

 

[Failed Unit]

Did you happen to notice the way people were standing between the seat's? I had a look down the 7:11 train this morning and noticed there was just one line of people when the train was designed to have 2 people side by side in the aisle . However my train wasn't super crowded like the later ones would have been, so curious to know of people grouped up more in the aisle as it got more crowded .

It wasn’t the optimum loading. Only 1 person in the corridor. I am sure many more could have got on if needed. Again like opening the doors at old street. Passengers need to get used to the trains. At the moment less seats but people not taking advantage of the extra room.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Did you happen to notice the way people were standing between the seat's? I had a look down the 7:11 train this morning and noticed there was just one line of people when the train was designed to have 2 people side by side in the aisle . However my train wasn't super crowded like the later ones would have been, so curious to know of people grouped up more in the aisle as it got more crowded .

I still think a LU S8-style layout would work better than the narrow 2+2 airline layout.

 

[BowesRanger]

Did you happen to notice the way people were standing between the seat's? I had a look down the 7:11 train this morning and noticed there was just one line of people when the train was designed to have 2 people side by side in the aisle . However my train wasn't super crowded like the later ones would have been, so curious to know of people grouped up more in the aisle as it got more crowded .

This was the same on my train too... Hopefully it sorts itself out as people get used to them

 

[TRAX]

Not sure if this was asked before, apologies if it has been, but I was wondering how the 717s apply the ‘three red lights at the rear’ rule for the NCL tunnel, if it has to ?

 

[choochoochoo]

Not sure if this was asked before, apologies if it has been, but I was wondering how the 717s apply the ‘three red lights at the rear’ rule for the NCL tunnel, if it has to ?

My understanding is the NCL requires minimum of 2 red lights at the rear. GTR policy says use the destination blind at red as a backup so the train would comply with this rule should one of the tail light bulbs fail.

 

[jon0844]

I'm sure that rule has been relaxed since LED lighting came in. Otherwise a number of 313s couldn't use the NCL as not only do most new drivers not change the blind, but many units have no working light for the blind.

 

[alholmes]

The 10.37 preview service from Moorgate to Gordon Hill continues to run, formed of 717003 today. Non-stopped Old Street and Essex Road. At Drayton Park, SDO kicked in and the doors in the rear carriage remained closed - despite the fact that they were in the platform.

The following service was 717005 on the 10.41 from Moorgate, so for a few minutes there was a 717 in both platforms.

 

[TRAX]

My understanding is the NCL requires minimum of 2 red lights at the rear. GTR policy says use the destination blind at red as a backup so the train would comply with this rule should one of the tail light bulbs fail.

Yes but what would the 3rd light be on the 717s if the rules still stands ?

 

[800001]

Isnt it

The 10.37 preview service from Moorgate to Gordon Hill continues to run, formed of 717003 today. Non-stopped Old Street and Essex Road. At Drayton Park, SDO kicked in and the doors in the rear carriage remained closed - despite the fact that they were in the platform.

The following service was 717005 on the 10.41 from Moorgate, so for a few minutes there was a 717 in both platforms.

the case

The 10.37 preview service from Moorgate to Gordon Hill continues to run, formed of 717003 today. Non-stopped Old Street and Essex Road. At Drayton Park, SDO kicked in and the doors in the rear carriage remained closed - despite the fact that they were in the platform.

The following service was 717005 on the 10.41 from Moorgate, so for a few minutes there was a 717 in both platforms.

isnt it the case that even if the door is on the platform, there has to be a minimum distance of platform between the door and end of platform? If the space isn't big enough then selective door kicks in?

 

[choochoochoo]

Yes but what would the 3rd light be on the 717s if the rules still stands ?

]

The rule is 2 are needed. 3 is a nice-to-have backup.

But with the reliability of the LEDs, the backup is no longer required.

 

[Mouse]

Isnt it

isnt it the case that even if the door is on the platform, there has to be a minimum distance of platform between the door and end of platform? If the space isn't big enough then selective door kicks in?

That's what i believe is the case, because when talking to a GN rep he said they need a 2m variance in both directions as drivers don't all stop in exactly he same spot. So while one driver may stop in a safe area, the next train driver may stop in an area where the back doors are in an unsafe area.

