GN Class 717

[Failed Unit]

Longitudinally across the doorway or laterally across the vestibule? (or Both?)

The 313s go across the doorway. Both might be a nice idea but I suspect it will restrict access to stuff in the ceiling.

 

[sprunt]

The extra capacity might come in handy on the 17.25 from Moorgate tonight, the 17.20's been cancelled due to Great Northern's ongoing policy of not having sufficient staff to provide the service they're contracted to provide - both are Hertford loop services so there's plenty of overlap.

 

[jellybaby]

Great post. Id suggest there is a small third category - those that currently get a seat but won't in the future, they tend to be fairly vocal.

:me waves

My morning services are still 313s so today I got a seat but I don't expect to once they switch.

 

[hwl]

The 313s go across the doorway. Both might be a nice idea but I suspect it will restrict access to stuff in the ceiling.

The door mechanism needing accessing more than anything else.

 

[Bald Rick]

first trip on a 717 today, a boxfresh 007 down the tunnel.

I particularly looked out for the ride, and didn’t think it was any worse than the 313s. However the walk through gangway meant it was much easier to see through to the next coach, which made it look like it was swaying more. Everything worked fine, CIS, PA, doors, voltage changeover. And the seats helped my bad back. A vast improvement.

 

[APUK002]

first trip on a 717 today, a boxfresh 007 down the tunnel.

I particularly looked out for the ride, and didn’t think it was any worse than the 313s. However the walk through gangway meant it was much easier to see through to the next coach, which made it look like it was swaying more. Everything worked fine, CIS, PA, doors, voltage changeover. And the seats helped my bad back. A vast improvement.

Nice! What are the 717 diagrams again,hoping to get tomorow?

 

[Class315]

Nice! What are the 717 diagrams again,hoping to get tomorow?

None, currently operate over the weekends. This should change in the next few weeks!

 

[APUK002]

None, currently operate over the weekends. This should change in the next few weeks!

Ok no problem.

 

[SteveOfTheStow]

The 717 page has been updated with details of this week's diagrams - one extra diagram starting on Monday afternoon, curiously, then the full diagram from Tuesday: https://www.greatnorthernrail.com/717trains

 

[Class315]

The 717 page has been updated with details of this week's diagrams - one extra diagram starting on Monday afternoon, curiously, then the full diagram from Tuesday: https://www.greatnorthernrail.com/717trains

Yes, I posted that carriage working a few days ago. The train is usually worked with 1 x 313 and then stables in Hornsey throughout the day it's been considered more logistical to make the traction swap for the afternoon run out and then keep it 717 henceforth.
Another 717 working is due to be introduced the following week, I've seen which one is next but will wait until it's 100% confirmed.

 

[choochoochoo]

Any news on the signal repositioning down the NCL?

Didn't see anything in the STN/WON suggesting this work is happening soon.

 

[daniel1234321]

The 717 page has been updated with details of this week's diagrams - one extra diagram starting on Monday afternoon, curiously, then the full diagram from Tuesday: https://www.greatnorthernrail.com/717trains

Interestingly the FAQ bit of that 717 site now says SDO is in operation at:

• Drayton Park
• Harringay
• Hornsey
• Bowes Park
• Brookmans Park

However, whenever I've gotten a 717 all doors have opened at all stations (on the Hertford Line and into MOG, don't know about Brookmans Park), apart from one time when the last set of doors didn't open at the bay platform at GDH. The website used to say that they decided SDO wasn't necessary and that all doors would open at all stations too.

Also, every time I've ever gotten a 717 the tube status was never displayed on the PIS (and it worked every time so far), but on the site it says the trains feature:

• Live updates from London Underground available inside the train so passengers can plan onwards journeys

So not sure if the trains I've been on just haven't worked with the Underground status or if it's never worked.

 

[Failed Unit]

I have never seen the tfl status working yet.

At Brookmans park northbound the train is hanging off the rear of the platform.

I notice on all of GTRs press releases they tell you the trains can crush load with more passengers - but never mention that they have 100 less seats. (I type this will travelling on one. Complete with people in the middle seats)

 

[jon0844]

I think it's quite obvious there are fewer seats given 2+2 vs 3+2!!

I'm not sure press release ever mention negative things. That's for journalists to deal with by doing more than just reprinting it without question.

 

[Failed Unit]

I think it's quite obvious there are fewer seats given 2+2 vs 3+2!!

I'm not sure press release ever mention negative things. That's for journalists to deal with by doing more than just reprinting it without question.

You mean like the 100mph top speed our local paper stated.

Maybe they should research and quote the MTIN. Or put it in plain English reliability will drop as the trains are introduced.

 

[717001]

Interestingly the FAQ bit of that 717 site now says SDO is in operation at:

• Drayton Park
• Harringay
• Hornsey
• Bowes Park
• Brookmans Park

However, whenever I've gotten a 717 all doors have opened at all stations (on the Hertford Line and into MOG, don't know about Brookmans Park), apart from one time when the last set of doors didn't open at the bay platform at GDH. The website used to say that they decided SDO wasn't necessary and that all doors would open at all stations too.

Also, every time I've ever gotten a 717 the tube status was never displayed on the PIS (and it worked every time so far), but on the site it says the trains feature:

• Live updates from London Underground available inside the train so passengers can plan onwards journeys

So not sure if the trains I've been on just haven't worked with the Underground status or if it's never worked.

