How does someone "start" a preserved railway?

[adamt958]

All be it not something I would be interested in doing, It has always intrigued me as to how someone would start a preserved railway, or how someone would gather interest to do it. Its a very vague question, but where would someone start?

 

[Baxenden Bank]

By falling out with an existing preserved railway, thus setting up another outfit in the same geographical area?

A number took over existing, operating railway lines - industrial, mineral or mainline. Others started as a campaign to save a threatened service (Beeching days or more recently) which, following closure of the line, then turned their efforts to re-open the line - some within a few years and before the track had been lifted, others many years after closure and with complete re-instatement required.

Nowadays, I suspect it would be a lot more difficult than in the 1960's - all the safety cases etc. requiring full-time professional staff and expensive outside advice from the outset. Also, in the past, there was a large pool of railway staff / recently ex-railway staff interested in setting up such ventures because they loved the job so brought their knowledge and experience with them.

I don't know of any statistics / research on the matter but there seems to remain a lot of links between preserved railways and the big railway (in terms of NR / TOC staff also volunteering at preserved lines).

 

[alexl92]

I suppose it usually starts with a small group of enthusiasts mulling over the idea of re-opening a closed section of line - I'd imagine many of them began with a pint in the dog and gun!

I've never been involved but from stories I've heard I think it's often a case of a few enthusiasts lamenting a section of railway that is to be closed or has been closed, realising that there's a shared enthusiasm to see services return, and then finding others who share the vision and perhaps have the resources, skills or connections to help it happen. Depending on the geography, I suppose there's also the aspect of determining whether local communities support the idea too.

 

[9K43]

After leaving the railway 7 years ago, would think you would need to have a lot of brass in your pocket.. I will write the method of working, and the drugs and alcohol policy As I spent 10 years as the HSWA for the ground staff at ews

 

[St Rollox]

Probably it helps if the site is in the middle of nowhere at this point in the story.
Rural Scotland or Wales would be a start.
Have the few locals that live there on board ie at least not hostile.
Pass it off as a tourist asset???
A few quid would also help.

 

[Qwerty133]

Win the euromillions... on a quadruple rollover... on 10 occasions

 

[Abpj17]

Family were involved in rebuilding the Swanage/Corfe Castle line and I can remember seeing the volunteers rebuilding it too.

The history/trust/management links go into some of the high level 'gathering of steam' behind the restoration

http://www.swanagerailwaytrust.org.uk/index.php/about-us

 

[The Decapod]

First, find an ailing or stalled attempt to resurrect a stretch of railway line.

Create a rival group with the same ambition for the same stretch of route, but with a much better website and Facebook page.

Think big and talk big from the outset, drawing comparisons with major railways like the SVR, GCR and NYMR.

Confront difficult issues head-on, with frequent mention of things like resorting to compulsory purchase, obtaining running powers over Network Rail and hand-to-hand fighting with members of Sustrans.

It's important to start a real project on the ground at the earliest opportunity, no matter how small. For example, if a couple of old BR concrete fence posts are discovered in the undergrowth - restore them and feature them on the website. Every little bit helps!

 

[341o2]

The Mangapps Farm railway was created from scratch on private land, does the Gartell railway fall into the same category as from memory a section of former S&D trackbed was purchased and subsquently turned into a narrow gauge line.So No 1 aquire a site

That you can encounter opposition has happened at least in the case of the former Longmoor Military railway The army proposed to close it, but David Sheppard already had his preserved locos on site and planned to turn the line from Longmoor to Liss into a steam centre. A group of locals were determined to stop this and there was the incident where Black Prince was being run back and forth to obtain some footage for the film Young Whinston

Up comes one of the protesters all tweeds and driving a mini "If you don't move that train I shall ram you!

Then ongoing finance. Yes, some railways have issued shares, but not guaranteed. The original proposal for the Mid Hants was to operate a diesel commuter service between Winchester and Alton as well as the present steam railway. Takeup of shares was disappointing, so a new issue of the seam railway only replaced this and was more successful

Then staff to run the railway

And finally, if the railway is to allow public access and train rides, then it will have to be inspected and passed as safe to do so. In the early days of preservation some societies got round this by claiming not to sell fares, but offer free rides in return for a donation to the society. Loophole now closed

 

[Wyvern]

And finally, if the railway is to allow public access and train rides, then it will have to be inspected and passed as safe to do so.

You will have to apply for a Light Railway Order, develop a safety case and a set of rule books and all the other paperwork, and wait for what used be HM Inspector of Railways to pass your venture.

 

[pne]

In the early days of preservation some societies got round this by claiming not to sell fares, but offer free rides in return for a donation to the society.

The Liskeard & Caradon Railway (a mining railway) used to carry passengers for free as well, but did charge for the transport of their hats, coats, and parcels. Their use of this particular loophole lasted until 1916

 

[Spamcan81]

You will have to apply for a Light Railway Order, develop a safety case and a set of rule books and all the other paperwork, and wait for what used be HM Inspector of Railways to pass your venture.

Hasn't the LRO been superseded by the Transport and Works Order?

 

[corin paul]

Watch "The Titfield Thunderbolt" the 1953 film.

 

[341o2]

amusing film but does have some artistic licence Inspired by the Tallyllyn, the water tower sequence was based on the Talyylyn's water tank at Pendre which was connected via a tap rather than a ballcock, so whoever was raising steam had to turn on the tap as well. One day, this was forgotten, the driver thought he could reach the next watering point at Dolgoch but ran out of water at Brynglas and buckets were borrowed from a farm to fill the loco's tanks from a stream.

