Isle of Man buses and coaches.

[upasalmon]

Its a shocker to realise that Tours Isle of Man has only ten vehicles (there are only two Isle Of Man Steam Packet ferries, albeit roll on roll off vessels of greater tonnage than the past). On a YouTube video dated 2016 I saw two mainland coaches on Douglas prom which would have come over on one of the two ro-ros . This explains why Tours has lost business . However with COVID 19 these mainland coaches can't bring non IOM residents to the island so Tours might have had a slightly better year but would only be carrying islanders . So when this virus is vanquished mainland coaches will be returning. Its a double edged sword sadly.

 

[GusB]

Er...maybe they only run enough vehicles as is necessary?

 

[Tetchytyke]

How many coaches do you think are needed on an island which is 30 miles long and 10 miles wide? Bear in mind there's none of the schools work here because that is all done by Bus Vannin (King William's excepted).

Some coaches do make it from across, it depends on the nature of the tour, some tour companies prefer their own bus rather than bringing everyone over as foot passengers.

 

[upasalmon]

I was comparing today with the 1970s when there was more coaches on the island, but of course there were more tourists then and the ferries couldn't take buses/coaches without a crane. The Tours Isle of Man coaches had plates with the name of the mainland operator on. Just emphasising the difference between the past and now, with of course the added complication of the COVID related visitor ban .

 

[Arriva Fan]

I was comparing today with the 1970s when there was more coaches on the island, but of course there were more tourists then and the ferries couldn't take buses/coaches without a crane. The Tours Isle of Man coaches had plates with the name of the mainland operator on. Just emphasising the difference between the past and now, with of course the added complication of the COVID related visitor ban .

Where is the Mainland? Because it certainly isn't britain.

 

[upasalmon]

RIBBLE or MIDLAND RED hired Isle Of Man Tours group coaches for the IOM leg of their operations.

 

[507021]

Its a shocker to realise that Tours Isle of Man has only ten vehicles (there are only two Isle Of Man Steam Packet ferries, albeit roll on roll off vessels of greater tonnage than the past). On a YouTube video dated 2016 I saw two mainland coaches on Douglas prom which would have come over on one of the two ro-ros . This explains why Tours has lost business . However with COVID 19 these mainland coaches can't bring non IOM residents to the island so Tours might have had a slightly better year but would only be carrying islanders . So when this virus is vanquished mainland coaches will be returning. Its a double edged sword sadly.

The size of Tours Isle of Man's fleet is absolutely fine for the level of work they have. Around a decade ago, the fleet consisted of over twenty coaches of various lengths in addition to eight minibuses, which was far too many vehicles.

Also, to be pedantic, the Steam Packet hasn't got any RO-RO ferries. Ben-my-Chree is a RO-PAX and Manannan is a high speed catamaran.

 

[upasalmon]

Roll on roll off as opposed to side loading. If I was going to go to details I would have added MV and HSC to the names. Anything that can carry freight, buses and cars using a link span is a roll on roll off in my book. Jersey has a larger coach operator than the IOM. And as for the mainland I should have said British (or Irish) mainland. I've said my piece now!

 

[David Verity]

RIBBLE or MIDLAND RED hired Isle Of Man Tours group coaches for the IOM leg of their operations.

While Sheffield United based a coach on the Island each year and took out a Manx registration for the duration.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Jersey has a larger coach operator than the IOM.

Jersey has a larger tourist industry than the Isle of Man.

I'm not really quite sure what your point is, that Tours should have more buses (even though there's no need) or that you are surprised that the private coaching market on an island of 83,000 people is quite limited?

And as for the mainland I should have said British (or Irish) mainland.

The UK is many things, but it sure as hell is not the mainland!

 

[507021]

Jersey has a larger tourist industry than the Isle of Man.

I'm not really quite sure what your point is, that Tours should have more buses (even though there's no need) or that you are surprised that the private coaching market on an island of 83,000 people is quite limited?



The UK is many things, but it sure as hell is not the mainland!

Beat me to it, absolutely spot on.

Back in 2012 when Tours was relaunched, the company downsized (and upgraded) its fleet to something which was more suitable for the level of demand, because they had many more vehicles than they actually needed, many of which were barely used. I also don't see the point in coach operators from across paying Tours to hire a coach when it's cheaper, and far more convenient for their passengers, to just use one of their own. The mind boggles!

 

[Tetchytyke]

I also don't see the point in coach operators from across paying Tours to hire a coach when it's cheaper, and far more convenient for their passengers, to just use one of their own.

Indeed. You drive a UK coach onto the Ben, all their luggage stays safely in the hold, and you drive it off again in Douglas. Likewise for touring from the Isle of Man, as far as I'm aware Tours use their own coaches in the UK rather than hiring another coach.

Outside the TT (which is not really coaching territory), tourism on the Isle of Man is limited these days. And, unlike with most other private coaching companies, there isn't much of a schools market on the Isle of Man because Bus Vannin do it all for the state-run schools.