SDO is certainly in operation at Drayton Park northbound - but only really noticeable if you are in the back carriage, as the info only displays there and the audio is also different there.

 

[Failed Unit]

SDO is certainly in operation at Drayton Park northbound - but only really noticeable if you are in the back carriage, as the info only displays there and the audio is also different there.

This one is odd. As the entire coach was on the platform when I sat in it.

 

[jon0844]

You mean like the 100mph top speed our local paper stated.

A good example of why you need to check before reprinting!

 

[BowesRanger]

This one is odd. As the entire coach was on the platform when I sat in it.

This is the same at Bowes Park.. Where the rear coach southbound (not checked when on a northbound) is completely locked out... Not sure why they feel the need for that at BOP

 

[Class315]

Any news on the signal repositioning down the NCL?

Didn't see anything in the STN/WON suggesting this work is happening soon.

Dependent on who you talk to signals are to be moved over the Easter period, but like yourself there is nothing in any publications which makes me quite dubious that any work will be undertaken.

This one is odd. As the entire coach was on the platform when I sat in it.

Dependent on how the driver sights the SDO5 marker affixed to K361, the rear set of doors are aligned with the stairs thus making it tight. I cannot see the starter signal being moved with the AC crossover and power equipment just north of the station.

 

[Ethano92]

Dependent on how the driver sights the SDO5 marker affixed to K361, the rear set of doors are aligned with the stairs thus making it tight. I cannot see the starter signal being moved with the AC

But why not just the last set of doors, why are whole coaches being locked out. Is the train not able to only lock out a set of doors rather than the whole coach?

 

[APUK002]

But why not just the last set of doors, why are whole coaches being locked out. Is the train not able to only lock out a set of doors rather than the whole coach?

Thought the 717’s used a more advanced SDO system,called ASDO-can lock each door set rather than a whole coach.

 

[daniel1234321]

This isn't really 717 related but if anyone knows why these things exist, please let me know:
-The 9 Car Stop NSE Sign that is turned the wrong way round (so you can't see it going forwards, only looking back) at the northbound platform at Bowes Park, I know BOP has longer platforms than any other Hertford Loop stop (again not sure why) but when did a 9 car train ever stop there?
-The SDO 6 markers at stops between BOP and GDH (when do trains longer than 6 carriages ever go to these stations?)
-The SDO 8 marker on platform 4 at Alexandra Palace, the platform for Hertford Loop trains

 

[daniel1234321]

Also, if anyone was wondering, 14,20 and 12 are at Ferme Park, and 16 and 08 visible at Hornsey with another two visible away from the running lines.

 

[Aictos]

This isn't really 717 related but if anyone knows why these things exist, please let me know:
-The 9 Car Stop NSE Sign that is turned the wrong way round (so you can't see it going forwards, only looking back) at the northbound platform at Bowes Park, I know BOP has longer platforms than any other Hertford Loop stop (again not sure why) but when did a 9 car train ever stop there?
-The SDO 6 markers at stops between BOP and GDH (when do trains longer than 6 carriages ever go to these stations?)
-The SDO 8 marker on platform 4 at Alexandra Palace, the platform for Hertford Loop trains

Back in the 1980s, trains for Bounds Green depot would often turn around in Platform 2 instead of using the Reversing Siding so it has happened in the past, not so much now though.

No idea.

Could it be for diverted services as Alexandra Palace is the last station that passengers can board/disembark before the ECML splits for ECML Main and ECML Hertford Loop, I know I was on a stopper on the Peterborough route once and there was a fatality at Potters Bar so the driver was instructed to tell passengers wanting stations to Welwyn Garden City to get off there for a bus as the train was going to be diverted via Hertford.

 

[swt_passenger]

Thought the 717’s used a more advanced SDO system,called ASDO-can lock each door set rather than a whole coach.

The A in ASDO only stands for “automatic”. Whether the system works to individual carriage or individual door level is a separate design issue.

 

[APUK002]

The A in ASDO only stands for “automatic”. Whether the system works to individual carriage or individual door level is a separate design issue.

Yes,700’s/717’s I think is done per door

 

[Brissle Girl]

Curious that the list of services on the Great Northern website includes the headcode. Is this something that joe public would be aware of. (I'm trying to imagine how the units would look with a headcode box on the front!)

 

[APUK002]

Curious that the list of services on the Great Northern website includes the headcode. Is this something that joe public would be aware of. (I'm trying to imagine how the units would look with a headcode box on the front!)

Guess it’s for public people who have knowledge of headcodes /tracking trains etc Trains have a virtual Id fir each trip-only visible online-not on train itself

 

[notverydeep]

Guess it’s for public people who have knowledge of headcodes /tracking trains etc Trains have a virtual Id fir each trip-only visible online-not on train itself

Indeed - online real time information sources such as Real Time Trains and Open Train Times (OTT), especially the maps on the latter may be introducing some regular travelers to the concept of individual trip IDs (what we all refer to as head codes) for the first time. I have shown the OTT map of my commute to a fair number of normal passengers, who tend to particularly appreciate the reassurance that a real world location for a train that is 'delayed' or just running late can give. Of course this means telling them that their train will appear as 2C13 (or whatever) each day. And for all those I have told, perhaps more have worked it out for themselves. While I expect it won't be appropriate for all passengers, it would not surprise me if some more official TOC or National Rail information sources didn't start to include this detail in future.