Hull Trains cancellations due to chronic shortage of available rolling stock

[TUC]

The trouble is that the travelling public get very used to stuff like automatic doors etc., and as has tragically been demonstrated on a HST between Bath & Bristol a few weeks ago, people genuinely do not appreciate the dangers that opening windows present.

I'd be willing to bet that, somewhere else on the UK rail network this week, some people have travelled on a HST for the first time and have managed just fine.

 

[dk1]

The trouble is that the travelling public get very used to stuff like automatic doors etc., and as has tragically been demonstrated on a HST between Bath & Bristol a few weeks ago, people genuinely do not appreciate the dangers that opening windows present.

I despair at people these days. Unless it's on an app on their phones the poor snowflakes will need to ring 999 for help in getting on/off a train

 

[cactustwirly]

I despair at people these days. Unless it's on an app on their phones the poor snowflakes will need to ring 999 for help in getting on/off a train

Tbf people struggle to open HST doors, even on existing HST routes

 

[dk1]

Tbf people struggle to open HST doors, even on existing HST routes

And some on our Anglia LHCS sets & we've always had them. I shake my head in disbelief.

 

[talltim]

Tbf people struggle to open HST doors, even on existing HST routes

I do, I know how to do it but I struggle to reach the outside handle from inside (and especially push it down) because I’m too tall

 

[BrianB]

So LNER will happily accept disrupted air passengers for free but not disrupted rail passengers for free. Kind of makes a mockery of the National Rail slogan which is 'Britain's train companies working together'

 

[robbeech]

On LNER's website today. So they will happily accept disrupted air passengers for free but not disrupted rail passengers for free. Kind of makes a mockery of the National Rail slogan which is 'Britain's train companies working together'

View attachment 56945

When was the last time they accepted disrupted air passengers at any time let alone less than a week before Christmas?

How many times have Hull Trains has to call on them in the last few months alone ?

How many times has a plane from Gatwick to Edinburgh or Inverness stopped half a dozen of LNER’s trains from running due to a failure?

 

[westv]

I do, I know how to do it but I struggle to reach the outside handle from inside (and especially push it down) because I’m too tall

You must be very tall then.

 

[HullRailMan]

I imagine (but guess) this HST door issue has some health and safety reasoning behind it. The risk assessment for introducing a potentially unsafe practice would be greater than if it is already in service with that operator.

 

[HullRailMan]

When was the last time they accepted disrupted air passengers at any time let alone less than a week before Christmas?

How many times have Hull Trains has to call on them in the last few months alone ?

How many times has a plane from Gatwick to Edinburgh or Inverness stopped half a dozen of LNER’s trains from running due to a failure?

I think the point is that whosever train fails, be it HT, GC or LNER the best outcome for the rail passenger is for the industry to work together and offer a solution. The operator that accepts others tickets gets paid a substantial sum for doing so. Presumably they are not getting any revenue for carrying the air passengers today. Incidentally, if I bought a walk up fare today for potentially £200+ and found myself sat next to somebody travelling for free that wasn't even a rail passenger to begin with I would feel rather annoyed!

 

[Polarbear]

I'd be willing to bet that, somewhere else on the UK rail network this week, some people have travelled on a HST for the first time and have managed just fine.

Oh quite likely! I've managed with Mk3's since the mid 1970's with no issues, but on the other hand, there were instances back in the day with people fiddling with the doors & falling out of trains (Tamworth Triangle I think it was referred to). That got the interior handles removed & hence the reason for having to lean out to open the doors.

 

[35B]

I despair at people these days. Unless it's on an app on their phones the poor snowflakes will need to ring 999 for help in getting on/off a train

While a friend's university student son was overcarried because he'd never previously encountered slam doors on a train, and I routinely observe people struggling to work them out whenever I travel on one. Not a question of snowflakes or despairing of people, just that many people lack familiarity and slam door trains are now a minority of trains. No different to my confusion at the SVR a couple of years ago when I first used ex GWR stock.

 

[robbeech]

I think the point is that whosever train fails, be it HT, GC or LNER the best outcome for the rail passenger is for the industry to work together and offer a solution. The operator that accepts others tickets gets paid a substantial sum for doing so. Presumably they are not getting any revenue for carrying the air passengers today. Incidentally, if I bought a walk up fare today for potentially £200+ and found myself sat next to somebody travelling for free that wasn't even a rail passenger to begin with I would feel rather annoyed!

I agree people should work together. And of course that’s not limited to the railway. But when it becomes so grossly one sided it becomes massively detrimental to the passengers that are on the booked service.

Whilst I appreciate this scenarios possibility is minimised by the new electronic seat reservations the following scenario is one from experience.

The 1233 fails on a 2 track section of the ecml causing chaos to all services travelling south. The 1548 is cancelled. Passengers for the 1548 are told by HT social media team to catch the 1603 to Doncaster on Platform 4 for onwards travel by bus. The train forming the 1603 arrives late due to being stuck behind the HT and there is no time to put out seat reservations. The HT passengers for the 1548 who are already at the station go to platform 4 and take any seat. The train is then announced on platform 4 and the people who have paid for that train get on to find they have to stand. Arguments ensue and there’s nothing LNER (vtec at the time) can do. Now I’ve only witnessed this in this extremeity once but it may have happened more. Of course there are multiple reasons why seat reservations might not work so the same thing is possible today. LNER cannot afford the reputation to sink as it’s not awfully good as it is. When this becomes a daily occurrence then it gets much worse.
Taking on the passengers for a couple of flights either way once in recent history is not the same as taking in passengers for 4 services per day for months.

