GWR Class 165/166 Turbo Diagrams

[clagmonster]

Haven't people been discouraged from going to Windsor today? The event is within the grounds of the castle to which public aren't admitted.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi.../guidance-for-the-period-of-national-mourning



The maximum level of strengthening is a 3-car 165 in any case.

They have but I wouldn't at all be surprised if people ignored that advice and went anyway.

Saw an internal memo that there would be 20 minute service today

Seems a sensible approach by the company.

 

[JN114]

Officially, no. No alterations are being done, as the strict advice from the Royal Household and GWR is do not travel to Windsor for the funeral.

In practice, and as has been eluded to upthread the 3rd train per hour has been reinstated, and the branch is in its typical 3 car weekend guise.

4 car would be a possibility with the same special arrangements put in for the Royal Wedding in 2018. It has not been deemed necessary to go that far on this occasion.

 

[REVUpminster]

Saw a 166- hurtle through Dawlish Warren centre roads yesterday as 5Z27 at 17.25. I wonder what top speed is?

My avitar is now 165134 and 165132 at Paignton after working the school run in an unusual working.

 

[FGW_DID]

Saw a 166- hurtle through Dawlish Warren centre roads yesterday as 5Z27 at 17.25. I wonder what top speed is?

My avitar is now 165134 and 165132 at Paignton after working the school run in an unusual working.

View attachment 94539

80 MPH through Dawlish Warren on the Mains. 165/166 top whack is 90 MPH.

 

[RPI]

Officially, no. No alterations are being done, as the strict advice from the Royal Household and GWR is do not travel to Windsor for the funeral.

In practice, and as has been eluded to upthread the 3rd train per hour has been reinstated, and the branch is in its typical 3 car weekend guise.

4 car would be a possibility with the same special arrangements put in for the Royal Wedding in 2018. It has not been deemed necessary to go that far on this occasion.

As you know, that was kind of what the memo was saying, kind of catch 22 situation for GWR really

 

[REVUpminster]

165128 working the training train down to Goodrington sidings today.

 

[davetheguard]

In REVUpminster's two recent Turbo pictures above -thanks by the way- I notice that 165 134 has a "D" on the front below the cab window, and 165 128 has an "E". Anyone know what these letters mean?

 

[PHILIPE]

In REVUpminster's two most recent Turbo pictures above -thanks by the way- I notice that 165 134 has a "D" on the front below the cab window, and 165 128 has an "E". Anyone know what these letters mean?

Quick identification of the vehicles for reservation purposes on the Cardiff to Portsmouth 5 Car formations.

 

[Apedlar12]

166s have A, B & C and the 2 car 165s have D & E at opposite ends as PHILIPE says for the 16x operated Cardiff to Portsmouth diagrams which have reservations available on those services.

 

[davetheguard]

Quick identification of the vehicles for reservation purposes on the Cardiff to Portsmouth 5 Car formations.

166s have A, B & C and the 2 car 165s have D & E at opposite ends as@ PHILIPE says for the 16x operated Cardiff to Portsmouth diagrams which have reservations available on those services.

Thank you both for your responses.

 

[Tommy Walters]

From the Sectional Appendix:

Polsloe Bridge - 184m
Digby & Sowton - 109m
Newcourt - 124m
Topsham - 138m (Down); 123m (Up)
Exton - 128m
Lympstone Commando - 64m
Lympstone Village - 90m
Exmouth - 119m

With 2x 150 at 80m and 2x 165 at 92m.

I imagine the problem is that you can’t do local door only opening at the two Lympstone stations because there is no inter-unit gangway like there is on the 150s. I don’t know the new lengths of the platforms at St. James’ Park though similar probably applies there.

I have a feeling the figure for Exton might not be correct here, the reason being that I've just been let off 2T20 with the unusual combination of 158769 & 150265, and I was forced to alight using a local door, which wasn't necessary at either of the Lympstone stations. The reason seemed to be that the rear cab door of the 150 was off the end of the platform at the rear of the train, and due to the fact that this unlocks when the doors are released, I suspect for safety reasons a full door release wasn't permitted. Must admit I find it a bit strange that a 158/150 combo is being used when 150221 is out running as a single unit, but oh well!

For those interested, today's Avocet turbo diagram is in the hands of blue 166211.

 

[RPI]

I have a feeling the figure for Exton might not be correct here, the reason being that I've just been let off 2T20 with the unusual combination of 158769 & 150265, and I was forced to alight using a local door, which wasn't necessary at either of the Lympstone stations. The reason seemed to be that the rear cab door of the 150 was off the end of the platform at the rear of the train, and due to the fact that this unlocks when the doors are released, I suspect for safety reasons a full door release wasn't permitted. Must admit I find it a bit strange that a 158/150 combo is being used when 150221 is out running as a single unit, but oh well!

For those interested, today's Avocet turbo diagram is in the hands of blue 166211.