As for the "mainland", you know that if you call the UK that here then the Mooinjer Veggey will get you

(On that subject, can I say just how much I love the fact that the auto-announcer is set up to say hello to the little people when the bus goes past Fairy Bridge!)

 

[507021]

Likewise for touring from the Isle of Man, as far as I'm aware Tours use their own coaches in the UK rather than hiring another coach.

They do.

Outside the TT (which is not really coaching territory), tourism on the Isle of Man is limited these days.

Very much so. The sad fact is there's not very much for tourists to do on the island, so once they've been once, they're not likely to visit again any time soon.

As for the "mainland", you know that if you call the UK that here then the Mooinjer Veggey will get you

That was one of the first things I was told when I moved over, funnily enough!

 

[Tetchytyke]

The sad fact is there's not very much for tourists to do on the island, so once they've been once, they're not likely to visit again any time soon.

I wouldn't be that negative about the place, I really like it here, but I do know what you mean. There aren't the chocolate box villages like you get in the Lake District or the Cotswolds, there isn't the sunshine (or the Duty Free) like you get in the Channel Islands. There are some outdoor sports facilities, there's the Isle of Man Railway and the Manx Electric Railway which don't get boring, there's Snaefell and there's the Laxey wheel. But much as Peel beach is lovely in the sunshine with an ice cream from Davisons, and you can get a cracking coffee from the Shed on Laxey prom, I'm not quite sure it's going to keep bringing the tourists back.

The hotels certainly won't. The Comis is corporate blandness. As for the hotels on Douglas prom, I believe the term is "faded".

 

[upasalmon]

Before the moderator calls time on this topic I will describe outside the IOM as "off -island", or EWS and Ireland (both parts). I am surprised that Tours has only 10 vehicles but I know the IOM has lost tourists since the 1980s due to high ferry fares, recession in the IOM s hinterland, and warmer climates being cheaper to get to . And as I stated earlier pre COVID coaches were allowed from "off-island" so Tours IOM has lost business. I have answered the criticisms and as Zebedee said 'Time For Bed!

 

[507021]

I wouldn't be that negative about the place, I really like it here, but I do know what you mean. There aren't the chocolate box villages like you get in the Lake District or the Cotswolds, there isn't the sunshine (or the Duty Free) like you get in the Channel Islands. There are some outdoor sports facilities, there's the Isle of Man Railway and the Manx Electric Railway which don't get boring, there's Snaefell and there's the Laxey wheel. But much as Peel beach is lovely in the sunshine with an ice cream from Davisons, and you can get a cracking coffee from the Shed on Laxey prom, I'm not quite sure it's going to keep bringing the tourists back.

The hotels certainly won't. The Comis is corporate blandness. As for the hotels on Douglas prom, I believe the term is "faded".

It's a lovely place I agree, but I found many of the main tourist attractions got boring after a while.

The heritage transport network could play a part in tourists visiting regularly if it was actually advertised to a wider market. It's well advertised on the island, but over here, I barely see anything at all.

I am surprised that Tours has only 10 vehicles but I know the IOM has lost tourists since the 1980s due to high ferry fares,

Tourism actually began to decline in the 1970s, and this was because package holidays to places like Spain were seen as more appealing.

And as I stated earlier pre COVID coaches were allowed from "off-island" so Tours IOM has lost business.

And when the borders (eventually) reopen, coaches will be allowed to leave the island again.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The heritage transport network could play a part in tourists visiting regularly if it was actually advertised to a wider market. It's well advertised on the island, but over here, I barely see anything at all.

Definitely. There's 40 miles or so of heritage railways and they're run professionally by the government. Not to mention the volunteer-run railways at Groudle Glen and Laxey.

Nationalised steam trains should be a gricer's paradise but they never seem to get mentioned in the UK. Shame as I'm led to believe the dining car train is a wonderful experience. I've not had the pleasure yet.

For us locals a season pass at £75 is exceptional value.

It's a lovely place I agree, but I found many of the main tourist attractions got boring after a while.

Yeah, I do know what you mean. The museums are well run but small- very small- and there's only so many times you can watch Lady Isabella keep turning turning turning (she's now broken again).

I love walking or cycling in the plantations but I'm not sure I'd come to do it as a holiday.

 

[507021]

Shame as I'm led to believe the dining car train is a wonderful experience. I've not had the pleasure yet.

The dining train is excellent, I'd fully recommend it.

With the gap between delivery and entry to service getting longer by the day, I can't help but feel it might have been an idea to borrow a StreetDeck from another operator and use that for familiarisation ahead of their arrival. A similar arrangement happened in 2012, when Lothian's SN11 EEM was loaned to Bus Vannin for evaluation purposes.

The first StreetDecks have been on the island for nearly two months now!

