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Impact of lower linespeed and level crossings on slower off the mark stock such as Class 170's

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CEN60

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As @Bald Rick Pointed out above, there are over 80 reasons to limit a line speed to what it is.

Your post gives me an idea though, how about we all list the reasons we think limit linespeed and Rick can mark us! :D Let’s see if we can get to 50?

Probably best on a separate thread. :p

I should point out that it is possible to lower the published linespeed (as per sectional appendix) and improve the journey time!!!!!! Sounds daft but is possible when linked to signalling improvements (The recent works at Forres & Elgin on the Aberdeen to Inverness Project prove this!
 
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Alfie1014

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Actually, some of the AHBs are (I think!) in line to be upgraded, but that is about risk reduction given the proposed 50% increase in service north of Stowmarket. The GEML is a good example of linespeed issues and level crossings; even if every single one was closed the linespeed would still be max 100mph. The OLE, structures, formation, power supply, signal spacing, signal sighting, staff safety arrangements and many more things all need sorting. And I’d be willing to bet it would be nigh on impossible to keep it at 125mph without tamping several times a year. Oh and the timetable wouldnt work. But other than that...

Indeed, more important is better accelerating and decelerating trains which both the new Stadlers and Aventras will deliver. Beaulieu or Chelmsford Parkway as it’s now to be called with loops with decent turnout speeds would help too if it’s ever built. Plus doing something about Kelvedon and Chitts Hill LCs, the latter frequently results in adverse aspects on the approach to Colchester in the peaks when road and rail traffic is heavy.
 

hexagon789

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Brill - thanks.

Is it just Sprinters that are 40 then?

I'm sure something is 40! :P

The figures I have are
75mph Class 150/153/155/156 (T211r):
Change Up to Fluid Coupling - 45mph
Change Down to Torque Convertor - 35mph

90mph Class 158/159 (T211rz):
Up - 57mph
Down - 52mph

100mph Class 168/170/171 (T211rzze):
Up - 70mph
Down - 66mph
 

superkev

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The figures I have are
75mph Class 150/153/155/156 (T211r):
Change Up to Fluid Coupling - 45mph
Change Down to Torque Convertor - 35mph

90mph Class 158/159 (T211rz):
Up - 57mph
Down - 52mph

100mph Class 168/170/171 (T211rzze):
Up - 70mph
Down - 66mph
Interesting thanks. Do you have the figures for the 175, 180, 185s. I believe at least the 185 has 3 speeds.
K
 

hexagon789

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Interesting thanks. Do you have the figures for the 175, 180, 185s. I believe at least the 185 has 3 speeds.
K

Don't have for a 180, and only have rough for 175/185.

A 175 changes to the fluid coupling at 60mph.

A 185 changes at 55mph and again at 80mph.

I don't have the down-change speeds for either though.

Both 180 and 185 use a three-stage transmission:

Convertor-Coupling-Coupling
 

Bald Rick

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Quite right. There were a number of level crossings between Harrogate and Northallerton. As part of the reinstatement process new bridges have had to be designed where once there were crossings. Some over and some under. This has helped to straighten roads at the benefit of County and at other places the rail route has had to be slewed off line to provide room for a bridge where it runs tight with a road such as A61 at Wormald Green.

I was told that a bridge is no more expensive than a CCTV controlled full barrier crossing nowadays as both are about one million pounds.

I’m afraid you’ve been told wrong. Very wrong. A new CCTV crossing is about £3m. However annual running costs are in the high tens of thousands, going well into the hundreds of thousands when you include the share of signaller costs and delay costs.

A new overbridge (in open country, simple topography and geology, 2 lane road over 2 line railway, no utilities or land purchase difficulties, delivered through planning permission rather than needing a TWO or similar) is about £10m. But negligible annual costs (essentially inspection). Rather surprised your designers haven’t told you this.


If the curvature allows, what is needed to raise linespeed from 60 to 70 or 75mph on concrete sleepers with cwr and deep ballast. The line has just been resignalled so I assume spacing and sighting has been adjusted for higher speed eventually?

Firstly, you can never assume that signals have been spaced and sighted for a higher speed. But to answer the question, all the other 80 odd factors would need to be checked (except those that aren’t applicable, e.g. relating to electrification). A particular area of attention would be what’s under the ballast, eg formation, embankments, bridges and culverts; another would be level crossings: strike in times, sighting, risk score, crossing surface, etc.

As @Bald Rick Pointed out above, there are over 80 reasons to limit a line speed to what it is.

Your post gives me an idea though, how about we all list the reasons we think limit linespeed and Rick can mark us! :D Let’s see if we can get to 50?

Probably best on a separate thread. :p

I’ll have to dig out the standard...
 
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