 

[_toommm_]

This article about HT securing use of a Great Western 125 is laughable in how both the newspaper and, worse, HT, seem to treat a 125 as a potentially dangerous innovation https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/new...ll-trains-secures-emergency-train-2346888.amp . I get the need to train on-train staff in the use of slam door stock but when Louise Cheeseman says:
'“With the slam-door stock, you can actually open the windows and stick your head out – we need to educate customers that this simply isn’t safe practice and we need to be certain that customers know exactly how to manage the new type of train we are going to be introducing.,”

New type of train? Has she realised that passengers do travel on TOCs other than Hull Trains and have used -and are still using-125 slam door stock on the ECML (including to Hull) and elsewhere?!

What's great is that the photo in the article shows a MK4 DVT and not even a HST!

 

[Polarbear]

What's great is that the photo in the article shows a MK4 DVT and not even a HST!

The British press at its usual best!

 

[DaiGog]

Accepting airline passengers is a useful marketing ploy by LNER - the passengers get to try the competition, so of course may travel by rail next time, and the company gets its name all over the media.

 

[yorksrob]

It's certainly excellent news that the HST's on its way. With regard to the door issue, HT's staff will probably need some training, but as far as passengers are concerned, it should be borne in mind that the route in question is already served by HST's.

 

[dk1]

Accepting airline passengers is a useful marketing ploy by LNER - the passengers get to try the competition, so of course may travel byrail next time, and the company gets its name all over the media.

Exactly what I was saying. Good move by LNER & something Virgin West Coast has done several times before.

 

[30907]

I think the point is that whosever train fails, be it HT, GC or LNER the best outcome for the rail passenger is for the industry to work together and offer a solution. The operator that accepts others tickets gets paid a substantial sum for doing so. Presumably they are not getting any revenue for carrying the air passengers today. Incidentally, if I bought a walk up fare today for potentially £200+ and found myself sat next to somebody travelling for free that wasn't even a rail passenger to begin with I would feel rather annoyed!

The 1848 HT was cancelled on Tuesday night. LNER were accepting on the 1906 Newark and 1933 Leeds, both trains presumably not being as busy as the 1903/1930.

 

[greyman42]

So where will this HST be maintained when it enters service?

 

[TUC]

I imagine (but guess) this HST door issue has some health and safety reasoning behind it. The risk assessment for introducing a potentially unsafe practice would be greater than if it is already in service with that operator.

Maybe, but First Group have a history of being hyper over-reactive to health and safety issues.

 

[NoOnesFool]

Oh quite likely! I've managed with Mk3's since the mid 1970's with no issues, but on the other hand, there were instances back in the day with people fiddling with the doors & falling out of trains (Tamworth Triangle I think it was referred to). That got the interior handles removed & hence the reason for having to lean out to open the doors.

https://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detai...bob-reid-intvwd-sof-we-news-footage/804928260

 

[43096]

While a friend's university student son was overcarried because he'd never previously encountered slam doors on a train, and I routinely observe people struggling to work them out whenever I travel on one. Not a question of snowflakes or despairing of people, just that many people lack familiarity and slam door trains are now a minority of trains. No different to my confusion at the SVR a couple of years ago when I first used ex GWR stock.

If they just read the instructions it’s much easier. Normals......

 

[cactustwirly]

If they just read the instructions it’s much easier. Normals......

Tbh it took me a few attempts to open HST doors when I first traveled on them (mainly because I didn't pull the handle far enough)

 

[Killingworth]

Tbh it took me a few attempts to open HST doors when I first traveled on them (mainly because I didn't pull the handle far enough)

Do they not have leather straps and studs to secure them? I used to find that really difficult back in the day, possibly travelling from Scarborough to Hull hauled by a D49 Hunt Class

 

[rjchapma]

Hull Trains being given a hard time again on twitter as it looks like another unit is out of action. Its not the 4 car unit 109? as announcements are still showing this onin service. It seems that crofton are really struggling wirh their maintenance.

 

[_toommm_]

Looks like a unit struck an object between Hull and Doncaster and it was taken out of service at Donny. How many units is that now (admittedly this isn't in their control of course)

 

[SC43090]

On Friday 28th December 2018....

The following services was cancelled

1A95 1512 Hull KX

1H06 1848 KX Beverley

Saturday 29th December 20-18

1A96 1834 Hull KX terminated at Doncaster due obstruction on the line

SC 43090

 

[rjchapma]

On Friday 28th December 2018....

The following services was cancelled

1A95 1512 Hull KX

1H06 1848 KX Beverley

Saturday 29th December 20-18

1A96 1834 Hull KX terminated at Doncaster due obstruction on the line

SC 43090

Along with

Sat 29th

1A91 05.57 Beverley - KGX
1H02 09.48 KGX - Hull
1A94 13.31 Hull - KGX
1H06 17.48 KGX - Beverley

These cancellations have no specific reason given (more trains than usual needing repair/PG)

and Sunday 30th

1H02 10.48 KGX - Hull

The 1H02 on Sunday is as a result of 1A96 on Saturday.

 

[STEVIEBOY1]

I happened to be walking through KGX Yesterday and saw the 0948 was cancelled, they were telling passengers to take the 1015 to Peterborough and change there for connections, I wondered if the Hull Train was starting from there perhaps?