The Titfield Thunderbolt originally proposed to use the Tallylyn but switched to the national network and featured an early preserved locomotivre "Lion"

and how the preservation movement has had to mature...Lelux p91 upper (2nd edition) of the first day of operation where the passengers were conveyed in wagons with no seats. No continuous brakes as well

another big problem a new preservation society would have to face is that most former trackbeds have received only minimal maintenance once closure was announced. The vast majority closed in the 60's in the wake of the Beeching report and after half a centuary of neglect structures which are safe for foot or cycle traffic would not necessarily be so for trains. Last year an overbridge at Setthorns which is on the former Brockenhurst to Ringwood branch, used by the campsite over the former trackbed, now a footpath, declared unsafe and needed considerable work to render it safe again

 

[markindurham]

That you can encounter opposition has happened at least in the case of the former Longmoor Military railway The army proposed to close it, but David Sheppard already had his preserved locos on site and planned to turn the line from Longmoor to Liss into a steam centre. A group of locals were determined to stop this and there was the incident where Black Prince was being run back and forth to obtain some footage for the film Young Whinston

Up comes one of the protesters all tweeds and driving a mini "If you don't move that train I shall ram you!

I'd have loved to see that idiot go through with their threat!

That lot managed to get the railway shut down, only to end up with the M3 instead. Served them right.

 

[John Webb]

......The Titfield Thunderbolt originally proposed to use the Tallylyn but switched to the disused Basingstoke to Alton light railway, an early casulty as it was built more to keep the GWR out of Southampton rather than serve passenger needs....

May I respectfully point out that the "Titfield Thunderbolt" was mostly filmed on the Limpley Stoke-Camerton branch line in Somerset in 1952.
The Basingstoke-Alton line was used for "Oh Mr Porter" in 1936.

Regards,
John Webb

 

[MK Tom]

A key part of starting a preserved railway is making sure nobody's planning to build a motorway / housing estate / military instillation / high speed railway / radio telescope / boating lake / internment cap on the stretch of line you want to reopen.

In all seriousness, the most important part is getting other people involved. The more resources one has in terms of money and manpower, the more chances one has of getting somewhere.

 

[341o2]

May I respectfully point out that the "Titfield Thunderbolt" was mostly filmed on the Limpley Stoke-Camerton branch line in Somerset in 1952.
The Basingstoke-Alton line was used for "Oh Mr Porter" in 1936.

Regards,
John Webb

thanks for pointing that out. Having one of those CRAFT moments (can't remember a -------- thing

 

[DarloRich]

speak to the Wensleydale Railway - they should have some decent recent experience

 

[alexl92]

speak to the Wensleydale Railway - they should have some decent recent experience

Not wanting to discredit them in any way but they had the advantage of support from the MOD to keep the line open/serviceable, which (if I understand correctly) was a great boost in the early days.

But as I say, a great group and a great railway with fantastic potential, and I'm sure they could still offer a huge amount to anyone looking to do similar.

 

[PFX]

In my experience, best leave the creation of a preserved line to the armchair enthusiasts. They seem to know how best such a venture should be operated. ; )

 

[Tiny Tim]

If you want to restore a railway it would probably be best to avoid being too close to an existing heritage line. If, for instance, you wanted to rebuild a narrow gauge railway in North Wales, a well-established railway company nearby might not welcome the competition. They might even take you to court to gain control of the project for themselves. Hypothetically speaking, that is.

 

[A0wen]

I'd have loved to see that idiot go through with their threat!

That lot managed to get the railway shut down, only to end up with the M3 instead. Served them right.

To be fair, some of the enthusiast's groups hardly cover themselves with glory. The "South Midland Railway" which wanted to resurrect the Dunstable - Luton line springs to mind.

ISTR it took over the sidings in Dunstable, dumped some decrepit rolling stock there and then unlocked the gates which linked it to the branch (which at the time was still part of the national network) and ran a diesel shunter onto it from the sidings, in contravention of any rights they had. Unsurprisingly the scheme died a death not long after.

 

[Phantom404]

The first stage is to ensure that the land is available. Once an outline agreement for lease or purchase then the little matter of planning permission has to be looked into.

Then, if you get that far, it's time to start winning the locals over. I took part in attempting to start up a site where the platform and much of the original buildings (except platform buildings) were reasonably intact. Unfortunately while many of the locals were for it, those living close to it objected sufficiently for us to realise that we weren't going to get anywhere.

After that you need to assess if you need a Transport and works act (Light Railway Order is now a part of history) Either way communication with the ORR and HMRI (Now part of the HSE) will be crucial.

 

[Bedpan]

I'd have loved to see that idiot go through with their threat!

That lot managed to get the railway shut down, only to end up with the M3 instead. Served them right.

The A3 - I didn't realise till now that it actually goes right down the side of Longmoor Camp. Does it follow the trackbed at all?

 

[Robert Taggart]

...how someone would start a preserved railway, or how someone would gather interest to do it....

More to the point (when you consider many of those who have) - WHY ? :eek: !

 

[Phantom404]

Why not? If an area isn't covered by a nearby existing preserved line and the possibility of sufficient track bed (including space for loco sheds and other facilities) becomes available, then indeed why not? A number of existing lines have moaned about lack of space potentially threatening the long term survival of locomotives and rolling stock. Doesn't this suggest that there is a need for additional capacity?