Exton does have a significant section of disused platform at one end

 

[Tommy Walters]

Exton does have a significant section of disused platform at one end

That explains it. It's now so overgrown though, you barely know it's there when you're stood on the platforms.

 

[PHILIPE]

I have a feeling the figure for Exton might not be correct here, the reason being that I've just been let off 2T20 with the unusual combination of 158769 & 150265, and I was forced to alight using a local door, which wasn't necessary at either of the Lympstone stations. The reason seemed to be that the rear cab door of the 150 was off the end of the platform at the rear of the train, and due to the fact that this unlocks when the doors are released, I suspect for safety reasons a full door release wasn't permitted. Must admit I find it a bit strange that a 158/150 combo is being used when 150221 is out running as a single unit, but oh well!

For those interested, today's Avocet turbo diagram is in the hands of blue 166211.

158s are not rare on these workings even if not booked. If you took it away there would have been another single 150 as well as 150221

 

[Tommy Walters]

158s are not rare on these workings even if not booked. If you took it away there would have been another single 150 as well as 150221

For sure. Indeed a 158 on its own has been out on a diagram the past couple of weeks (not helped that 150216 has been parked in Exeter TMD all week). But said combo with the 150 is slightly less common, especially since the Turbo diagram started. I was just slightly surprised that the 150s weren't paired together and the 2 car 158 work solo, as has been the norm lately.

 

[PHILIPE]

For sure. Indeed a 158 on its own has been out on a diagram the past couple of weeks (not helped that 150216 has been parked in Exeter TMD all week). But said combo with the 150 is slightly less common, especially since the Turbo diagram started. I was just slightly surprised that the 150s weren't paired together and the 2 car 158 work solo, as has been the norm lately.

Perhaps 150216 has a problem as units do fail and could possibly be waiting parts. What difference does it make whether the 158 was on it's own or not and could have avoided shunting units about on Depot unnecessarily just to form the 2 x 150s together. The 158 that has been out on it's own has been a 3 Car one .

 

[RPI]

For sure. Indeed a 158 on its own has been out on a diagram the past couple of weeks (not helped that 150216 has been parked in Exeter TMD all week). But said combo with the 150 is slightly less common, especially since the Turbo diagram started. I was just slightly surprised that the 150s weren't paired together and the 2 car 158 work solo, as has been the norm lately.

The 2 car 158 alone would probably cause performance issues with everyone trying to pile in, with them having doors at the ends of the vehicles they are a nightmare on the Exmouth Paignton, at least paired with a 150 it can spread them out a bit

 

[Tommy Walters]

Perhaps 150216 has a problem as units do fail and could possibly be waiting parts. What difference does it make whether the 158 was on it's own or not and could have avoided shunting units about on Depot unnecessarily just to form the 2 x 150s together. The 158 that has been out on it's own has been a 3 Car one .

There was one 2 car this week. 158762 on Thursday. I assumed the 150 in Exeter TMD was in the naughty corner, just forgot to specify. Again, the only difference is the issue with having to use a local door at certain stations as a result, just a bit of unnecessary hassle. But as you say, shunting sequences may have meant the 158 had to come out with the 150.

The 2 car 158 alone would probably cause performance issues with everyone trying to pile in, with them having doors at the ends of the vehicles they are a nightmare on the Exmouth Paignton, at least paired with a 150 it can spread them out a bit

It was causing performance issues anyway! I agree that 158s are a nightmare when it's busy, so a route like the Exmouth branch is less than ideal. In the week they've actually coped surprisingly well though!

 

[REVUpminster]

There was one 2 car this week. 158762 on Thursday. I assumed the 150 in Exeter TMD was in the naughty corner, just forgot to specify. Again, the only difference is the issue with having to use a local door at certain stations as a result, just a bit of unnecessary hassle. But as you say, shunting sequences may have meant the 158 had to come out with the 150.



It was causing performance issues anyway! I agree that 158s are a nightmare when it's busy, so a route like the Exmouth branch is less than ideal. In the week they've actually coped surprisingly well though!

Saturday before covid is too busy for a 158 on Paignton- Exmouth. Has the passenger numbers crept up since non- essential shops reopened.

 

[Sporty60]

I have a feeling the figure for Exton might not be correct here, the reason being that I've just been let off 2T20 with the unusual combination of 158769 & 150265, and I was forced to alight using a local door, which wasn't necessary at either of the Lympstone stations. The reason seemed to be that the rear cab door of the 150 was off the end of the platform at the rear of the train, and due to the fact that this unlocks when the doors are released, I suspect for safety reasons a full door release wasn't permitted. Must admit I find it a bit strange that a 158/150 combo is being used when 150221 is out running as a single unit, but oh well!

For those interested, today's Avocet turbo diagram is in the hands of blue 166211.

Is there a reason why the 143's were given the green livery even though they were scheduled to be taken out of service, ahead of 150's etc. some of which still have the blue.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Is there a reason why the 143's were given the green livery even though they were scheduled to be taken out of service, ahead of 150's etc. some of which still have the blue.