I'm sure someone will have more definitive/clear information, but that's what i was told during one of the preview runs last month.

 

[sudsandsoda]

Caught the 08:57 from AAP this morning, my first 717 ride on 008 if I remember rightly. Was busier than usual, and a little warm! Noticed that people wouldn't move down enough to fill the 'bendy' gaps between cars.
Interested to know what the signal issues were that we had were on the approach to Drayton Park, it was a slow journey in and seemed too be specific to our train rather than a general signalling issue.

 

[Mikey C]

I still think a LU S8-style layout would work better than the narrow 2+2 airline layout.

When the 710s enter service on the West Anglia lines, we'll have a direct comparison between 2 neighbouring lines which used to have very similar trains (313/315) but now will have trains with different interior layouts.

 

[Glen M]

17:25 from Moorgate still due to be a 717?

 

[jon0844]

When the 710s enter service on the West Anglia lines, we'll have a direct comparison between 2 neighbouring lines which used to have very similar trains (313/315) but now will have trains with different interior layouts.

The operative word being when. The 717s have had lots of problems down to the signal sighting/positioning, and perhaps taking longer to solve than necessary, but at least the trains themselves are pretty much good to go. The 710s on the other hand may well be dogged by software issues for some time.

The service I tried out today had a very bored fitter sitting behind the cab. He'd been working since 0700 and said he hadn't had to do anything. Which I suppose is a good thing!

 

[TRAX]

]

The rule is 2 are needed. 3 is a nice-to-have backup.

But with the reliability of the LEDs, the backup is no longer required.

I see, thanks.

 

[Failed Unit]

17:25 from Moorgate still due to be a 717?

Should be 717006. Running late all day.

Never recovered from a signal failure this morning at Drayton park and an “operational incident” at Hatfield.

The other diagram is running well.

 

[Glen M]

Should be 717006. Running late all day.

Never recovered from a signal failure this morning at Drayton park and an “operational incident” at Hatfield.

The other diagram is running well.

Thanks, will try and divert my commute home for some 717 action.

 

[class387]

Got on 717006 (delayed 2V01) as planned. Very similar to a 700. Not too much else to report on from a lightly loaded 5 minute ride, but the ride is noticeably harsher than a 313 on the same track.

 

[Railperf]

Should be 717006. Running late all day.

Never recovered from a signal failure this morning at Drayton park and an “operational incident” at Hatfield.

The other diagram is running well.

Yes 717005 has been on time. I managed a return trip to Welwyn GC and Watton On Stone aboard it. It seemed to lose time on the Northern City Line. But made up most of the lost minutes North of Cuffley where there are fewer stops than usual.
Last time I checked 717006 had ommitted a few stops on the way back from Hertford North and was down to 9 late at Bowes Park heading in to Moorgate.

 

[choochoochoo]

Got on 717006 (delayed 2V01) as planned. Very similar to a 700. Not too much else to report on from a lightly loaded 5 minute ride, but the ride is noticeably harsher than a 313 on the same track.

You're not the first person I've heard today say it's a bumpier ride than the 313. Those thin 717 seat cushions aren't absorbing those shocks as well as those on a 313 ?

 

[OwenB]

Free chocolate bars at Finsbury Park this evening.

 

[class387]

You're not the first person I've heard today say it's a bumpier ride than the 313. Those thin 717 seat cushions aren't absorbing those shocks as well as those on a 313 ?

I don't think so. The 'ironing boards' are perfectly comfortable to me and the 313 doesn't exactly have deep sprung seats either. I think it's the suspension itself that's harder.

It isn't too bad (better than a 387), but also sort of disappointing that it doesn't match a 313 for ride quality.

 

[OwenB]

I don't think so. The 'ironing boards' are perfectly comfortable to me and the 313 doesn't exactly have deep sprung seats either. I think it's the suspension itself that's harder.

It isn't too bad (better than a 387), but also sort of disappointing that it doesn't match a 313 for ride quality.

I found the train broadly the same as the 700 in terms of ride. We know the seats are hard, but kinda got over it. A massive improvement over the 313s once more are rolled out.