 

[upasalmon]

The roots of the IOM tourism decline starts with two events in 1973. The Summerland fire disaster which my family and I witnessed from Douglas Head. This facility answered the ? of dull and wet days but in ten minutes it burned down with the loss of 50+ lives. This drew light on the IOMs inadequate fire regulations.

The next event was a Middle East war which led to oil prices quadrupling This oil price hike hit EVERY ASPECT of Manx life, the IOM Steam Packet caught out with a fleet of expensive turbine steamers, the two bus operators which forced their 1976 merger*

, the Tours fleet with petrol engined Bedford SB3/VAM3s which had to be phased out in favour of diesels. Steamer fares rocketed and the NW of England suffered major job losses . Can I point out on ANY small island is limited in attractions . I accept that tourism is not a relevant topic but only where it impacts on railways and buses.
* First mooted in 1966.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The first StreetDecks have been on the island for nearly two months now!

How much time does it take to familiarise yourself with a bus? Genuine question; I know it's more complicated than just climbing in and turning the steering wheel, but I'm surprised it's taking so long. Are the unions dragging their heels in their long-running dispute with Ian Longworth?

 

[507021]

How much time does it take to familiarise yourself with a bus? Genuine question; I know it's more complicated than just climbing in and turning the steering wheel, but I'm surprised it's taking so long. Are the unions dragging their heels in their long-running dispute with Ian Longworth?

Not very long at all, I don't think any of mine have ever taken more than half an hour.

I'll see if I can find out what the hold up is.

 

[philthetube]

Learn Where the fuel cut off , fire extinguisher emergency exits and first aid kit are, and how to access/operate them.

Familiarise yourself with the driving controls as you would with a car and away you go.

 

[507021]

Keep an eye out for a StreetDeck in passenger service on a bus route near you...

 

[Arriva Fan]

Keep an eye out for a StreetDeck in passenger service on a bus route near you...

301 & 302 are the first to enter Service.

 

[507021]

I recall somebody asking for an up to date Tours Isle of Man fleet list.

1 MAN-111-T (FRZ 2073); Volvo B12B/Plaxton.
2 HMN-111 (PN03 UCL); Volvo B12M/Jonckheere.
3 BMN-111 (MX03 AEG); Volvo B12M/Jonckheere.
4 75-OMN (BX62 BDE); King Long XMQ6127.
5 111-JMN (JFZ 9815); Setra S315.
6 PMN-111 (YJ08 ECT); Temsa Safari.
7 MAN-111-B (YJ57 BSV); Temsa Safari.
14 111-PMN (RX57 EDU); Irisbus Daily.
31 75-YMN (WA09 LKX); King Long XMQ6800.
57 M-111-MAN (YN07 YBV); Iveco Eurorider.

Coaches 4, 5 and 31 are currently out of service.

 

[upasalmon]

It was me. Thanks

 

[507021]

It was me. Thanks

No problem. However, just to let you know, I got the King Longs' previous registrations the wrong way round.

75-OMN was WA09 LKX and 75-YMN was BX62 BDE. My apologies.

 

[upasalmon]

Once again thanks 507021. Some of you may have heard of Quack77 who compiles fleet lists for the web . Quack77 updates his lists regularly which is quite a feat, all voluntary effort, so well done Quack77 has put a list for Tours IOM, along with one for Bus Vannin which has been on Q77s site for a while.
I have a couple of queries about BVs Ramsey and Port Erin depots. How many buses are based there? I am aware there is no FIXED allocation as the buses go to Douglas and swaps occur daily. Does BV have a breakdown lorry, or do they use outside firms? AND FINALLY is there a dedicated driver training bus?
I would be grateful CV for the above information Thanks in advance.

 

[507021]

Once again thanks 507021. Some of you may have heard of Quack77 who compiles fleet lists for the web . Quack77 updates his lists regularly which is quite a feat, all voluntary effort, so well done Quack77 has put a list for Tours IOM, along with one for Bus Vannin which has been on Q77s site for a while.
I have a couple of queries about BVs Ramsey and Port Erin depots. How many buses are based there? I am aware there is no FIXED allocation as the buses go to Douglas and swaps occur daily. Does BV have a breakdown lorry, or do they use outside firms? AND FINALLY is there a dedicated driver training bus?
I would be grateful CV for the above information Thanks in advance.

Not a problem.

When I was working there, I don't remember Port Erin or Ramsey ever having more than half a dozen buses in their respective yards. Sometimes, a spare bus would be stored inside the depot building at Ramsey, but I don't know if this is still the case now.

Bus Vannin doesn't have a recovery vehicle, nor do they have a dedicated driver training vehicle because drivers need to have a PCV licence before joining the company. However, when drivers need to do route familiarisation, then one of the older vehicles in the fleet will usually be used. I did mine on DB250s, whereas someone I know who's started there fairly recently used B9TLs for theirs.

 

[GusB]

Link to Quack77's website for anyone who is interested:

Quack77 - Fleet Lists

www.quack77.uk