Because at the time half the 150s were due to leave GWR.

Original plans saw 769s come into traffic, 165 (3 cars) head west and replace 10 of the 150s first so these could go to northern and then the second part of the cascade saw the pacers going.

obviously in the meantime the world has moved on and GWR made a case for keeping the 150s.

 

[Sporty60]

Because at the time half the 150s were due to leave GWR.

Original plans saw 769s come into traffic, 165 (3 cars) head west and replace 10 of the 150s first so these could go to northern and then the second part of the cascade saw the pacers going.

obviously in the meantime the world has moved on and GWR made a case for keeping the 150s.

Ah, thanks for clarifying.

 

[davetheguard]

Is there a reason why the 143's were given the green livery even though they were scheduled to be taken out of service, ahead of 150's etc. some of which still have the blue.

I don't know if this is the case, but could it be something to do with the conditions of the lease? Don't forget the trains aren't generally owned by the TOC (train operating company) but by train stock leasing companies; the lease may specify that the trains are repainted every "x" years. Perhaps the 143s were due, but some of the 150s weren't?

 

[Tommy Walters]

Is there a reason why the 143's were given the green livery even though they were scheduled to be taken out of service, ahead of 150's etc. some of which still have the blue.

Only 2 150s are still blue, 150219/238. Technically 150232 counts on that list too as it has the older interior.

Meanwhile all the 143s hadn't been repainted for quite some time, therefore some form of repaint did make sense. This combined with the initial plan to cascade the 150s, anyway.

 

[Jim]

There was one 2 car this week. 158762 on Thursday. I assumed the 150 in Exeter TMD was in the naughty corner, just forgot to specify. Again, the only difference is the issue with having to use a local door at certain stations as a result, just a bit of unnecessary hassle. But as you say, shunting sequences may have meant the 158 had to come out with the 150.



It was causing performance issues anyway! I agree that 158s are a nightmare when it's busy, so a route like the Exmouth branch is less than ideal. In the week they've actually coped surprisingly well though!

There just isn't enough 150s to go round.

The 3 car 158 that keeps running is purely vice a 2 car 150 to increase the capacity on the diagram, there are obviously however times this is not available as an extra as the 3 car 158s have their own commitments.

The use of 762 was still to boost capacity, as a 2 car 158 has more seats than a 2 car 150 now, although not ideal for performance they seem to have been doing alright the last few weeks down there, I guess it's because there is still a slightly lower customer number on a lot of the services.

I have a feeling the figure for Exton might not be correct here, the reason being that I've just been let off 2T20 with the unusual combination of 158769 & 150265, and I was forced to alight using a local door, which wasn't necessary at either of the Lympstone stations. The reason seemed to be that the rear cab door of the 150 was off the end of the platform at the rear of the train, and due to the fact that this unlocks when the doors are released, I suspect for safety reasons a full door release wasn't permitted. Must admit I find it a bit strange that a 158/150 combo is being used when 150221 is out running as a single unit, but oh well!

For those interested, today's Avocet turbo diagram is in the hands of blue 166211.

A 4 car formation of 150+158, instructions require local door only operation.

 

[Grecian 1998]

Is there a reason why the 143's were given the green livery even though they were scheduled to be taken out of service, ahead of 150's etc. some of which still have the blue.

Some of the 150s were also refurbished into plain blue before GWR decided to change their standard livery to green. I suspect it may be felt there wasn't much point refurbishing them again. None of the 150s are still in the local version of the dynamic lines livery.

GWR did dispense with all their 150/1s, so their fleet is almost entirely 150/2s now. Virtually all of it has 2+2 seating as well, only a few sets have 2+3, whereas the 150/1s were all 2+3.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

One thing to note about the Sectional Appendix - the platform lengths given are usually ramp to ramp, so represent the gross length of a platform but not necessarily its true operational length. Different TOCs have different standards for stopping position, minimum stand back from signals etc and they manage this data themselves internally. Obviously with Exton there are no signals but just a reminder that the SE is not the absolute authority on what is/isn’t permitted to do a full door release.

 

[Watershed]

One thing to note about the Sectional Appendix - the platform lengths given are usually ramp to ramp, so represent the gross length of a platform but not necessarily its true operational length. Different TOCs have different standards for stopping position, minimum stand back from signals etc and they manage this data themselves internally. Obviously with Exton there are no signals but just a reminder that the SE is not the absolute authority on what is/isn’t permitted to do a full door release.

Although the reverse is also true, with some platforms being used for things that the SA says "can't" happen... e.g. sending a class 150 into platform 5 at Huddersfield (which is 39m according to the SA).

 

[Tommy Walters]

Another specific 166 question. Why are the former 1st class saloons behind each driving cab currently locked and signed off, when this isn't the case with equivalent areas of the train on other units?

 

[221129]

Another specific 166 question. Why are the former 1st class saloons behind each driving cab currently locked and signed off, when this isn't the case with equivalent areas of the train on other units?

For train crew social distancing.